Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Note the tiny USPS microprint
Counterfeit
Note the larger, easier to read USPS microprint
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Scott 5299 Genuine
note the date is made of purple dots
normal corner die cut
Counterfeit
date is solid purple
Odd die cut at bottom left
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02:09:39pm
Please, no offence intended to anyone who collects new US material, but I'm sure glad I don't!! And, you've convinced me, I never will. There was some US material I was going to go for because of content but I think I'll pass!! Is this same type of foolishness going on in other countries. I don't really collect newer Canada material but I do pick up the postal year sets even though they are not complete. I think I am safe there, at least I hope so!
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If the above pics. are correct, I can say that the quality of counterfeits is so good that they are actually better that the genuine stamps.
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I used a scan of 600 & still could not tell the difference on the 2018 US Scott #5321-5330 Hot Wheels Sheet of 20 Forever Stamps. Only difference was It didn't have any tagging on the stamps. It's getting hard to ID the counterfeits.
Richard
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The Chinese are also counterfeiting European stamps.
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@Harvey, who said, "I don't really collect newer Canada material but I do pick up the postal year sets even though they are not complete. I think I am safe there, at least I hope so!"
Recently in another thread, I posted a comment about a specialist in Canadian forgeries who spoke to my stamp club. He is considered so expert in this field that he has been hired by the RCMP to help in investigations into forgeries. The forgeries he showed us were all recent as in six or seven years ago, and were booklets that could only be identified as forgeries because of a microscopic "error" on the booklet's cover! They were being "marketed" in convenience stores. Buyer beware! But I think that annual stamp sets would be safe.
Bob
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10:36:14pm
I do collect Canadian booklet panes but almost totally before my 1988 cutoff. Are the above mentioned counterfeit booklets new ones only or are older ones being done as well?
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@ Harvey: The forgery specialist who spoke to my stamp club only discussed Canadian booklets that Canada Post was selling at that time.
Bob
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At one time forgeries that were made for postal use rather than the philatelic trade were interesting to postal history followers when used on covers and such. Now the sheer quantities involved in the US and UK seemed to have dampened that interest.
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Potential counterfeits for Scott 5777-5783
As far as I can tell so far, the only differences appear under a microscope and involve the appearance of the date.
The date looks like these for genuine stamps:
The individual numbers are made up of dots - some darker than others. Note especially the shape of the "3"
Dates with some differences:
The middle of the "3" points upwards
The tail of the 2 and the base of the 3 are almost joined
The top of the 3 is straighter
The dots are fainter (difference shows up even without a microscope)
Wondering if anyone knows of any counterfeit examples and would be able to post a close up of the date? Really not sure which (if any) are counterfeits, but I have a lot of examples of the "normal" types and substantially fewer of the ones with obvious differences.
I imagine there is some leeway in the printing process as far as dot intensity but would think the basic shape of the numbers should remain the same for genuine stamps.
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03:43:00pm
You people who collect the later US material must have infinite patience!! No insult intended, just an observation!
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As one of "you people" who flyspecks, I must say this is rather fun. Between the monthly supply from my local phone company and the giant bag of stamps from a club member every month (from a utility company in another state), I have scads of these common stamps to inspect. For a while, I was just picking out the obvious ones that had problems that could be seen with the naked eye. But decided it was time to use my little usb microscope and see what else was slipping by the post office. It's really amazing how close some of these counterfeits are. Have lots more I could post but if it's driving people nuts, I can stop.
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05:33:05pm
"Have lots more I could post but if it's driving people nuts, I can stop."
It's not driving me nuts. I just don't think I would have the patience to do what you are doing! With all of this stuff out there how is it possible to collect new material with any confidence that it is real?
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The only way to be sure would be to purchase the stamps directly from the USPS at the actual, listed price.
I have to purchase current mint postage for use on our club newsletters, and now I keep one or two for reference. The little details like microprinting, date, font, etc... are not always spelled out by the USPS or Linn's and can only be noticed by direct comparison. It has been helpful to sort out what is right and what isn't.
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@smaier
I have genuine booklets of these stamps that exhibit all of the anomalies in the year date that you've pointed out. It can't be assumed that the date on each stamp will be exactly the same. The booklet is printed on both sides which means, at a minimum, that different plates were used to print the front and back.
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@tommcf - Thank you for that information! I appreciate your response and did not know that there could be such variability even on the same booklet panes. That is exactly the kind of information I was hoping for.
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Scott 5543 genuine
Note the tiny USPS microprint
Counterfeit
Note the larger, easier to read USPS microprint
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re: Counterfeits
Scott 5299 Genuine
note the date is made of purple dots
normal corner die cut
Counterfeit
date is solid purple
Odd die cut at bottom left
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
09 Jul 2024
02:09:39pm
re: Counterfeits
Please, no offence intended to anyone who collects new US material, but I'm sure glad I don't!! And, you've convinced me, I never will. There was some US material I was going to go for because of content but I think I'll pass!! Is this same type of foolishness going on in other countries. I don't really collect newer Canada material but I do pick up the postal year sets even though they are not complete. I think I am safe there, at least I hope so!
Login to Like
this post
re: Counterfeits
If the above pics. are correct, I can say that the quality of counterfeits is so good that they are actually better that the genuine stamps.
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Counterfeits
I used a scan of 600 & still could not tell the difference on the 2018 US Scott #5321-5330 Hot Wheels Sheet of 20 Forever Stamps. Only difference was It didn't have any tagging on the stamps. It's getting hard to ID the counterfeits.
Richard
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re: Counterfeits
The Chinese are also counterfeiting European stamps.
Login to Like
this post
re: Counterfeits
@Harvey, who said, "I don't really collect newer Canada material but I do pick up the postal year sets even though they are not complete. I think I am safe there, at least I hope so!"
Recently in another thread, I posted a comment about a specialist in Canadian forgeries who spoke to my stamp club. He is considered so expert in this field that he has been hired by the RCMP to help in investigations into forgeries. The forgeries he showed us were all recent as in six or seven years ago, and were booklets that could only be identified as forgeries because of a microscopic "error" on the booklet's cover! They were being "marketed" in convenience stores. Buyer beware! But I think that annual stamp sets would be safe.
Bob
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this post
This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
12 Jul 2024
10:36:14pm
re: Counterfeits
I do collect Canadian booklet panes but almost totally before my 1988 cutoff. Are the above mentioned counterfeit booklets new ones only or are older ones being done as well?
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Counterfeits
@ Harvey: The forgery specialist who spoke to my stamp club only discussed Canadian booklets that Canada Post was selling at that time.
Bob
Login to Like
this post
re: Counterfeits
At one time forgeries that were made for postal use rather than the philatelic trade were interesting to postal history followers when used on covers and such. Now the sheer quantities involved in the US and UK seemed to have dampened that interest.
Login to Like
this post
re: Counterfeits
Potential counterfeits for Scott 5777-5783
As far as I can tell so far, the only differences appear under a microscope and involve the appearance of the date.
The date looks like these for genuine stamps:
The individual numbers are made up of dots - some darker than others. Note especially the shape of the "3"
Dates with some differences:
The middle of the "3" points upwards
The tail of the 2 and the base of the 3 are almost joined
The top of the 3 is straighter
The dots are fainter (difference shows up even without a microscope)
Wondering if anyone knows of any counterfeit examples and would be able to post a close up of the date? Really not sure which (if any) are counterfeits, but I have a lot of examples of the "normal" types and substantially fewer of the ones with obvious differences.
I imagine there is some leeway in the printing process as far as dot intensity but would think the basic shape of the numbers should remain the same for genuine stamps.
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this post
This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
23 Jul 2024
03:43:00pm
re: Counterfeits
You people who collect the later US material must have infinite patience!! No insult intended, just an observation!
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Counterfeits
As one of "you people" who flyspecks, I must say this is rather fun. Between the monthly supply from my local phone company and the giant bag of stamps from a club member every month (from a utility company in another state), I have scads of these common stamps to inspect. For a while, I was just picking out the obvious ones that had problems that could be seen with the naked eye. But decided it was time to use my little usb microscope and see what else was slipping by the post office. It's really amazing how close some of these counterfeits are. Have lots more I could post but if it's driving people nuts, I can stop.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
23 Jul 2024
05:33:05pm
re: Counterfeits
"Have lots more I could post but if it's driving people nuts, I can stop."
It's not driving me nuts. I just don't think I would have the patience to do what you are doing! With all of this stuff out there how is it possible to collect new material with any confidence that it is real?
Login to Like
this post
re: Counterfeits
The only way to be sure would be to purchase the stamps directly from the USPS at the actual, listed price.
I have to purchase current mint postage for use on our club newsletters, and now I keep one or two for reference. The little details like microprinting, date, font, etc... are not always spelled out by the USPS or Linn's and can only be noticed by direct comparison. It has been helpful to sort out what is right and what isn't.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
06:16:29pm
re: Counterfeits
@smaier
I have genuine booklets of these stamps that exhibit all of the anomalies in the year date that you've pointed out. It can't be assumed that the date on each stamp will be exactly the same. The booklet is printed on both sides which means, at a minimum, that different plates were used to print the front and back.
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like this post.
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re: Counterfeits
@tommcf - Thank you for that information! I appreciate your response and did not know that there could be such variability even on the same booklet panes. That is exactly the kind of information I was hoping for.
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