Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Can anyone tell me why the catalog prices of irish stamps seem to be so high? I'm not talking about the classic stamps, but rather the modern ones. Everything seems to be $1.50 or so, for both mint and used. The used stamps should be less expensive I'd think... they're certainly more common.
Thanks
BG
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Hi BG;
I'm not up on Irish that much, but yes you are right, they are kinda high. I've also noticed a huge increase in Great Britain, mostly Victoria thru George V. Stamps listed in my 1999 Scott's Catalog, are about 1000%, or 10 times as expensive in the 2009 Scott's. That is a 100% increase per year!!!
On a forum I read that The Chinese have gained 20,000,000 new stamp collectors in the last decade alone. That is over 10 times as many collectors as ever lived in the USA.
These numbers seem way too high, except for the fact that there are 1,355,000,000 people in China!!! So doing the math, it comes out to less than 1.5% of their population. Still seems high? Well get this, in China, stamp collecting is not a geek hobby like here. In China it is considered a status symbol to own a stamp collection. As it turns out, they are particularly fond of British stamps, which would include Ireland, who used British stamps until 1922.
So the Chinese are on a buying spree, to get as much British material as possible. It also stands to reason, that they will probably enjoy topicals as well, and will affect my stamp markets as they buy stuff up.
So many of us baby boomers, are retiring now, and dumping the stamp collections on eBay (except for me), that the market should go way down in value. But quite the contrary, it is only going up and up.
It would be interesting to see how much higher it can go.
keep on stampin'
Ken Tall Pines
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Ken, i am not dumping either...for some reason i keep buying stamps on places like Stamporama to put in my Scott Internationals to 1969...it can not be that i am looking for a monetary reward..thats for my wiser friends that spend BIG MONEY on country collections. Its just a hobby and a pastime..some of the guys go out and spend $80 for 18 holes and a cart..i hope they have a good day..while i piddle with my Dutch Indies postmarks !!!
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The prices that baffle me the most are the self-adhesive vs. Water activated gum. If you've seen any recent Irish kiloware, the self adhesives are a bazillion times more common, yet Scott's prices them much higher. HUH??? And the most common stamps - for example - the 48c flowers -- I just sent five POUNDS of the same two stamps to a charity --- well Scott values each stamp at $1.40??? HUH??? Golly gee whiz can I multiply each stamp in my donation by $1.40 and claim it as a charitable tax deduction? I absolutely would NOT do that - seems terribly dishonest if not downright illegal. But that's what the "experts" say that they are worth.
Kinda crazy isn't it?
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As we surf the net i doubt anyone pays anywhere near scott catalog for used modern Ireland !
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Hi Everyone;
Maybe not so crazy at all. Scott's Catalogs are published by Amos Press. They in turn also publish Linn's Stamp News. Linn's is more for the seller and not the collector. All their large-to-full page ads, are for large auction houses and large stamp dealers.
Guess who benefits the most by inflated stamp pricing? Big auction firms do. I once saw a 1938 presidential definitive of James Monroe - 5¢ bright Blue up for bidding!! It was MNH and graded at 90% based on centering, etc. It had a suggested starting bid of over $20.00!!
This was a well known auction firm and frequent advertiser in Linn's. To these folks the only motive is make as much money as you can squeeze out of some poor fool.
That is why I use recent sales on actual auction sites to guestimate value of a stamp. I just don't trust a publishing company (Scott's) that is too closely beholden to big selling firms, instead of collectors.
Scott Publishing kind of died when in the mid 70s, under the ownership of General Mills (yea the cereal company), they produced a Catalog in four volumes the one with the gold covers. They were not only printed on very acid paper, but were worse quality than newsprint. They, just like old newspapers turned brown really fast and anything that touched them did too. Most people just thru them out and used their old ones instead. About the same time they also discontinued the Specialty series of single country albums for most countries.
The Scott catalogs are okay for identifying stamps and that's about all. In fact some other catalogs like Stanley Gibbons, Mitchel, Yverts are far superior. They list more varieties than Scott ever did.
Anyway, I only collect for the enjoyment and don't pay much attention to value.
Happy collecting everyone!
Ken Tall Pines
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I run into problems with the inflated values when I try to find quantities of older material for flyspecking. The first definitive issue was used for a very long time and are as common as dirt, but very few of them have a minimum value in Scott's. Fortunately, I am able to trade with level headed collectors who know that 100 of those aren't worth $50 and who ask for a reasonable amount of material in return. Good trading friends rock! lol
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If you want to get an icey look...ask the publishers of Scott what their yearly run of catalogs is. I may break down and buy a 2 year old set...but not paying 80 bucks apiece for a new set !
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Hi Philb, and everyone;
I once searched eBay for used catalogs, just a couple years old or so. I was shocked to see $40 starting bids and was about to give up. Then I remember Google Shopping.
Go to Google, and on the top of the page is a series of links. The last one is "More?", a drop-down menu. When it drops down click on "Shopping". When the page loads type "2011 Scott Catalogs" into the search window. You should find that you can buy them for $20+ bucks on eBay, or $10-15 bucks on other sites. Also a good place to look is Amazon, the world's largest book seller.
I purchased all 6 volumes on Amazon, four 2009s, one 2008, and one 2010. Those just happened to be the cheapest ones they had, so I didn't mind that they were different years. I paid $96.50 for all six, and that included all S&H. They were all used library copies and in very good condition.
Another good source is bricks-and-morter stamp dealers. We used to have one here in Muskegon, and 12 years ago I bought US Spec. & vol. 1-6, all for $20. Later found a $40 stamp from Netherlands.
A little off-topic is another nice feature in Google's "More?" menu is the "Translate" link. If you shop on Delcampe.net in Brussels Belgium, then you are aware that many sellers speak only French. Or if you have a foreign stamp but can't figure out what it is, Postage or Revenue use or charity label, then this feature can be invaluable.
I also utilize Cassell's Spanish-English/English-Spanish dictionary. I also have the French, Italian, and German Cassell's also. These I consider a very essential part of my stamp reference library.
A few years ago, I had some stamps that looked Polish, but didn't know what they were. they showed a person pushing a wheel borrow. I patiently typed each letter into the Google general search window on the home page. I got some articles about this stamp. They are well known and were on a stamp blog.
In 1923 they were required on mail. The money raised by their sale was used by Poland's Treasury to buy Silver and Gold from other countries, to back the Polish currency, which is what the wheel borrow was for, all that money.
I find Google an essential tool for collecting.
Someone please remove his battery, he talks too much!! 
Ken Tall Pines
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Discussion is good..i would like to see more of the members participate..i purchased the 6 2012 catalogs a year old for about $190...most of my collecting interests end around 1970 and the areas i collect are not volatile...i used to want the catalogs to catalog stamps for trading...but with the price increases i will just trade at 2012 values unless the other person have a set of 2014s...if thats the case i will take their word for the cat. value. It does not take much to figure that the sales of Scott catalogs has to be decreasing !!
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I bet they sell more copies of the catalog to libraries than to collectors these days. I used to buy new sets every three years. Not any more! Since I've narrowed my interests, I like to just buy the country I need from the people who section the catalog and sell it on ebay. A nice little benefit is that it weighs a whole lot less, too! Dang those new catalogs are heavy! Great for working the triceps heh heh.
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Terry, thats a good idea..buying the only the country you need for a few bucks...i wonder if they cut the pages out of the catalog or are able to make a good scan of the pages ? Its silly for me to purchase a set of catalogs for trading purposes...after all i am only trading what i do not need ! Too late smart !
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It is illegal to scan pages from any copyrighted book and sell it, or give it away to someone else.
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Scott told me a couple of years ago that sales to libraries have fallen dramatically due to the constant increasing prices of the catalogs. Sales to collectors likewise have dropped. Sales to dealers are what keeps the catalog going, but print volumes are getting smaller. Due to the smaller print volumes, Scott has to raise the price as printing costs are determined by volume. Good business move by Scott. Sales drop, lower print volumes and raise the price so that sales will continue to drop resulting in lower print volumes and even higher prices. You'd think they were managed by former USPS managers.
Phil, the retail price per new catalog is now at $130.00 (same as last year). They can be found for around $100 plus shipping.
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The fellow on Ebay cuts up the catalog and sells it in pieces. They are NOT scans or copies and thus perfectly legal to sell.
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Ok, that answers my question..he probably has no problem selling the popular countries...i don't know about the rest !
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09:13:15am
Theresa
Michael was not suggesting that the Ebay seller was doing anything illegal. We have had this discussion on the DB before and his comments were intended to answer Phil's query regarding the source of the single country pages ("...{whether} they cut the pages out of the catalog or are able to make a good scan of the pages?"). Amos (Scott's publisher) aggressively prosecutes copyright infringement and Michael's comments serve merely to caution the unwary that scanning or copying pages from a Scott catalog (even if innocently done) without first obtaining written permission from Amos to do so, can be a very costly introduction to copyright law.
Bobby
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Kent's right about the Chinese collectors. A couple of years ago, the big thing among Chinese collectors were Hong Kong stamps (Some of my local dealers said they couldn't keep enough HK stuff in stock to fill the requests), so they went up in price, now they're turning their attention to UK/Ireland stuff.
As for scott's catalogs.. they're good for a quick inventory check, but that's it... I'd rather have the individual countries from specialzied listings. (Michel/Germany, Facit/Scandinavia, SG/UK-Ireland, etc.)
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Thanks for the clarification, Bobby. That's one of the problems when you've missed previous conversations - you don't have the full picture. I really wanted to make sure that everyone knew that the ebay pages are legit and that I didn't purchase something squirrely. I'm a stickler for honesty - just wanted to be crystal clear about that. The Girl Scout in me was having a conniption fit LOL! And - you never know, others may have missed your previous thread, too.
About catalogs --- YES --- Absolutely --- other single country catalogs are sooooooo much better. I prefer Hibernian for Ireland over Gibbons, but that's personal preference. I keep Scott around only because here in the States we're kinda stuck with it as the default.
Good conversation everyone!
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Its funny how things come around...i am trading items i have been holding for 25 years..i guess if you live long enough ! Welcome China !!
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For the modern issues, Scott just converts the face value to US dollars and doubles it, there is no real thinking to it.
Josh
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"About catalogs --- YES --- Absolutely --- other single country catalogs are sooooooo much better. I prefer Hibernian for Ireland over Gibbons, but that's personal preference. I keep Scott around only because here in the States we're kinda stuck with it as the default. "
I keep hearing that quite a lot from US-based collectors doing something else than US.
Maybe You all should simply ditch Scott and make a change (I know it's not that simple, but what's the worst that could happen?)
"For the modern issues, Scott just converts the face value to US dollars and doubles it, there is no real thinking to it."
Sadly not much different for Michel either...
-k-
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Hi Everyone:
Can anyone tell me why the catalog prices of irish stamps seem to be so high? I'm not talking about the classic stamps, but rather the modern ones. Everything seems to be $1.50 or so, for both mint and used. The used stamps should be less expensive I'd think... they're certainly more common.
Thanks
BG
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Hi BG;
I'm not up on Irish that much, but yes you are right, they are kinda high. I've also noticed a huge increase in Great Britain, mostly Victoria thru George V. Stamps listed in my 1999 Scott's Catalog, are about 1000%, or 10 times as expensive in the 2009 Scott's. That is a 100% increase per year!!!
On a forum I read that The Chinese have gained 20,000,000 new stamp collectors in the last decade alone. That is over 10 times as many collectors as ever lived in the USA.
These numbers seem way too high, except for the fact that there are 1,355,000,000 people in China!!! So doing the math, it comes out to less than 1.5% of their population. Still seems high? Well get this, in China, stamp collecting is not a geek hobby like here. In China it is considered a status symbol to own a stamp collection. As it turns out, they are particularly fond of British stamps, which would include Ireland, who used British stamps until 1922.
So the Chinese are on a buying spree, to get as much British material as possible. It also stands to reason, that they will probably enjoy topicals as well, and will affect my stamp markets as they buy stuff up.
So many of us baby boomers, are retiring now, and dumping the stamp collections on eBay (except for me), that the market should go way down in value. But quite the contrary, it is only going up and up.
It would be interesting to see how much higher it can go.
keep on stampin'
Ken Tall Pines
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this post
re: Ireland stamp prices?
Ken, i am not dumping either...for some reason i keep buying stamps on places like Stamporama to put in my Scott Internationals to 1969...it can not be that i am looking for a monetary reward..thats for my wiser friends that spend BIG MONEY on country collections. Its just a hobby and a pastime..some of the guys go out and spend $80 for 18 holes and a cart..i hope they have a good day..while i piddle with my Dutch Indies postmarks !!!
Login to Like
this post
re: Ireland stamp prices?
The prices that baffle me the most are the self-adhesive vs. Water activated gum. If you've seen any recent Irish kiloware, the self adhesives are a bazillion times more common, yet Scott's prices them much higher. HUH??? And the most common stamps - for example - the 48c flowers -- I just sent five POUNDS of the same two stamps to a charity --- well Scott values each stamp at $1.40??? HUH??? Golly gee whiz can I multiply each stamp in my donation by $1.40 and claim it as a charitable tax deduction? I absolutely would NOT do that - seems terribly dishonest if not downright illegal. But that's what the "experts" say that they are worth.
Kinda crazy isn't it?
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
As we surf the net i doubt anyone pays anywhere near scott catalog for used modern Ireland !
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Hi Everyone;
Maybe not so crazy at all. Scott's Catalogs are published by Amos Press. They in turn also publish Linn's Stamp News. Linn's is more for the seller and not the collector. All their large-to-full page ads, are for large auction houses and large stamp dealers.
Guess who benefits the most by inflated stamp pricing? Big auction firms do. I once saw a 1938 presidential definitive of James Monroe - 5¢ bright Blue up for bidding!! It was MNH and graded at 90% based on centering, etc. It had a suggested starting bid of over $20.00!!
This was a well known auction firm and frequent advertiser in Linn's. To these folks the only motive is make as much money as you can squeeze out of some poor fool.
That is why I use recent sales on actual auction sites to guestimate value of a stamp. I just don't trust a publishing company (Scott's) that is too closely beholden to big selling firms, instead of collectors.
Scott Publishing kind of died when in the mid 70s, under the ownership of General Mills (yea the cereal company), they produced a Catalog in four volumes the one with the gold covers. They were not only printed on very acid paper, but were worse quality than newsprint. They, just like old newspapers turned brown really fast and anything that touched them did too. Most people just thru them out and used their old ones instead. About the same time they also discontinued the Specialty series of single country albums for most countries.
The Scott catalogs are okay for identifying stamps and that's about all. In fact some other catalogs like Stanley Gibbons, Mitchel, Yverts are far superior. They list more varieties than Scott ever did.
Anyway, I only collect for the enjoyment and don't pay much attention to value.
Happy collecting everyone!
Ken Tall Pines
Login to Like
this post
re: Ireland stamp prices?
I run into problems with the inflated values when I try to find quantities of older material for flyspecking. The first definitive issue was used for a very long time and are as common as dirt, but very few of them have a minimum value in Scott's. Fortunately, I am able to trade with level headed collectors who know that 100 of those aren't worth $50 and who ask for a reasonable amount of material in return. Good trading friends rock! lol
Login to Like
this post
re: Ireland stamp prices?
If you want to get an icey look...ask the publishers of Scott what their yearly run of catalogs is. I may break down and buy a 2 year old set...but not paying 80 bucks apiece for a new set !
Login to Like
this post
re: Ireland stamp prices?
Hi Philb, and everyone;
I once searched eBay for used catalogs, just a couple years old or so. I was shocked to see $40 starting bids and was about to give up. Then I remember Google Shopping.
Go to Google, and on the top of the page is a series of links. The last one is "More?", a drop-down menu. When it drops down click on "Shopping". When the page loads type "2011 Scott Catalogs" into the search window. You should find that you can buy them for $20+ bucks on eBay, or $10-15 bucks on other sites. Also a good place to look is Amazon, the world's largest book seller.
I purchased all 6 volumes on Amazon, four 2009s, one 2008, and one 2010. Those just happened to be the cheapest ones they had, so I didn't mind that they were different years. I paid $96.50 for all six, and that included all S&H. They were all used library copies and in very good condition.
Another good source is bricks-and-morter stamp dealers. We used to have one here in Muskegon, and 12 years ago I bought US Spec. & vol. 1-6, all for $20. Later found a $40 stamp from Netherlands.
A little off-topic is another nice feature in Google's "More?" menu is the "Translate" link. If you shop on Delcampe.net in Brussels Belgium, then you are aware that many sellers speak only French. Or if you have a foreign stamp but can't figure out what it is, Postage or Revenue use or charity label, then this feature can be invaluable.
I also utilize Cassell's Spanish-English/English-Spanish dictionary. I also have the French, Italian, and German Cassell's also. These I consider a very essential part of my stamp reference library.
A few years ago, I had some stamps that looked Polish, but didn't know what they were. they showed a person pushing a wheel borrow. I patiently typed each letter into the Google general search window on the home page. I got some articles about this stamp. They are well known and were on a stamp blog.
In 1923 they were required on mail. The money raised by their sale was used by Poland's Treasury to buy Silver and Gold from other countries, to back the Polish currency, which is what the wheel borrow was for, all that money. I find Google an essential tool for collecting.
Someone please remove his battery, he talks too much!!
Ken Tall Pines
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Discussion is good..i would like to see more of the members participate..i purchased the 6 2012 catalogs a year old for about $190...most of my collecting interests end around 1970 and the areas i collect are not volatile...i used to want the catalogs to catalog stamps for trading...but with the price increases i will just trade at 2012 values unless the other person have a set of 2014s...if thats the case i will take their word for the cat. value. It does not take much to figure that the sales of Scott catalogs has to be decreasing !!
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
I bet they sell more copies of the catalog to libraries than to collectors these days. I used to buy new sets every three years. Not any more! Since I've narrowed my interests, I like to just buy the country I need from the people who section the catalog and sell it on ebay. A nice little benefit is that it weighs a whole lot less, too! Dang those new catalogs are heavy! Great for working the triceps heh heh.
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Terry, thats a good idea..buying the only the country you need for a few bucks...i wonder if they cut the pages out of the catalog or are able to make a good scan of the pages ? Its silly for me to purchase a set of catalogs for trading purposes...after all i am only trading what i do not need ! Too late smart !
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01:33:56am
re: Ireland stamp prices?
It is illegal to scan pages from any copyrighted book and sell it, or give it away to someone else.
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01:39:38am
re: Ireland stamp prices?
Scott told me a couple of years ago that sales to libraries have fallen dramatically due to the constant increasing prices of the catalogs. Sales to collectors likewise have dropped. Sales to dealers are what keeps the catalog going, but print volumes are getting smaller. Due to the smaller print volumes, Scott has to raise the price as printing costs are determined by volume. Good business move by Scott. Sales drop, lower print volumes and raise the price so that sales will continue to drop resulting in lower print volumes and even higher prices. You'd think they were managed by former USPS managers.
Phil, the retail price per new catalog is now at $130.00 (same as last year). They can be found for around $100 plus shipping.
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
The fellow on Ebay cuts up the catalog and sells it in pieces. They are NOT scans or copies and thus perfectly legal to sell.
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Ok, that answers my question..he probably has no problem selling the popular countries...i don't know about the rest !
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
23 Jun 2014
09:13:15am
re: Ireland stamp prices?
Theresa
Michael was not suggesting that the Ebay seller was doing anything illegal. We have had this discussion on the DB before and his comments were intended to answer Phil's query regarding the source of the single country pages ("...{whether} they cut the pages out of the catalog or are able to make a good scan of the pages?"). Amos (Scott's publisher) aggressively prosecutes copyright infringement and Michael's comments serve merely to caution the unwary that scanning or copying pages from a Scott catalog (even if innocently done) without first obtaining written permission from Amos to do so, can be a very costly introduction to copyright law.
Bobby
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Kent's right about the Chinese collectors. A couple of years ago, the big thing among Chinese collectors were Hong Kong stamps (Some of my local dealers said they couldn't keep enough HK stuff in stock to fill the requests), so they went up in price, now they're turning their attention to UK/Ireland stuff.
As for scott's catalogs.. they're good for a quick inventory check, but that's it... I'd rather have the individual countries from specialzied listings. (Michel/Germany, Facit/Scandinavia, SG/UK-Ireland, etc.)
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Thanks for the clarification, Bobby. That's one of the problems when you've missed previous conversations - you don't have the full picture. I really wanted to make sure that everyone knew that the ebay pages are legit and that I didn't purchase something squirrely. I'm a stickler for honesty - just wanted to be crystal clear about that. The Girl Scout in me was having a conniption fit LOL! And - you never know, others may have missed your previous thread, too.
About catalogs --- YES --- Absolutely --- other single country catalogs are sooooooo much better. I prefer Hibernian for Ireland over Gibbons, but that's personal preference. I keep Scott around only because here in the States we're kinda stuck with it as the default.
Good conversation everyone!
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
Its funny how things come around...i am trading items i have been holding for 25 years..i guess if you live long enough ! Welcome China !!
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
For the modern issues, Scott just converts the face value to US dollars and doubles it, there is no real thinking to it.
Josh
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re: Ireland stamp prices?
"About catalogs --- YES --- Absolutely --- other single country catalogs are sooooooo much better. I prefer Hibernian for Ireland over Gibbons, but that's personal preference. I keep Scott around only because here in the States we're kinda stuck with it as the default. "
I keep hearing that quite a lot from US-based collectors doing something else than US.
Maybe You all should simply ditch Scott and make a change (I know it's not that simple, but what's the worst that could happen?)
"For the modern issues, Scott just converts the face value to US dollars and doubles it, there is no real thinking to it."
Sadly not much different for Michel either...
-k-
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