Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I do not need the catalogue values as I have a 2012 Scott catalogue. I just want to make sure that I am identifying these correctly before listing them in the auction.
I am hopeless when it comes to identifying early issues :( Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated :)
Also, what does it mean when the catalogue value is in italic print for a used issue such as #52 is?
Liz
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These are two Russian stamps. The Finnish versions have dotted circles in the design.
I have no idea what the italic printing means. I thought it was to indicate that the given value is speculative and not based on actual market data. It could also be that the used stamps are worth more than unused, but only with correct cancel?
Jan-Simon
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Thanks Jan-Simon - What would I ever do without you?
I presume then they are Russia - Scott #36 - issued somewhere between 1883-88 and Scott #44 issued May 14, 1889.
I should send them back to the Finish dealer/seller who sold them to me in a mixed packet of used Finish stamps? I would, just for a laugh, except the postage to Finland would be double the catalogue value of these two stamps. LOL
LIz
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My guess would be Sc. 80 and 85.
First of all, the 14 kopek stamp has the postal horns with thunderbolts above them, meaning it cannot be #36.
Also, I can not distinguish the typical horizontal or vertical lines in the paper that 36 and 44 should have. It is difficult from a scan, but then again, these lines are pretty obvious to the eye.
Furthermore, they seem to be cancelled "13" and "15" which I presume stand for 1913 and 1915.
I think postage would be at least 10 times the value of the stamps. Catalogue value that is. Real value is even less...
Jan-Simon
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Italicized prices can mean a lot of things in Scott. But in general, it means that there is some special difficulty associated with providing that catalog value. Some of the things it can mean (including those mentioned already):
1. limited sales information to provide accurate price
2. high speculation or rapid fluctuation in price
3. (for used stamps with abnormally high used:unused price ratio) price is for genuine postally used stamp with contemporary cancel -- not CTO, post/favor canceled, fake cancels... -- see some German inflationary era stamps as examples
4. unusual limited distribution -- for example, DDR sets in which one stamp in set received limited distribution
Those are just a few off the top of my head. There are other reasons, depending on the specific stamp.
Bottom line -- it means there's some caveat to the pricing.
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It is not unusual to find these types of Russian stamps in Finnish lots. The actual Finnish stamps are usually more difficult to find. In fact, many of those Finnish issues in my collection, I actually found mistakenly placed in Russian stamp lots/collections! The collector/dealer hadn't noticed the circles/symbols that distinguished the Finnish issues from the Russian issues!
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Just to complicate matters a bit... actual Russian issues WERE used as legal stamps in Finland, so "technically speaking" these could be considered legitimate parts of a lot with Finnish stamps.
When the similar types with circles in the design (printed in Russia) ran out, stocks of the regular Russian stamps were shipped to Finland for use there. The designs without circles are known used from 1899 onwards, and only gradually disappeared with the introduction of Penni/Markka denominations in 1901.
This creates the interesting (unique?) situation in which these stamps do NOT exist as mint stamps from Finland (since they are Russian), but in some catalogues in Europe, are listed with prices as Finnish stamps, USED ONLY.
Pricing (aka "catalog value"), in general falls into four categories:
1. Discernable Finnish cancel
2. FULL and CLEAR Finnish cancel (almost SON)
3. Stamp on piece with full Finnish cancel
4. Stamp on Cover with full Finnish cancel
In the two stamps you've pictured, they are most likely Russian usages... because of the late dates (1915 and 1916) and the fact that the cancelers appear to be 100% Cyrillic script... Finnish cancels were often Western at the top and Cyrillic at the bottom.
Russian stamps used in Finland (with readable cancels) are generally pretty valuable ($10 per stamp and up) because very few are... "found"... most end up as part of cheap Russia lots/mixes and don't end up being looked at as "possibly Finnish," unless someone happens to collect both places.
Cheers,
Peter
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04:39:04am
Can anyone verify that the Scott #'s for the two stamps shown in this scan are Finland #52 (14k blue & rose) & #55 (50k violet & green) issued during the period 1891-92 (Imperial Arms of Russia)?
I do not need the catalogue values as I have a 2012 Scott catalogue. I just want to make sure that I am identifying these correctly before listing them in the auction.
I am hopeless when it comes to identifying early issues :( Any help you can give will be greatly appreciated :)
Also, what does it mean when the catalogue value is in italic print for a used issue such as #52 is?
Liz
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this post
Approvals
re: Russia in Finland stamps
These are two Russian stamps. The Finnish versions have dotted circles in the design.
I have no idea what the italic printing means. I thought it was to indicate that the given value is speculative and not based on actual market data. It could also be that the used stamps are worth more than unused, but only with correct cancel?
Jan-Simon
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this post
05:43:28am
re: Russia in Finland stamps
Thanks Jan-Simon - What would I ever do without you?
I presume then they are Russia - Scott #36 - issued somewhere between 1883-88 and Scott #44 issued May 14, 1889.
I should send them back to the Finish dealer/seller who sold them to me in a mixed packet of used Finish stamps? I would, just for a laugh, except the postage to Finland would be double the catalogue value of these two stamps. LOL
LIz
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this post
Approvals
re: Russia in Finland stamps
My guess would be Sc. 80 and 85.
First of all, the 14 kopek stamp has the postal horns with thunderbolts above them, meaning it cannot be #36.
Also, I can not distinguish the typical horizontal or vertical lines in the paper that 36 and 44 should have. It is difficult from a scan, but then again, these lines are pretty obvious to the eye.
Furthermore, they seem to be cancelled "13" and "15" which I presume stand for 1913 and 1915.
I think postage would be at least 10 times the value of the stamps. Catalogue value that is. Real value is even less...
Jan-Simon
Login to Like
this post
re: Russia in Finland stamps
Italicized prices can mean a lot of things in Scott. But in general, it means that there is some special difficulty associated with providing that catalog value. Some of the things it can mean (including those mentioned already):
1. limited sales information to provide accurate price
2. high speculation or rapid fluctuation in price
3. (for used stamps with abnormally high used:unused price ratio) price is for genuine postally used stamp with contemporary cancel -- not CTO, post/favor canceled, fake cancels... -- see some German inflationary era stamps as examples
4. unusual limited distribution -- for example, DDR sets in which one stamp in set received limited distribution
Those are just a few off the top of my head. There are other reasons, depending on the specific stamp.
Bottom line -- it means there's some caveat to the pricing.
Login to Like
this post
re: Russia in Finland stamps
It is not unusual to find these types of Russian stamps in Finnish lots. The actual Finnish stamps are usually more difficult to find. In fact, many of those Finnish issues in my collection, I actually found mistakenly placed in Russian stamp lots/collections! The collector/dealer hadn't noticed the circles/symbols that distinguished the Finnish issues from the Russian issues!
Login to Like
this post
re: Russia in Finland stamps
Just to complicate matters a bit... actual Russian issues WERE used as legal stamps in Finland, so "technically speaking" these could be considered legitimate parts of a lot with Finnish stamps.
When the similar types with circles in the design (printed in Russia) ran out, stocks of the regular Russian stamps were shipped to Finland for use there. The designs without circles are known used from 1899 onwards, and only gradually disappeared with the introduction of Penni/Markka denominations in 1901.
This creates the interesting (unique?) situation in which these stamps do NOT exist as mint stamps from Finland (since they are Russian), but in some catalogues in Europe, are listed with prices as Finnish stamps, USED ONLY.
Pricing (aka "catalog value"), in general falls into four categories:
1. Discernable Finnish cancel
2. FULL and CLEAR Finnish cancel (almost SON)
3. Stamp on piece with full Finnish cancel
4. Stamp on Cover with full Finnish cancel
In the two stamps you've pictured, they are most likely Russian usages... because of the late dates (1915 and 1916) and the fact that the cancelers appear to be 100% Cyrillic script... Finnish cancels were often Western at the top and Cyrillic at the bottom.
Russian stamps used in Finland (with readable cancels) are generally pretty valuable ($10 per stamp and up) because very few are... "found"... most end up as part of cheap Russia lots/mixes and don't end up being looked at as "possibly Finnish," unless someone happens to collect both places.
Cheers,
Peter
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