Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
So, the question is, what would the valuation for these stamps in other than Never Hinged condition?1) Lightly hinged (hinged only once or twice with a light mark)?
2) Heavy hinged (hinged more than once with significant marking)?
3) If the stamp had no gum, would one consider the value to be that of "Used".
4) What if the stamp was never hinged, and had "disturbed" gum, or only partial full gum?
I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be.
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12:55:53pm
Bothers me also, Terry. When I list the cv of such items I am careful to say something like "Scott #1452 unused lightly hinged, 2012 Scott cv for NH is $5.00." I get upset when a seller describes a stamp which is hinged and then gives the cv without distinguishing it from the NH valuation; it is just not so and is a false representation of the value of the stamp.
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Beyond the obvious "NH" status of NH stamps, description and pricing necessarily have to be subjective. As a buyer, I appreciate knowing the catalogue values of a given stamp, for they give me a baseline I can use to make my own judgment about the value of the stamp, not its intrinsic value (which is impossible to determine anyway), but its value to me for my collection.
Bob
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If a modern stamp is hinged, then the value for that stamp is roughly at or a little bit above face value. My usual pricing strategy is listed below in red.
the question is, what would the valuation for these stamps in other than Never Hinged condition?
1) Lightly hinged (hinged only once or twice with a light mark)?
40% off catalog
2) Heavy hinged (hinged more than once with significant marking)?
75% off catalog, if no other flaws. If there are more flaws, then 90% off catalog.
3) If the stamp had no gum, would one consider the value to be that of "Used".
Not if the stamp was issued without gum, then if uncancelled, it is either mint, or unused (if hinged).
If the stamp was issued with gum, and it no longer has gum, then I treat it as used IF the catalog value for used is less than that for unused. If the unused value is less, and the stamp was issued with gum, then I treat it as unused and go 50% off catalog.
4) What if the stamp was never hinged, and had "disturbed" gum, or only partial full gum?
Damaged stamp 75% off catalog, if no other flaws. If there are more flaws, then 90% off catalog.
I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be.
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Very good, Michael....
I really appreciate your detailed responses. Thank you very much for helping me put things in perspective.
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Wow Michael! You should write a book because you've really helped my education. Thanks again for the quality answers.
Stan
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Michael, do your discounts for hinging, gum condition, etc. mean that you would charge full catalogue for NH stamps?
Bob
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Why would a heavy hinge stamp be priced lower than a no gum stamp when simply soaking the gum off would make the stamps equal in condition? Is there a reason for the difference? Is it the work involved in soaking perhaps?
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Another thing that is not taken into consideration when selling stamps is the cancelling of the stamp heavy ,medium ,light corner cancel ,also the centring some of the early issues were way off centre and this should be re flexed in the price.
Here is a respected Australian dealers selling criteria for early Australian Stamps.
As you can see VFU and well centred stamps bring a high premium ,While off centre and heavy cancels reduce the price.
Brian
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It is interesting that "Good" is the worst centering, because anything more poorly centered than that gets into EFO territory:
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"I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be."
First, let's consider first class rate stamps. I would consider modern hinged (or faulty in any other respect) to be worth no more than face if the CV for F-VF NH is less than about 3x FV.
For stamps with FV less than first class (postcard, extra ounce, etc.), if CV is less than a dollar or two, any faults, including hinges, makes it worth FV at most.
Stamps with high FV (Priority and Express) or high CV (relative rarities) have to be considered on a case by case basis. High FV with a modest markup in CV (like US 2592 with FV of $5 and CV of $8) would be worth no more than FV to me if hinged. Low FV and high CV items are very different to me. Consider US 2283a (FV $2.50 and CV $6.00) versus 2283c (red removed from sky). There you have a FV of $2.50 and a CV of $65.00. Not only that, I may want to rip out the plate single and sell the other stamps as singles, so probably only one or two of the stamps have hinge marks anyway (and that's exactly how I got this stamp):
I think Michael's guidelines are very reasonable in most cases and consistent with what I have seen, but there are always exceptions, so take Michael's guidelines, apply liberally, and sprinkle a modest amount of common sense to arrive at a good guestimate of what it would bring in a fair market, which is the true value of what it is worth.
Lars
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Bob - No, I do not charge full catalog for MNH.
Philatelia - heavily hinged stamps have a tendency to have small hinge thins from the constant hinging. I do not soak the hinges off before offering the stamps for sale, thus I discount accordingly.
I did not mention cancellations since the question pertained to unused stamps. However, the comments regarding used stamps is quite valid. Heavily cancelled stamps are normally considered as damaged by me.
As Lars pointed out, centering is another important factor, and I do discount accordingly for that as well. Other factors exist that will diminish a stamp's value.
The best guide is for you to ask yourself when you look upon a stamp that you want to sell, "How much would I be willing to pay for this stamp?" When you arrive at that value, reduce it, because you are biased towards the item. After you make that adjustment, you probably are pretty close to what someone will pay you for the stamp.
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Lars,
I'm straying from the original question slightly to comment on your centering example.
your example of the 1c prexy on the far right has it listed as a perf error. It is not. It is merely poorly perfed, and more poorly than one typically sees for a mid-century stamp but not rare. This type of centering, however, is common among stamps from the prior century. The 2c black Jack (73) is notoriously poorly centered.
"Error" should be reserved for things that change the stamp: missing color(s), taggant, etc. Shifts in perfs, unless it also causes another problem, should be labeled only poorly centered, something below "good," say "poor" for instance.
I wouldn't even want to go so far as to include this within EFOs, although I'm sure my friend Dan would argue, politely but firmly.
David
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David,
I can see an argument that the perforation is not poor enough to qualify as an error, but there certainly is a point at which the perforation is so far off that it is, indeed, an error, IMHO. I really don't collect errors. This is just a page where I describe the types of things other collectors enjoy tracking down. I have 4 albums full of examples of stuff I don't collect, and every category is a fascinating specialty that I enjoyed learning more about.
Lars
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Lars, I've seen some of your pages. My goodness, they are works of wonder and art.
I understand your PoV, Lars, but still view it differently.
We have now armed others with two different perspectives, which is sufficient for my intentions.
David
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In the Scott catalogs, there comes a point while browsing down the catalog values that I see a box with the statement... "Catalogue values for unused stamps in this section, from this point to the end of the section, are for Never Hinged items."
So, the question is, what would the valuation for these stamps in other than Never Hinged condition?
1) Lightly hinged (hinged only once or twice with a light mark)?
2) Heavy hinged (hinged more than once with significant marking)?
3) If the stamp had no gum, would one consider the value to be that of "Used".
4) What if the stamp was never hinged, and had "disturbed" gum, or only partial full gum?
I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be.
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
17 Sep 2014
12:55:53pm
re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Bothers me also, Terry. When I list the cv of such items I am careful to say something like "Scott #1452 unused lightly hinged, 2012 Scott cv for NH is $5.00." I get upset when a seller describes a stamp which is hinged and then gives the cv without distinguishing it from the NH valuation; it is just not so and is a false representation of the value of the stamp.
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Beyond the obvious "NH" status of NH stamps, description and pricing necessarily have to be subjective. As a buyer, I appreciate knowing the catalogue values of a given stamp, for they give me a baseline I can use to make my own judgment about the value of the stamp, not its intrinsic value (which is impossible to determine anyway), but its value to me for my collection.
Bob
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03:27:40pm
re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
If a modern stamp is hinged, then the value for that stamp is roughly at or a little bit above face value. My usual pricing strategy is listed below in red.
the question is, what would the valuation for these stamps in other than Never Hinged condition?
1) Lightly hinged (hinged only once or twice with a light mark)?
40% off catalog
2) Heavy hinged (hinged more than once with significant marking)?
75% off catalog, if no other flaws. If there are more flaws, then 90% off catalog.
3) If the stamp had no gum, would one consider the value to be that of "Used".
Not if the stamp was issued without gum, then if uncancelled, it is either mint, or unused (if hinged).
If the stamp was issued with gum, and it no longer has gum, then I treat it as used IF the catalog value for used is less than that for unused. If the unused value is less, and the stamp was issued with gum, then I treat it as unused and go 50% off catalog.
4) What if the stamp was never hinged, and had "disturbed" gum, or only partial full gum?
Damaged stamp 75% off catalog, if no other flaws. If there are more flaws, then 90% off catalog.
I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be.
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Very good, Michael....
I really appreciate your detailed responses. Thank you very much for helping me put things in perspective.
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Wow Michael! You should write a book because you've really helped my education. Thanks again for the quality answers.
Stan
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Michael, do your discounts for hinging, gum condition, etc. mean that you would charge full catalogue for NH stamps?
Bob
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Why would a heavy hinge stamp be priced lower than a no gum stamp when simply soaking the gum off would make the stamps equal in condition? Is there a reason for the difference? Is it the work involved in soaking perhaps?
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Another thing that is not taken into consideration when selling stamps is the cancelling of the stamp heavy ,medium ,light corner cancel ,also the centring some of the early issues were way off centre and this should be re flexed in the price.
Here is a respected Australian dealers selling criteria for early Australian Stamps.
As you can see VFU and well centred stamps bring a high premium ,While off centre and heavy cancels reduce the price.
Brian
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
It is interesting that "Good" is the worst centering, because anything more poorly centered than that gets into EFO territory:
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
"I would love to hear what percentage of listed value others consider the actual catalog value of such stamps to be."
First, let's consider first class rate stamps. I would consider modern hinged (or faulty in any other respect) to be worth no more than face if the CV for F-VF NH is less than about 3x FV.
For stamps with FV less than first class (postcard, extra ounce, etc.), if CV is less than a dollar or two, any faults, including hinges, makes it worth FV at most.
Stamps with high FV (Priority and Express) or high CV (relative rarities) have to be considered on a case by case basis. High FV with a modest markup in CV (like US 2592 with FV of $5 and CV of $8) would be worth no more than FV to me if hinged. Low FV and high CV items are very different to me. Consider US 2283a (FV $2.50 and CV $6.00) versus 2283c (red removed from sky). There you have a FV of $2.50 and a CV of $65.00. Not only that, I may want to rip out the plate single and sell the other stamps as singles, so probably only one or two of the stamps have hinge marks anyway (and that's exactly how I got this stamp):
I think Michael's guidelines are very reasonable in most cases and consistent with what I have seen, but there are always exceptions, so take Michael's guidelines, apply liberally, and sprinkle a modest amount of common sense to arrive at a good guestimate of what it would bring in a fair market, which is the true value of what it is worth.
Lars
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12:18:14am
re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Bob - No, I do not charge full catalog for MNH.
Philatelia - heavily hinged stamps have a tendency to have small hinge thins from the constant hinging. I do not soak the hinges off before offering the stamps for sale, thus I discount accordingly.
I did not mention cancellations since the question pertained to unused stamps. However, the comments regarding used stamps is quite valid. Heavily cancelled stamps are normally considered as damaged by me.
As Lars pointed out, centering is another important factor, and I do discount accordingly for that as well. Other factors exist that will diminish a stamp's value.
The best guide is for you to ask yourself when you look upon a stamp that you want to sell, "How much would I be willing to pay for this stamp?" When you arrive at that value, reduce it, because you are biased towards the item. After you make that adjustment, you probably are pretty close to what someone will pay you for the stamp.
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Lars,
I'm straying from the original question slightly to comment on your centering example.
your example of the 1c prexy on the far right has it listed as a perf error. It is not. It is merely poorly perfed, and more poorly than one typically sees for a mid-century stamp but not rare. This type of centering, however, is common among stamps from the prior century. The 2c black Jack (73) is notoriously poorly centered.
"Error" should be reserved for things that change the stamp: missing color(s), taggant, etc. Shifts in perfs, unless it also causes another problem, should be labeled only poorly centered, something below "good," say "poor" for instance.
I wouldn't even want to go so far as to include this within EFOs, although I'm sure my friend Dan would argue, politely but firmly.
David
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
David,
I can see an argument that the perforation is not poor enough to qualify as an error, but there certainly is a point at which the perforation is so far off that it is, indeed, an error, IMHO. I really don't collect errors. This is just a page where I describe the types of things other collectors enjoy tracking down. I have 4 albums full of examples of stuff I don't collect, and every category is a fascinating specialty that I enjoyed learning more about.
Lars
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re: Mint Stamp Values for other than Never Hinged
Lars, I've seen some of your pages. My goodness, they are works of wonder and art.
I understand your PoV, Lars, but still view it differently.
We have now armed others with two different perspectives, which is sufficient for my intentions.
David
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