Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
This artist Joseph Kenyon, printed up this limited edition of 20,
this is #1, copying format of the Pan-Am issue. Stamps are printed on
thin board, imperf. A beautiful job. I think that they are illegal,
even though listed as art.
He signed the sheet or me.
Sheet was originally advertised on SOR, against the rules, and ad was removed, but I contacted Kenyon, and we arranged for a swap of foreign stamps for this sheet.
What say you, is this an illegal printing, or is it just a form of art, as originally advertised?
Richaard
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That looks like beautiful artwork to me, Richaard. I would be very happy to have that on my stamp wall.
Mike
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My goodness! The artist has spelled 'Niagara' incorrectly.
I know nothing about these other than the fact that they are not postage stamps (LOL).
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Dear Richard,
Where is there any attempt to portray this as a stamp and offered for sale as a stamp? With that in mind, and no apparent attempt defraud anyone,why might you consider this illegal? I think Mike has it right. With the spelling error, imperforate sheet and paper quality there ought not to be any question about it being something other than a stamp. I believe that this artist has also done many of the U.S. rarities as an artistic rendition, and clearly labels them as such. If I'm mistaken about the artist, then there is another chap who does. This artform has been around for several years now to my knowledge, and has not been challenged as to its legality.
Dan C.
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By golly, I never even noticed the misspelling of Niagara.
Mike, sheet is not for sale, but perhaps someday. it makes for a great conversation piece.
I just had an email from the artist Joseph Kenyon, and he confirmed that only the 20 sheets were made, and they are all in collector's hands. Mine is sheet #1.
Check the artist out on Google, put in Joe Kenyon, artist.
Richaard
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Hey, I just noticed that I spelled unusual with two "l's". Are these posts errors?
Richaard
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No, always referred to as art. No claim to it being a real stamp. I thought that perhaps due to the fact that it said US Postage with a 5c denomination, that there might be a problem.
BTW, the artist has designed several Zazzle real 44c stamps.
Richaard
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Richard,
was this advertised on the DB and therefore against the rules? or was it in the auction as a cinderella? I don't remember the latter at all.
As to legality, that would be up to Treasury. My guess is that "US Postage" moves it into the category of currency forgery, regardless of intent or proximity to real postage. The New Yorker had a great article many years ago about an artist who drew imaginitive dollars and whose art included the receipt for which he was payinng and the change he received. FBI arrested him numerous times. His bills were always drawn in such a way as to easily distinguishable from real currency.
David
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12:30:05pm
Just keep in mind that the US Secret Service which investigates currency forgerys is about as humorless as any government agency anywhere. By the time it might come to their attention and a decision about its legality rendered, the "crime," if any, would have been consumated and the troubles of the artist well underway.
While the artist may have used a cardboard material for his artwork, I think that the USSS might get excited about is the plates that the "stamps" were printed from.
Is the artist in the US ?
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I may be wrong but I thought the Postal Inspector not the Secret Servie was reponsible for postal crimes. I know during the J Edgar Hoover years, specifically when Farley ran the postal system there was a lot of annomisity beteen the Postal Service (Farley) and the (J Edgar Hoover) FBI regarding investigations. Between the FBI and the Postal Inspectors it is estimated that 10% of international mail was opened,read,resealed and sent to its destination. Both the FBI and the Postal inspectors also opened and read domestic mail being sent and received by persons of interest.
According to my attorney friends in order for the sheet of stamps to be considered a crime of forgery it has to used with the "intent to deceive". The stamp art work obviously was not intended to deceive.
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Very nice and a great way to get a great space filler.
But every Stamp Art should have "private reprint" clearly printed on the back of the stamp.
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12:28:40pm
A good point.
I suppose that if someone tried to use a label from the printing the Postal Inspectors would certainly be interested and perhaps we would see one of those turf wars between federal agencies that populate so many crime drama shows.
I believe they are also just as humorless as the USSS.
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I am not sure where it was advertized on SOR, as it was over two years ago, buy I think it was under General stamp Collecting.
Richaard
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How do you like this item?
This artist Joseph Kenyon, printed up this limited edition of 20,
this is #1, copying format of the Pan-Am issue. Stamps are printed on
thin board, imperf. A beautiful job. I think that they are illegal,
even though listed as art.
He signed the sheet or me.
Sheet was originally advertised on SOR, against the rules, and ad was removed, but I contacted Kenyon, and we arranged for a swap of foreign stamps for this sheet.
What say you, is this an illegal printing, or is it just a form of art, as originally advertised?
Richaard
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re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
That looks like beautiful artwork to me, Richaard. I would be very happy to have that on my stamp wall.
Mike
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11:27:36pm
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
My goodness! The artist has spelled 'Niagara' incorrectly.
I know nothing about these other than the fact that they are not postage stamps (LOL).
Login to Like
this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
Dear Richard,
Where is there any attempt to portray this as a stamp and offered for sale as a stamp? With that in mind, and no apparent attempt defraud anyone,why might you consider this illegal? I think Mike has it right. With the spelling error, imperforate sheet and paper quality there ought not to be any question about it being something other than a stamp. I believe that this artist has also done many of the U.S. rarities as an artistic rendition, and clearly labels them as such. If I'm mistaken about the artist, then there is another chap who does. This artform has been around for several years now to my knowledge, and has not been challenged as to its legality.
Dan C.
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this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
By golly, I never even noticed the misspelling of Niagara.
Mike, sheet is not for sale, but perhaps someday. it makes for a great conversation piece.
I just had an email from the artist Joseph Kenyon, and he confirmed that only the 20 sheets were made, and they are all in collector's hands. Mine is sheet #1.
Check the artist out on Google, put in Joe Kenyon, artist.
Richaard
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this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
Hey, I just noticed that I spelled unusual with two "l's". Are these posts errors?
Richaard
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this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
No, always referred to as art. No claim to it being a real stamp. I thought that perhaps due to the fact that it said US Postage with a 5c denomination, that there might be a problem.
BTW, the artist has designed several Zazzle real 44c stamps.
Richaard
Login to Like
this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
Richard,
was this advertised on the DB and therefore against the rules? or was it in the auction as a cinderella? I don't remember the latter at all.
As to legality, that would be up to Treasury. My guess is that "US Postage" moves it into the category of currency forgery, regardless of intent or proximity to real postage. The New Yorker had a great article many years ago about an artist who drew imaginitive dollars and whose art included the receipt for which he was payinng and the change he received. FBI arrested him numerous times. His bills were always drawn in such a way as to easily distinguishable from real currency.
David
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this post
Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
19 Dec 2011
12:30:05pm
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
Just keep in mind that the US Secret Service which investigates currency forgerys is about as humorless as any government agency anywhere. By the time it might come to their attention and a decision about its legality rendered, the "crime," if any, would have been consumated and the troubles of the artist well underway.
While the artist may have used a cardboard material for his artwork, I think that the USSS might get excited about is the plates that the "stamps" were printed from.
Is the artist in the US ?
Login to Like
this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
I may be wrong but I thought the Postal Inspector not the Secret Servie was reponsible for postal crimes. I know during the J Edgar Hoover years, specifically when Farley ran the postal system there was a lot of annomisity beteen the Postal Service (Farley) and the (J Edgar Hoover) FBI regarding investigations. Between the FBI and the Postal Inspectors it is estimated that 10% of international mail was opened,read,resealed and sent to its destination. Both the FBI and the Postal inspectors also opened and read domestic mail being sent and received by persons of interest.
According to my attorney friends in order for the sheet of stamps to be considered a crime of forgery it has to used with the "intent to deceive". The stamp art work obviously was not intended to deceive.
Login to Like
this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
Very nice and a great way to get a great space filler.
But every Stamp Art should have "private reprint" clearly printed on the back of the stamp.
Login to Like
this post
Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
20 Dec 2011
12:28:40pm
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
A good point.
I suppose that if someone tried to use a label from the printing the Postal Inspectors would certainly be interested and perhaps we would see one of those turf wars between federal agencies that populate so many crime drama shows.
I believe they are also just as humorless as the USSS.
Login to Like
this post
re: Unusual Cinderella: inverted bridge at Niagara
I am not sure where it was advertized on SOR, as it was over two years ago, buy I think it was under General stamp Collecting.
Richaard
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