Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Although I mostly publish on independent web sites, sometimes one of my editors will indulge my desire to write "off topic," if I can find an appropriate tie in.
This is a fairly "light and fluffy" piece on a self-publishing non-philatelic web site... it's getting a fair number of views, all things considered-- I never know quite what to expect. When I write about stamps it's normally on my blog which is very definitely FOR stamp collectors. This one is more or less addressed to those who might thing "STAMP collecting? Do people still DO that?"
Cheers,
Peter
Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
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Good article Peter. I enjoyed it. Be interesting to see the readers responses.
Regards ... Tim
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Nice article I enjoyed it.
My parents got me going on stamp collecting when I was about 7 years old,living in Norway.
It is a wonderful hobby
lpayette
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Enjoyable reading and you have made some interesting and relevant points
Cheers
Dave
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Hi Peter,
Just to say: It is a very nice article and wonderful promotion for stamp collecting. Thanks for sharing. I will pass it along.
Arno
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Nice article.
"For a while-- between about the start of "computer gaming" in the mid-1980s and maybe 2005-- stamp collecting suffered a bit of an "image crisis," being increasingly thought of as "nerdy" and "uncool" and "something OLD people do." That's changing, however, as more youngsters are finding stamps interesting as "history" rather than "current" things."
I'm curious what support you have for the assertion that youngsters are returning to the hobby, if I interpreted the paragraph quoted above corrected. Declining membership rolls in organizations like the APS seem to say otherwise, at least for the US. I see no evidence in my local community that any children except my own are interested (citing my son's 6th grade class as an example).
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"Declining membership rolls in organizations like the APS seem to say otherwise,"
I don't believe that declining APS membership reflects anything except the fact that newer collectors see no reason to join, and many current members are finding fewer reasons to stay.
Tedski
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The only real problem I find with the internet is when it comes to finding that one common stamp to complete a set, with the stamp dealers you could purchase that odd stamp but on the internet you often have to buy the set or a job lot (mixture) to get it.
In Bournemouth (UK) we used to have 3 stamp dealers and 1 in neighbouring Poole (1970's - 1990's) now we have none, zero, zilch, nothing, which makes it hard to find these "common" stamps.
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I don't think it's just the internet that is killing stamp collecting, especially for kids. It's x-box, wii, and all the other video game systems as well. Kids don't have time or patience to sit with stamps.
But on the other hand our local Hamilton Stamp club does have a juniors table. We only have 3 or 4 juniors come to the meetings, and even then not every night, but at the two stamp shows we hold during the year we get 25 or 30 kids visiting.
A couple of members have school clubs that they run. One retired school principal runs clubs in 4 different schools.
So there might not be as many younger members, but there are still quite a few in our area.
We are getting close to 150 members in our local club. Some only come once in awhile, but we get new members or visitors almost every meeting.
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"I don't believe that declining APS membership reflects anything except the fact that newer collectors see no reason to join, and many current members are finding fewer reasons to stay."
Okay then I'd be curious to see if there are records of membership trends in local stamp clubs. I'd bet they too are declining.
But I do believe that changing demographics and commitment to the hobby overall are what's driving the decrease in membership rolls at the APS not just dissatisfaction with or ignorance of the APS and similar organizations. By commitment I mean the level of interest in the hobby. Personally, I find the annual fee of $37 is relatively low and worth it just for the APS magazine and access to back issues. I belong to several organizations simply to have access to their journals and expertise. The fact the fewer people are taking advantage of these resources points to me to a decline in collectors with advanced interests.
Not that I consider myself particularly advanced in this hobby, but when I restarted the hobby, the first thing I did was look for organizations and publications that would help me get there. Supporting these organizations is also one way to reverse the trends as they often implement programs to reach out to youth.
There are other less tangible indications that the hobby continues to decline, such as closing brick and mortar stores, a plethora of estate auctions and anecdotes/postings of heirs having little interest in inherited collections. Some of this is past history, but I recently met a brick and mortar store owner who lamented that his children had no interest in his collections or in the mountain of inventory he had. Just one data point, but they add up.
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But getting back to the point of the thread, I don't think the decline in the hobby I detect is due to the internet. Frankly, collecting stamps as a child is frustrating and kind of boring. I should know, I went through it. For me it was frustrating not having decent guidance or resources. Essentially I was at the mercy of mail-order stamps companies and shoddy album dealers like Mystic and Harris that sold simple, incomplete albums to naive collectors and pushed the worthless stamps of the 60's and 70's (CTO's etc). I never knew about or could have afforded stamp catalogs.
The biggest frustration for me was albums that did not have spaces for the stamps I had and enormously overinflated prices for stamps and supplies. Stamp prices have declined but the supplies are still dear. My Dad collected stamps, but he was pretty much a casual collector and did not pursue advanced collection to any degree. He provided limited guidance.
Although it was interesting learning about geography and history, and great fun filling spaces, my children have much more interesting activities that provide the same benefit without the frustration and lack of guidance. Much of that knowledge admittedly is accessible at their fingertips, from the internet. But the internet did not kill stamp collecting. Without my guidance, my children wouldn't even know stamp collecting was an option. After all, the trappings of the hobby are not displayed anywhere they shop, play, or spend any time, including school. Who's fault is that?
Stamp collecting started dying long before the internet and personal computing. Maybe the Commodore 64 and Atari dealt the death blow by distracting a generation of potential collectors from raising today's youth to acknowledge and respect the hobby. This generation was responsible for the decline in interest, apathy toward the hobby and the eventual closing of suppliers, dealers and brick and mortar stores.
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Perhaps it isn't just one thing that has affected stamp collecting. Our local club has 18 members and we average 10 -12 at our monthly meetings. We only have one youth member (age 14) and he comes only if his grandparents bring him. I am the only member with school age children (unfortunately not interested in stamps yet). Another member occasionally brings his grandson to our annual show to help him look for stamps; this same member also does talks on stamp collecting at area schools. We get 5 - 10 kids at our annual show depending on whether the local boy scout troop has anyone interested. Even among our members, it is difficult to get participation for presentations or organizing the show.
Ask a kid and most have never mailed a letter and rarely, if ever, see a stamp come on any piece of mail. Kids also have a lot competing for their time nowadays: sports, school, jobs, family obligations, friends (stamp collecting isn't the coolest thing to do). What they do with their free time isn't likely to have anything to do with something like stamp collecting.
I don't know if there is any one cause or solution or even if there is really a problem. We know there are many stamp collectors in our area. We bought the APS list of area members last year to do a local mailing for our show and were astounded to find out that there are over 100 APS members around us! Why don't they join a club? Why don't they attend the show? Don't know. Maybe they like to collect on their own time in the privacy of their home.
Our club has struggled with this for several years. For now, we are just enjoying the members we have.....new members seem to come out of the woodwork to replace departing members but our overall number stays about the same.
I know i use the internet to supplement my collecting interests. It does make it easier to connect with other collectors via sites like SOR. Just some thoughts.....Sally
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Hi! I am pretty new to SOR but would like to voice my opinion. I liked the article, just would have liked it to be longer, I was just getting comfortable.
I don't think the internet has hurt the hobby at all. For me it has been nothing but good. I have made friends in many parts of the world and we trade information and stamps. The information from a local far out does some dumb catalogue or other media. Peter in Australia digs out all those hard to find stamps and my collection has prospered. We are in contact almost daily except when he goes 'walk-about'. I try very hard to return the favour.
In my opinion it is the Postal Authorities who are killing the hobby. They are GREEDY, no other word for it. I love Australian stamps, show me a new issue from Australia and my eyes glaze over, but I am afraid Australia Post is one of the worst offenders. Canada isn't far behind but at least Australia's stamps hold something special for me.
I use to collect World Wide, and then British Commonwealth only but now I am down to three countries, Australia, Canada and Great Britain and the last two are close to being on the block. Why!? Because I can't afford to buy all the new issues from all three countries. And down the road I will have to cut my Australian collections off at a certain time and place for the same reason.
I love my stamps and I am not sure what I would do without them.
Let us enjoy every minute of our hobby that we can.
Cheers
Lyall
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I really enjoyed Peter's article and the discussion that has followed here. I think that the Internet has only enhanced the hobby. I know of 3 brick and mortor stamp stores here in the Twin Cities area of Minnesota where I live, but there is so little margin on the average stamp sale I'm surprised that we have that many. The only way to economically sell stamps is on the Internet. Also, stamp collecting on the whole is an older persons hobby. The Internet enables us to continue with the hobby and to continue enjoying our stamp friends even though we don't get around as well as we used to.
It is interesting the number of us who pick the hobby up for a second or even third time as we get a little older and actually have a little to spend on our selves. It is very difficult to find the time or the money when you are bringing up a family.
Tim
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01:55:12pm
First, I can recall articles about how stamp collecting was a dieing hobby from magazines and newspapers as far back as the 1960s and similar blurbs in the "Twenty Five Years Ago" page fillers even then. So this has long been a concern and somehow the hobby not just survives but through the internet seems to be more vibrant that ever.
Just think about it. Years ago I set a few hours aside every Saturday morning to visit a local stamp store and usually on Sunday afternoon to wander through a bourse when possible. I did have an ongoing relationship with several approval dealers but the exchange of envelopes occurred once a month for so for each one. The last approval dealer I lost was House of Stamps of Cincinnati, Ohio after dealing with Carolee and Dana for easily thirty plus years. Make that about forty years.
Almost all the current members here and in other on-line clubs followed the same track of collecting as a child, then on to other matters, followed by some kind of personal epiphany and a return to their hobby. But for most of those years it was a solitary hobby engaged in by men and women sitting at a desk or the kitchen table in the evenings and only occasionally interacting with other actual human beings who were interested in similar aspects of the King of Hobbies, and Hobby of Kings"
Now a few nights ago, after the Stanley Cup game that I had recorded was finished playing, I went to my stamp desk and opened several pages, among them this site. I happened to notice the note at the bottom of the Discussion page that indicted that there were five or six members on-line at that moment, about 3AM EDST (-4 ZULU) and besides reading and posting comments I was able to browse and bid on several lots, exchange a note with one and enter into a lively conversation on Facebook.In fact it as long past daylight before I felt groggy enough to lie down to sleep.
I am not sure if it was the same night but I also spent time searching e-Pay for a scan of some stamp I wanted.
I follow several blogs relating to the hobby as well as a few that deal with other interests. So, in my seldom humble opinion the internet has expanded exponentially contact between members and friends, opening far more doors than close.
One note is the age factor. I have noticed that there is a discernible line between friends from High School (1957) and college, shipmates from the military and my apparently endless supply of first and second cousins who are of close to my age. Apparently far too many of our elderly citizenry (including Canada) are keyboardphobic and greatly fear becoming infected with 'one a the theer komputa virisess' that they have read about in some supermarket tabloid somewhere.
I place the line at about sixty-five and notice only a few brave souls who risk crossing the gap into the brave new world of computer usage. I suspect,and hope that as that line inexorably drifts along, like a slowly rising tide, it will disappear as the average age of collectors drops to below fifty, but for a while yet it exists.
Who knows? I just think that the hobby has changed and s healthy in a different way.
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Hi Charlie,
Your comment ...
"I happened to notice the note at the bottom of the Discussion page that indicted that there were five or six members on-line at that moment, about 3AM EDST (-4 ZULU) and besides reading and posting comments I was able to browse and bid on several lots, exchange a note with one and enter into a lively conversation on Facebook."
.. makes one wonder if a chat room would not be a logical extension and addition to our line-up of member services. Given that we are quite international, I am not surprised that you can find members logged in at all hours.
Arno
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Funny you should mention that Arno. I've been looking into that very thing.
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11:29:47pm
An interesting idea, Tim. There are about 12-14 names listed in the "Visitors online" segment and it is almost midnight here in Florida.
I used to join in the discussions at the IDPA site, but they made some changes in the site, or something happened to some "plug in" on my PC and from then on I had so much trouble logging in that I gave up on it.
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Peter,
Ever so often I can't help but pushing my favorite article on stamp collecting. Novelist Ayn Rand, like so many of us, collected stamps in her childhood, quit for several decades, and in middle age resumed collecting. The following is excerpted from an article which first appeared in the Minkus Stamp Journal in 1971. The text was obtained on the Internet; it has been abridged.
Why I Like Stamp Collecting by Ayn Rand
This is a somewhat philosophical, very insightful article what exactly it is that makes us love collecting stamps. I am sure, Peter, as a writer you will appreciate the beautiful language. You will also appreciate me providing excerpts only, that is, respecting the copyright and not post the whole of it.
Enjoy,
Arno
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06:23:58pm
(1)Chat board! Love to see it.
(2) Ayn Rand: cut my cynical, pragmatic teeth on Atlas Shrugged in college. Made for great arguments over the years with my more liberal friends (especially those who considered anyone to the right of Karl Marx to be a fascist).
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06:54:08pm
Excellent article Arno - she really hits the spirit of stamp collecting. I especially like her point of "brotherhood" - clearly evidenced right here at SOR 
Kelly
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That was a nice piece by Ayn Rand actually. I was surprised on several levels, particularly why she didn't put that kind of eloquence into Atlas Shrugged. I thought she would begin expounding her objectivist philosophy, but thankfully and correctly, her viewpoint on stamp collecting is pure subjectivity.
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This is, indeed, a wonderful article that captures the essence of collecting for collecting sake, not as an investment or opportunity to make sales money off bulk purchases. This is true philately; thank you for sharing this.
Cheers,
Peter
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07:22:30pm
" .... I was surprised on several levels, particularly why she didn't put that kind of eloquence into Atlas Shrugged. ...."
That is simple, eloquence is learned and needs to be practiced. That happens when people write many articles and take the time to look at their writing objectively. Also important is constructive criticism accepted for what it is worth.
There is also the eloquence of passion for some thought or idea that is different from just seeking a profitable book sale.
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07:32:04am
Stamp collecting was on the wane before the Internet came along. When I was a kid, you found “stamp packets†in every 5 and dime, entire departments devoted to stamps in most major department stores, and stand alone stamp shops abounded. But like the 5 and dimes and department stores, which time and entrepreneur-ship has replaced with WalMart and the like, stamp collecting slowly and inevitably became less and less of a draw for young people who found other interests more enticing.
In my opinion, the Internet revitalized philately, and provided the means to continue collecting despite the demise of stamp stores and availability of stamps elsewhere. OK, philately is not where it was 50 years ago, and probably will never be as popular again, but it is a viable and vibrant hobby, which it would not be without the Internet and its plethora of resources. I believe that over time, if stamp collecting does continue (and at some level, I believe it will) any growth will be fostered and facilitated by the internet, not hindered by it.
The internet has made it possible for sites like Stamporama to exist!
As an example, in Martyn's post he laments the decline of local stamp dealers and the difficulty of finding "...that odd stamp..." and that "...on the internet you often have to buy the set or a job lot (mixture) to get it." Yet the internet makes possible the SOR discussion board and the opportunity to locate almost anything, usually at minimal cost. In fact, since joining SOR I have completed several sets with "common" stamps by merely mentioning in a post I needed such (and, in fact, more often than not, at no cost at all).
The internet has made it possible for collectors who live in areas without "stamp clubs" to participate in virtual clubs like SOR. And with respect to philatelic societies, the internet will not do away with organizations like APS, unless they commit "suicide" by not embracing the internet and moving forward into the 21st century.
Sorry for rambling, and my apologies to those who suffered through this entire message.
VIVA LA INTERNET!
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I agree with Bobby. The Internet allowed me to pick up my childhood hobby and get serious about filling in the holes and learning more as well. I doubt I would have returned to the hobby without the Internet and all the wonderful folks like you (take a bow) that I have met and learned from.
The "problem" with kids, IMHO, is that they rarely or never receive a personal piece of mail with an actual stamp. Why WOULD they be interested in stamp collecting?
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Like Bobby and Lars, I think the internet facilitates the hobby, rather than killing it. While it also provides more distractions, distractions have always been around. Today, though, one can develop an understanding for the hobby. moreover, one can have a mailcar full of mentors, whereas that was far more limited in years past, and i'm much the poorer for it.
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Very interesting. And I will toss my 1 1/2 cents into the ring... (I am speaking of myself) and perhaps many others. Young people and older people collecting. Although my mother collected stamps, I never even knew about it until many years later. I never even thought about stamp collecting nor was I ever exposed to it. But I can say, between raising five children and working, I don't think I ever had time to even think about something like stamp collecting, and that covers probably a good 30 year span. Now that I am semi-retired for the past few years and with my mother's passing last year and obtaining her mild-manner collection, I do have time to think and to actually collect. (Not withstanding surgeries and illnesses.)Sorry I have missed the fun for the past few months. I'm Back 
Clayton
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Well as mentioned, the brick and mortar stamp shops we loved so well are gone...we still travel great distances for the "atmosphere" of a stamp show...but the internet has made a lot of stamps accessible for me...plus i like to chat with other collectors..at our club meetings twice a month we get wrapped up in business and the auction and its difficult to socialize !!
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"Well as mentioned, the brick and mortar stamp shops we loved so well are gone"
Not in Israel. Nearly all the stamp shops that were in business 23 years ago when I came to live here, are still going. I think only two have closed down. Indeed, there are more places to look for stamps than there were back then if one includes the good number of Collectables markets and fairs that have sprung up in this tiny nation.
Nope, alive and well here.
Even the Post Office is doing OK...but then they don't issue billions of stamps every two weeks !!
Londonbus1...plus we still have water-activated stamps, not S/A !!
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I've posted a bit about this a while back... I'm actually a writer by trade (at least in part), and one of the things I like to do now and then is write about stamp collecting... with the ambition of putting my words in front of non-collectors (or former collectors) with the hope of perhaps getting them interested in collecting stamps, or just taking that first step... learning more about it.
Although I mostly publish on independent web sites, sometimes one of my editors will indulge my desire to write "off topic," if I can find an appropriate tie in.
This is a fairly "light and fluffy" piece on a self-publishing non-philatelic web site... it's getting a fair number of views, all things considered-- I never know quite what to expect. When I write about stamps it's normally on my blog which is very definitely FOR stamp collectors. This one is more or less addressed to those who might thing "STAMP collecting? Do people still DO that?"
Cheers,
Peter
Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Good article Peter. I enjoyed it. Be interesting to see the readers responses.
Regards ... Tim
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Nice article I enjoyed it.
My parents got me going on stamp collecting when I was about 7 years old,living in Norway.
It is a wonderful hobby
lpayette
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07:01:48pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Enjoyable reading and you have made some interesting and relevant points
Cheers
Dave
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Hi Peter,
Just to say: It is a very nice article and wonderful promotion for stamp collecting. Thanks for sharing. I will pass it along.
Arno
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Nice article.
"For a while-- between about the start of "computer gaming" in the mid-1980s and maybe 2005-- stamp collecting suffered a bit of an "image crisis," being increasingly thought of as "nerdy" and "uncool" and "something OLD people do." That's changing, however, as more youngsters are finding stamps interesting as "history" rather than "current" things."
I'm curious what support you have for the assertion that youngsters are returning to the hobby, if I interpreted the paragraph quoted above corrected. Declining membership rolls in organizations like the APS seem to say otherwise, at least for the US. I see no evidence in my local community that any children except my own are interested (citing my son's 6th grade class as an example).
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
"Declining membership rolls in organizations like the APS seem to say otherwise,"
I don't believe that declining APS membership reflects anything except the fact that newer collectors see no reason to join, and many current members are finding fewer reasons to stay.
Tedski
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06:01:48am
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
The only real problem I find with the internet is when it comes to finding that one common stamp to complete a set, with the stamp dealers you could purchase that odd stamp but on the internet you often have to buy the set or a job lot (mixture) to get it.
In Bournemouth (UK) we used to have 3 stamp dealers and 1 in neighbouring Poole (1970's - 1990's) now we have none, zero, zilch, nothing, which makes it hard to find these "common" stamps.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
I don't think it's just the internet that is killing stamp collecting, especially for kids. It's x-box, wii, and all the other video game systems as well. Kids don't have time or patience to sit with stamps.
But on the other hand our local Hamilton Stamp club does have a juniors table. We only have 3 or 4 juniors come to the meetings, and even then not every night, but at the two stamp shows we hold during the year we get 25 or 30 kids visiting.
A couple of members have school clubs that they run. One retired school principal runs clubs in 4 different schools.
So there might not be as many younger members, but there are still quite a few in our area.
We are getting close to 150 members in our local club. Some only come once in awhile, but we get new members or visitors almost every meeting.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
"I don't believe that declining APS membership reflects anything except the fact that newer collectors see no reason to join, and many current members are finding fewer reasons to stay."
Okay then I'd be curious to see if there are records of membership trends in local stamp clubs. I'd bet they too are declining.
But I do believe that changing demographics and commitment to the hobby overall are what's driving the decrease in membership rolls at the APS not just dissatisfaction with or ignorance of the APS and similar organizations. By commitment I mean the level of interest in the hobby. Personally, I find the annual fee of $37 is relatively low and worth it just for the APS magazine and access to back issues. I belong to several organizations simply to have access to their journals and expertise. The fact the fewer people are taking advantage of these resources points to me to a decline in collectors with advanced interests.
Not that I consider myself particularly advanced in this hobby, but when I restarted the hobby, the first thing I did was look for organizations and publications that would help me get there. Supporting these organizations is also one way to reverse the trends as they often implement programs to reach out to youth.
There are other less tangible indications that the hobby continues to decline, such as closing brick and mortar stores, a plethora of estate auctions and anecdotes/postings of heirs having little interest in inherited collections. Some of this is past history, but I recently met a brick and mortar store owner who lamented that his children had no interest in his collections or in the mountain of inventory he had. Just one data point, but they add up.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
But getting back to the point of the thread, I don't think the decline in the hobby I detect is due to the internet. Frankly, collecting stamps as a child is frustrating and kind of boring. I should know, I went through it. For me it was frustrating not having decent guidance or resources. Essentially I was at the mercy of mail-order stamps companies and shoddy album dealers like Mystic and Harris that sold simple, incomplete albums to naive collectors and pushed the worthless stamps of the 60's and 70's (CTO's etc). I never knew about or could have afforded stamp catalogs.
The biggest frustration for me was albums that did not have spaces for the stamps I had and enormously overinflated prices for stamps and supplies. Stamp prices have declined but the supplies are still dear. My Dad collected stamps, but he was pretty much a casual collector and did not pursue advanced collection to any degree. He provided limited guidance.
Although it was interesting learning about geography and history, and great fun filling spaces, my children have much more interesting activities that provide the same benefit without the frustration and lack of guidance. Much of that knowledge admittedly is accessible at their fingertips, from the internet. But the internet did not kill stamp collecting. Without my guidance, my children wouldn't even know stamp collecting was an option. After all, the trappings of the hobby are not displayed anywhere they shop, play, or spend any time, including school. Who's fault is that?
Stamp collecting started dying long before the internet and personal computing. Maybe the Commodore 64 and Atari dealt the death blow by distracting a generation of potential collectors from raising today's youth to acknowledge and respect the hobby. This generation was responsible for the decline in interest, apathy toward the hobby and the eventual closing of suppliers, dealers and brick and mortar stores.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Perhaps it isn't just one thing that has affected stamp collecting. Our local club has 18 members and we average 10 -12 at our monthly meetings. We only have one youth member (age 14) and he comes only if his grandparents bring him. I am the only member with school age children (unfortunately not interested in stamps yet). Another member occasionally brings his grandson to our annual show to help him look for stamps; this same member also does talks on stamp collecting at area schools. We get 5 - 10 kids at our annual show depending on whether the local boy scout troop has anyone interested. Even among our members, it is difficult to get participation for presentations or organizing the show.
Ask a kid and most have never mailed a letter and rarely, if ever, see a stamp come on any piece of mail. Kids also have a lot competing for their time nowadays: sports, school, jobs, family obligations, friends (stamp collecting isn't the coolest thing to do). What they do with their free time isn't likely to have anything to do with something like stamp collecting.
I don't know if there is any one cause or solution or even if there is really a problem. We know there are many stamp collectors in our area. We bought the APS list of area members last year to do a local mailing for our show and were astounded to find out that there are over 100 APS members around us! Why don't they join a club? Why don't they attend the show? Don't know. Maybe they like to collect on their own time in the privacy of their home.
Our club has struggled with this for several years. For now, we are just enjoying the members we have.....new members seem to come out of the woodwork to replace departing members but our overall number stays about the same.
I know i use the internet to supplement my collecting interests. It does make it easier to connect with other collectors via sites like SOR. Just some thoughts.....Sally
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06:09:26pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Hi! I am pretty new to SOR but would like to voice my opinion. I liked the article, just would have liked it to be longer, I was just getting comfortable.
I don't think the internet has hurt the hobby at all. For me it has been nothing but good. I have made friends in many parts of the world and we trade information and stamps. The information from a local far out does some dumb catalogue or other media. Peter in Australia digs out all those hard to find stamps and my collection has prospered. We are in contact almost daily except when he goes 'walk-about'. I try very hard to return the favour.
In my opinion it is the Postal Authorities who are killing the hobby. They are GREEDY, no other word for it. I love Australian stamps, show me a new issue from Australia and my eyes glaze over, but I am afraid Australia Post is one of the worst offenders. Canada isn't far behind but at least Australia's stamps hold something special for me.
I use to collect World Wide, and then British Commonwealth only but now I am down to three countries, Australia, Canada and Great Britain and the last two are close to being on the block. Why!? Because I can't afford to buy all the new issues from all three countries. And down the road I will have to cut my Australian collections off at a certain time and place for the same reason.
I love my stamps and I am not sure what I would do without them.
Let us enjoy every minute of our hobby that we can.
Cheers
Lyall
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
I really enjoyed Peter's article and the discussion that has followed here. I think that the Internet has only enhanced the hobby. I know of 3 brick and mortor stamp stores here in the Twin Cities area of Minnesota where I live, but there is so little margin on the average stamp sale I'm surprised that we have that many. The only way to economically sell stamps is on the Internet. Also, stamp collecting on the whole is an older persons hobby. The Internet enables us to continue with the hobby and to continue enjoying our stamp friends even though we don't get around as well as we used to.
It is interesting the number of us who pick the hobby up for a second or even third time as we get a little older and actually have a little to spend on our selves. It is very difficult to find the time or the money when you are bringing up a family.
Tim
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
23 Jun 2013
01:55:12pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
First, I can recall articles about how stamp collecting was a dieing hobby from magazines and newspapers as far back as the 1960s and similar blurbs in the "Twenty Five Years Ago" page fillers even then. So this has long been a concern and somehow the hobby not just survives but through the internet seems to be more vibrant that ever.
Just think about it. Years ago I set a few hours aside every Saturday morning to visit a local stamp store and usually on Sunday afternoon to wander through a bourse when possible. I did have an ongoing relationship with several approval dealers but the exchange of envelopes occurred once a month for so for each one. The last approval dealer I lost was House of Stamps of Cincinnati, Ohio after dealing with Carolee and Dana for easily thirty plus years. Make that about forty years.
Almost all the current members here and in other on-line clubs followed the same track of collecting as a child, then on to other matters, followed by some kind of personal epiphany and a return to their hobby. But for most of those years it was a solitary hobby engaged in by men and women sitting at a desk or the kitchen table in the evenings and only occasionally interacting with other actual human beings who were interested in similar aspects of the King of Hobbies, and Hobby of Kings"
Now a few nights ago, after the Stanley Cup game that I had recorded was finished playing, I went to my stamp desk and opened several pages, among them this site. I happened to notice the note at the bottom of the Discussion page that indicted that there were five or six members on-line at that moment, about 3AM EDST (-4 ZULU) and besides reading and posting comments I was able to browse and bid on several lots, exchange a note with one and enter into a lively conversation on Facebook.In fact it as long past daylight before I felt groggy enough to lie down to sleep.
I am not sure if it was the same night but I also spent time searching e-Pay for a scan of some stamp I wanted.
I follow several blogs relating to the hobby as well as a few that deal with other interests. So, in my seldom humble opinion the internet has expanded exponentially contact between members and friends, opening far more doors than close.
One note is the age factor. I have noticed that there is a discernible line between friends from High School (1957) and college, shipmates from the military and my apparently endless supply of first and second cousins who are of close to my age. Apparently far too many of our elderly citizenry (including Canada) are keyboardphobic and greatly fear becoming infected with 'one a the theer komputa virisess' that they have read about in some supermarket tabloid somewhere.
I place the line at about sixty-five and notice only a few brave souls who risk crossing the gap into the brave new world of computer usage. I suspect,and hope that as that line inexorably drifts along, like a slowly rising tide, it will disappear as the average age of collectors drops to below fifty, but for a while yet it exists.
Who knows? I just think that the hobby has changed and s healthy in a different way.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Hi Charlie,
Your comment ...
"I happened to notice the note at the bottom of the Discussion page that indicted that there were five or six members on-line at that moment, about 3AM EDST (-4 ZULU) and besides reading and posting comments I was able to browse and bid on several lots, exchange a note with one and enter into a lively conversation on Facebook."
.. makes one wonder if a chat room would not be a logical extension and addition to our line-up of member services. Given that we are quite international, I am not surprised that you can find members logged in at all hours.
Arno
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Funny you should mention that Arno. I've been looking into that very thing.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
23 Jun 2013
11:29:47pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
An interesting idea, Tim. There are about 12-14 names listed in the "Visitors online" segment and it is almost midnight here in Florida.
I used to join in the discussions at the IDPA site, but they made some changes in the site, or something happened to some "plug in" on my PC and from then on I had so much trouble logging in that I gave up on it.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Peter,
Ever so often I can't help but pushing my favorite article on stamp collecting. Novelist Ayn Rand, like so many of us, collected stamps in her childhood, quit for several decades, and in middle age resumed collecting. The following is excerpted from an article which first appeared in the Minkus Stamp Journal in 1971. The text was obtained on the Internet; it has been abridged.
Why I Like Stamp Collecting by Ayn Rand
This is a somewhat philosophical, very insightful article what exactly it is that makes us love collecting stamps. I am sure, Peter, as a writer you will appreciate the beautiful language. You will also appreciate me providing excerpts only, that is, respecting the copyright and not post the whole of it.
Enjoy,
Arno
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
25 Jun 2013
06:23:58pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
(1)Chat board! Love to see it.
(2) Ayn Rand: cut my cynical, pragmatic teeth on Atlas Shrugged in college. Made for great arguments over the years with my more liberal friends (especially those who considered anyone to the right of Karl Marx to be a fascist).
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A Service Dog gives a person with a disability independence. Never approach, distract or pet a working dog, especially when (s)he is in harness. Never be afraid to ask questions to the handler (parent).
25 Jun 2013
06:54:08pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Excellent article Arno - she really hits the spirit of stamp collecting. I especially like her point of "brotherhood" - clearly evidenced right here at SOR
Kelly
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
That was a nice piece by Ayn Rand actually. I was surprised on several levels, particularly why she didn't put that kind of eloquence into Atlas Shrugged. I thought she would begin expounding her objectivist philosophy, but thankfully and correctly, her viewpoint on stamp collecting is pure subjectivity.
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01:35:37pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
This is, indeed, a wonderful article that captures the essence of collecting for collecting sake, not as an investment or opportunity to make sales money off bulk purchases. This is true philately; thank you for sharing this.
Cheers,
Peter
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
26 Jun 2013
07:22:30pm
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
" .... I was surprised on several levels, particularly why she didn't put that kind of eloquence into Atlas Shrugged. ...."
That is simple, eloquence is learned and needs to be practiced. That happens when people write many articles and take the time to look at their writing objectively. Also important is constructive criticism accepted for what it is worth.
There is also the eloquence of passion for some thought or idea that is different from just seeking a profitable book sale.
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
27 Jun 2013
07:32:04am
re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Stamp collecting was on the wane before the Internet came along. When I was a kid, you found “stamp packets†in every 5 and dime, entire departments devoted to stamps in most major department stores, and stand alone stamp shops abounded. But like the 5 and dimes and department stores, which time and entrepreneur-ship has replaced with WalMart and the like, stamp collecting slowly and inevitably became less and less of a draw for young people who found other interests more enticing.
In my opinion, the Internet revitalized philately, and provided the means to continue collecting despite the demise of stamp stores and availability of stamps elsewhere. OK, philately is not where it was 50 years ago, and probably will never be as popular again, but it is a viable and vibrant hobby, which it would not be without the Internet and its plethora of resources. I believe that over time, if stamp collecting does continue (and at some level, I believe it will) any growth will be fostered and facilitated by the internet, not hindered by it.
The internet has made it possible for sites like Stamporama to exist!
As an example, in Martyn's post he laments the decline of local stamp dealers and the difficulty of finding "...that odd stamp..." and that "...on the internet you often have to buy the set or a job lot (mixture) to get it." Yet the internet makes possible the SOR discussion board and the opportunity to locate almost anything, usually at minimal cost. In fact, since joining SOR I have completed several sets with "common" stamps by merely mentioning in a post I needed such (and, in fact, more often than not, at no cost at all).
The internet has made it possible for collectors who live in areas without "stamp clubs" to participate in virtual clubs like SOR. And with respect to philatelic societies, the internet will not do away with organizations like APS, unless they commit "suicide" by not embracing the internet and moving forward into the 21st century.
Sorry for rambling, and my apologies to those who suffered through this entire message.
VIVA LA INTERNET!
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
I agree with Bobby. The Internet allowed me to pick up my childhood hobby and get serious about filling in the holes and learning more as well. I doubt I would have returned to the hobby without the Internet and all the wonderful folks like you (take a bow) that I have met and learned from.
The "problem" with kids, IMHO, is that they rarely or never receive a personal piece of mail with an actual stamp. Why WOULD they be interested in stamp collecting?
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Like Bobby and Lars, I think the internet facilitates the hobby, rather than killing it. While it also provides more distractions, distractions have always been around. Today, though, one can develop an understanding for the hobby. moreover, one can have a mailcar full of mentors, whereas that was far more limited in years past, and i'm much the poorer for it.
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Very interesting. And I will toss my 1 1/2 cents into the ring... (I am speaking of myself) and perhaps many others. Young people and older people collecting. Although my mother collected stamps, I never even knew about it until many years later. I never even thought about stamp collecting nor was I ever exposed to it. But I can say, between raising five children and working, I don't think I ever had time to even think about something like stamp collecting, and that covers probably a good 30 year span. Now that I am semi-retired for the past few years and with my mother's passing last year and obtaining her mild-manner collection, I do have time to think and to actually collect. (Not withstanding surgeries and illnesses.)Sorry I have missed the fun for the past few months. I'm Back
Clayton
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
Well as mentioned, the brick and mortar stamp shops we loved so well are gone...we still travel great distances for the "atmosphere" of a stamp show...but the internet has made a lot of stamps accessible for me...plus i like to chat with other collectors..at our club meetings twice a month we get wrapped up in business and the auction and its difficult to socialize !!
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re: Article: Did the Internet Kill Stamp Collecting?
"Well as mentioned, the brick and mortar stamp shops we loved so well are gone"
Not in Israel. Nearly all the stamp shops that were in business 23 years ago when I came to live here, are still going. I think only two have closed down. Indeed, there are more places to look for stamps than there were back then if one includes the good number of Collectables markets and fairs that have sprung up in this tiny nation.
Nope, alive and well here.
Even the Post Office is doing OK...but then they don't issue billions of stamps every two weeks !!
Londonbus1...plus we still have water-activated stamps, not S/A !!
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