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Europe/Other : Belgium: precancel stamps

 

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Postings
Calstamp

29 Sep 2020
05:20:19pm

Am interested to learn if a catalogue of Belgian precancel
stamps exists. And if so, where can such a catalogue be
purchased?

Lastly, has anyone produced pages specific to the Belgian
Precancel issues?

TIA.
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jmh67

30 Sep 2020
01:42:19am
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Not sure whether a specialist catalog exists, but Michel, at the very least, lists all stamps that are known with precancels as well as the main types of these cancels. That would be a start.

As for album pages, the layout would depend very much on how deep you want to delve into the matter. You could restrict your collection to one of each precancelled stamp, you could add the various types of precancels, for the middle time period you could also add the various years, and for the earlier ones the various towns and post offices on top of that. It is likely to become an ongoing effort.

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

30 Sep 2020
03:23:27am

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

The official Belgian stamp catalogue (available in a Dutch and a French version) lists the typographed (i.e. printed) precancels. The earlier handcancels are not included but there is a specialised catalogue for the precancels. The handcncels are far more complex because many more cities / post offices made these. The printed ones were only made for a few cities until the 1930s and after that only generic ones for the whole country were made.

I think I must have a pdf of the precancel section from an old catalogue somewhere.

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HockeyNut
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30 Sep 2020
04:42:24am
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Maybe interesting for you :

If you are on the site you can click the english flag on the topright corner to switch the language

https://www.postzegelblog.nl/2017/08/14/belgische-voorafstempelingen-deel-1/

https://www.postzegelblog.nl/2017/08/16/belgische-voorafstempelingen-deel-2/

And the catalog is no longer released new.
Here a picture of an old one

Image Not Found

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Calstamp

01 Oct 2020
10:52:59am
re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Thank you jmh67, Jansimon, and Hockey Nut for your responses. Appreciate you sharing this information.

The catalyst for my question was a recent posting on another philatelic forum re the (supposed) release of a new Belgium precancel catalogue. The details were vague. So remain uncertain as to definition of “new”.

IOW, is this a new (heretofore unpublished) catalogue? Update of a prior resource? Or something else.

Will post an update if I obtain further details.

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nigelc
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01 Oct 2020
01:51:08pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Hi Calstamp,

I assume you are referring to the same post that I saw recently, about the following item on sale on Delcampe:

(It is a nine page unbound listing of Belgian precancels)

https://www.delcampe.net/fr/collections/timbres/belgique-preobliteres/typos-1906-12-armoiries/belgique-new-catalogue-2020-preobliteres-obliterations-typographiques-1-332-1068598489.html

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Calstamp

31 Jan 2022
01:32:31pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Recently discovered an interesting three-page article ("Belgium Precancels" by Jim Hirstein) in the August 2021 issue of The Precancel Forum.

Was unaware the catalyst for introduction of the precancel issues was Postal System concerns (Fall 1894) re bulk mailings of newspapers associated with upcoming parliamentary election.

The effort was so successful that not only was it continued, it was expanded.

Originally the precancel issues were limited to a handful of individual towns/cities. However, in 1930, the use of precancel stamps went national.

At least six series have been produced, ending with the Bird Series into the 1990s.




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StampCollector
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31 Jan 2022
08:23:58pm

Auctions - Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

This is my copy of COB, a bit old but helpful.
Image Not Found
I'm not fluent in Dutch or Flemish but this is the first page of the precancel section, I think. sectionImage Not Found

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"Those that can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities"
Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

01 Feb 2022
02:14:05am

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

It is a selection, for some reason. As you can see, it starts with number V333. All the town precancels are before this.

As written before, note that there is also a difference between the typographical precancels (printed) and the hand cancels. The latter are really prolific, one can find those for small towns as well, not just Brussels, Antwerp, Ghent, Luik, Leuven, Charleroi.

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Calstamp

01 Feb 2022
10:48:26am
re: Belgium: precancel stamps


StampCollector.

Thank you for your posting.

Was able to recently purchase an older edition of the COB in like-new condition.

Just as you have shown, my edition includes eight pages of precancel issues. Starting with the Jan 1938 "national" issue.

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Calstamp

01 Feb 2022
01:47:48pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Jansimon.

Yesterday I received (via loan form the APRL) a copy of the International Precancel Catalogue (First edition 2005) by John M Randall.

Photocopied. B&W illustrations. 8.5 x 11-inch loose-leaf format.

Although the catalogue includes 18 countries, the section for Belgium (150 pages) translates to c 90 percent of the book. By contrast France includes 34 pages and the Netherlands 18.

The Belgium section starts with several pages of history and background info, followed by a few pages of B&W illustrations.

Next up is a page listing Belgian precancels which were perfinned. Cities: Antwerp, Brussels, and Gosselies.

This is followed by a few pages detailing spotting pointers re the three types within the 1915 Albert series.

As you stated in your posting there are both typographic precancel and handroller precancel stamps. Based on a review of the catalogue, it appears the typographic precancels were produced during the period 1906 - 1996. And are considerably less in quantity than the handroller precancels (which were produced from 1894 to 1937).

An interesting sub-collecting opportunity indeed.


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Jansimon
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01 Feb 2022
03:34:58pm

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

I agree.

Here are two pages from my Belgian precancels collection. Later years are better, but the handroller cancels are still mostly missing...

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

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sheepshanks
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01 Feb 2022
08:04:15pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

There are good examples of both types here.
https://stampbears.net/thread/1454/belgium-pre-cancel-stamps

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Jansimon
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02 Feb 2022
04:02:26am

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

To be honest, I only saw typographical precancels on that page. Just to give you an idea I zoomed in on one of the pages I showed here.

Image Not Found

The ones in the middle from Ath, Brussel and Jumet are handroller cancels. Antwerpen 1924 and Bruxelles 1924 as well as the 1925 stamps on the lower row are typographical cancels.

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

02 Feb 2022
04:16:44am

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

"There are good examples of both types here.
https://stampbears.net/thread/1454/belgium-pre-cancel-stamps"



Just noticed that I failed to spot pages 2 and 3. There we can see the handrollers.

The writer is correct, the hexagonal ones from 1938 are the hardest to find. I have 13 or so.

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Calstamp

02 Feb 2022
08:09:18am
re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Sheepshanks.

Thx for posting. Quite an assortment. Was unaware of the hexagonal cancellations.

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sheepshanks
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02 Feb 2022
09:24:38pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Went through a few envelopes and found these, none of the Lozenge type at all. I think the penultimate one is a precancel but it also seems to have a heavy postmark and I'm unsure on the town. The last one is really indistinct, town possibly Namen.
Looks like a couple of roller cancels on the earlier ones.
Image Not Found

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

03 Feb 2022
04:32:11am

Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

The first three and the last two are definitely hand roller cancels.
The typographic town cancels only exist for Brussel/Bruxelles, Antwerpen/Anvers, Gent, Liege/Luik, Leuven/Louvain, Charleroy (old spelling) and Verviers. There are also those with Belgie/Belgique, but that's no town of course.

The ones you show with Namen and Doornijk/Tournai are not only recognisable as hand roller cancels, they are also not in that small list.
Do not quite understand the one with the strange postmark on top of the precancel.

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philb
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03 Feb 2022
11:10:25am

Auctions
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Interesting thread..i was always mildly curious about the Belgian "precancels". I am sure there is nothing special in these i found in a remainder album, i will add them to blank page in my Belgium area of my Scott International albums.Image Not Found

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StampCollector
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03 Feb 2022
12:04:24pm

Auctions - Approvals
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

I requested some Belgium stamps from a fellow stamp collector in Belgium and
among other things he told me that although Scott lists them as regular issues they are actually precanceled stamps. Doesn't make much of a difference to me, as long as it is a postage stamp that I don't have, it goes straight into my collection.

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"Those that can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities"
sheepshanks
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03 Feb 2022
12:32:53pm
re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Jan-simon, here is the strange one with the image enhanced. Looks like the precancel is also for Namen and can see what looks like (R?)IEBU(?) as the postmark.
Image Not Found

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Author/Postings
Calstamp

29 Sep 2020
05:20:19pm


Am interested to learn if a catalogue of Belgian precancel
stamps exists. And if so, where can such a catalogue be
purchased?

Lastly, has anyone produced pages specific to the Belgian
Precancel issues?

TIA.

Like
Login to Like
this post
jmh67

30 Sep 2020
01:42:19am

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Not sure whether a specialist catalog exists, but Michel, at the very least, lists all stamps that are known with precancels as well as the main types of these cancels. That would be a start.

As for album pages, the layout would depend very much on how deep you want to delve into the matter. You could restrict your collection to one of each precancelled stamp, you could add the various types of precancels, for the middle time period you could also add the various years, and for the earlier ones the various towns and post offices on top of that. It is likely to become an ongoing effort.

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this post
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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
30 Sep 2020
03:23:27am

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

The official Belgian stamp catalogue (available in a Dutch and a French version) lists the typographed (i.e. printed) precancels. The earlier handcancels are not included but there is a specialised catalogue for the precancels. The handcncels are far more complex because many more cities / post offices made these. The printed ones were only made for a few cities until the 1930s and after that only generic ones for the whole country were made.

I think I must have a pdf of the precancel section from an old catalogue somewhere.

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www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
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HockeyNut

30 Sep 2020
04:42:24am

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Maybe interesting for you :

If you are on the site you can click the english flag on the topright corner to switch the language

https://www.postzegelblog.nl/2017/08/14/belgische-voorafstempelingen-deel-1/

https://www.postzegelblog.nl/2017/08/16/belgische-voorafstempelingen-deel-2/

And the catalog is no longer released new.
Here a picture of an old one

Image Not Found

Like 
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likes this post.
Login to Like.
Calstamp

01 Oct 2020
10:52:59am

re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Thank you jmh67, Jansimon, and Hockey Nut for your responses. Appreciate you sharing this information.

The catalyst for my question was a recent posting on another philatelic forum re the (supposed) release of a new Belgium precancel catalogue. The details were vague. So remain uncertain as to definition of “new”.

IOW, is this a new (heretofore unpublished) catalogue? Update of a prior resource? Or something else.

Will post an update if I obtain further details.

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
nigelc

01 Oct 2020
01:51:08pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Hi Calstamp,

I assume you are referring to the same post that I saw recently, about the following item on sale on Delcampe:

(It is a nine page unbound listing of Belgian precancels)

https://www.delcampe.net/fr/collections/timbres/belgique-preobliteres/typos-1906-12-armoiries/belgique-new-catalogue-2020-preobliteres-obliterations-typographiques-1-332-1068598489.html

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Calstamp

31 Jan 2022
01:32:31pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Recently discovered an interesting three-page article ("Belgium Precancels" by Jim Hirstein) in the August 2021 issue of The Precancel Forum.

Was unaware the catalyst for introduction of the precancel issues was Postal System concerns (Fall 1894) re bulk mailings of newspapers associated with upcoming parliamentary election.

The effort was so successful that not only was it continued, it was expanded.

Originally the precancel issues were limited to a handful of individual towns/cities. However, in 1930, the use of precancel stamps went national.

At least six series have been produced, ending with the Bird Series into the 1990s.




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StampCollector

31 Jan 2022
08:23:58pm

Auctions - Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

This is my copy of COB, a bit old but helpful.
Image Not Found
I'm not fluent in Dutch or Flemish but this is the first page of the precancel section, I think. sectionImage Not Found

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"Those that can make ...
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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
01 Feb 2022
02:14:05am

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

It is a selection, for some reason. As you can see, it starts with number V333. All the town precancels are before this.

As written before, note that there is also a difference between the typographical precancels (printed) and the hand cancels. The latter are really prolific, one can find those for small towns as well, not just Brussels, Antwerp, Ghent, Luik, Leuven, Charleroi.

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this post

www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
Calstamp

01 Feb 2022
10:48:26am

re: Belgium: precancel stamps


StampCollector.

Thank you for your posting.

Was able to recently purchase an older edition of the COB in like-new condition.

Just as you have shown, my edition includes eight pages of precancel issues. Starting with the Jan 1938 "national" issue.

Like
Login to Like
this post
Calstamp

01 Feb 2022
01:47:48pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Jansimon.

Yesterday I received (via loan form the APRL) a copy of the International Precancel Catalogue (First edition 2005) by John M Randall.

Photocopied. B&W illustrations. 8.5 x 11-inch loose-leaf format.

Although the catalogue includes 18 countries, the section for Belgium (150 pages) translates to c 90 percent of the book. By contrast France includes 34 pages and the Netherlands 18.

The Belgium section starts with several pages of history and background info, followed by a few pages of B&W illustrations.

Next up is a page listing Belgian precancels which were perfinned. Cities: Antwerp, Brussels, and Gosselies.

This is followed by a few pages detailing spotting pointers re the three types within the 1915 Albert series.

As you stated in your posting there are both typographic precancel and handroller precancel stamps. Based on a review of the catalogue, it appears the typographic precancels were produced during the period 1906 - 1996. And are considerably less in quantity than the handroller precancels (which were produced from 1894 to 1937).

An interesting sub-collecting opportunity indeed.


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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
01 Feb 2022
03:34:58pm

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

I agree.

Here are two pages from my Belgian precancels collection. Later years are better, but the handroller cancels are still mostly missing...

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

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www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
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sheepshanks

01 Feb 2022
08:04:15pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

There are good examples of both types here.
https://stampbears.net/thread/1454/belgium-pre-cancel-stamps

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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
02 Feb 2022
04:02:26am

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

To be honest, I only saw typographical precancels on that page. Just to give you an idea I zoomed in on one of the pages I showed here.

Image Not Found

The ones in the middle from Ath, Brussel and Jumet are handroller cancels. Antwerpen 1924 and Bruxelles 1924 as well as the 1925 stamps on the lower row are typographical cancels.

Like
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this post

www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
02 Feb 2022
04:16:44am

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

"There are good examples of both types here.
https://stampbears.net/thread/1454/belgium-pre-cancel-stamps"



Just noticed that I failed to spot pages 2 and 3. There we can see the handrollers.

The writer is correct, the hexagonal ones from 1938 are the hardest to find. I have 13 or so.

Like
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www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
Calstamp

02 Feb 2022
08:09:18am

re: Belgium: precancel stamps


Sheepshanks.

Thx for posting. Quite an assortment. Was unaware of the hexagonal cancellations.

Like
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this post
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sheepshanks

02 Feb 2022
09:24:38pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Went through a few envelopes and found these, none of the Lozenge type at all. I think the penultimate one is a precancel but it also seems to have a heavy postmark and I'm unsure on the town. The last one is really indistinct, town possibly Namen.
Looks like a couple of roller cancels on the earlier ones.
Image Not Found

Like 
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Members Picture
Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
03 Feb 2022
04:32:11am

Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

The first three and the last two are definitely hand roller cancels.
The typographic town cancels only exist for Brussel/Bruxelles, Antwerpen/Anvers, Gent, Liege/Luik, Leuven/Louvain, Charleroy (old spelling) and Verviers. There are also those with Belgie/Belgique, but that's no town of course.

The ones you show with Namen and Doornijk/Tournai are not only recognisable as hand roller cancels, they are also not in that small list.
Do not quite understand the one with the strange postmark on top of the precancel.

Like
Login to Like
this post

www.etsy.com/nl/shop ...
Members Picture
philb

03 Feb 2022
11:10:25am

Auctions

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Interesting thread..i was always mildly curious about the Belgian "precancels". I am sure there is nothing special in these i found in a remainder album, i will add them to blank page in my Belgium area of my Scott International albums.Image Not Found

Like 
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.

"And every hair is measured like every grain of sand"
Members Picture
StampCollector

03 Feb 2022
12:04:24pm

Auctions - Approvals

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

I requested some Belgium stamps from a fellow stamp collector in Belgium and
among other things he told me that although Scott lists them as regular issues they are actually precanceled stamps. Doesn't make much of a difference to me, as long as it is a postage stamp that I don't have, it goes straight into my collection.

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Those that can make ...
Members Picture
sheepshanks

03 Feb 2022
12:32:53pm

re: Belgium: precancel stamps

Jan-simon, here is the strange one with the image enhanced. Looks like the precancel is also for Namen and can see what looks like (R?)IEBU(?) as the postmark.
Image Not Found

Like
Login to Like
this post
        

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