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Europe/Other : Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

 

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Fatherauld

25 Jan 2010
04:35:00pm
OK, silly question time. I'm working on building album pages for my Malta stamps and just noticed that the Scott Cat that I'm working from often skips a sequence of numbers between series of stamps. Why would they do that?

Regards ... Tim.
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Rgnpcs
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25 Jan 2010
05:01:50pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Could be a printing error in the catalog.
What numbers are you referring too?
Ask Linn's this question.
Richaard

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Parkinlot
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President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org

25 Jan 2010
06:13:29pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

There are a couple of reasons I can think of.

1) Sometimes a stamp gets a catalog number then it turns out not to be a valid stamp used for postage. Once that is realized, then the number is removed from the catalogue.

2) Scott sometimes sets aside a group of numbers for a set. If the country does not issue enough stamps that were set aside, those numbers never get used.

This has happened with US Stamps there is no 3034-3035 or 3037-3043.

Bob

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Harley

25 Jan 2010
06:20:29pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Scott assigns groups of numbers to a series of stamps that usually add new issues of the same series or designs over several years.
Rather than cronologicaly listed dates as issued,the reserved numbers keeps the seris in one location,,instead of hunting them throughout the catalog(year of issue at later date).
Now,,if those series are discontinued,the numbers are not,they remain in limbo(missing).
If they dont reserve enough numbers,a change or rearrangement of numbers occur,such as the recent US forever stamp issues.
Sometimes they get it right,sometimes they dont,,and changes,additions and deletions are made.There is a section with that title in every Scott US catalog.
TOM

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Fatherauld

25 Jan 2010
06:52:19pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Is Scott Cat reliable from one publication to the next. My Scott Cat is the 2007 edition. I am currently working in the early Malta stamps (around 1920 at the moment). If I purchase the 2010 edition, is it reasonably likely that the numbers will remain the same?

Regards ... Tim.

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads

25 Jan 2010
07:18:30pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

they are mostly reliable, Tim, although with billions of entries and tons of changes with each new edition, errors are made, although, as fellow with ink in my veins, the errors are quite minimal. While I have many beefs with Scott, the number of errors in their 7-volume set is remarkably small.

the second question is more problematic, because Scott does rearrange, reassign, eliminate, and add number all the time, and they aren't necessarily the result of a corrected, or introduced, error, but rather a rethinking of the catalogue or new information. I don't know Malta at all, so i can't speak to specifics of that country or its catalogue, but it's not uncommon for Scott to resssign US number, usually more recent ones, but occasionally going all the way back to the beginning.

But most betting people would say it's unlikely that any given set of numbers will change between any two sets of years, UNLESS you're looking at an expanding set. For stamps of the 20s, i'd say there would be little chance of any change, other than in catalogue value.

David

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Sponthetrona2
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Keep Postal systems alive, buy stamps and mail often

25 Jan 2010
07:57:12pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

I just looked up Malta in an 2003 Scott catalog and I could only find 74-76 missing. Perhaps these were either stamps of great value and not available in the open market place or just deliberately left off to fill in a possible gap. I looked all the way up to the late 80's and they seemed to continue numerically. Perry

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Harley

25 Jan 2010
10:01:25pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

My World Wide catalogs are old,1998,mainly because I've stopped collecting everything,but the J-O catalog (where Malta is) has ,under- "Vol 4, Number Aditions,Deletions & Changes"-page 960,has no changes to Malta.
However the other countries listed have,4 deleted,20 new numbers(added)and 11 number changes,which include several sets (total 24 number changes).And that's just for 1998.
As I said,this section is in the back of every Scott catalog,every year.And you can check this section to see what if any numbers have been added,deleted,or changed to a different number.
These changes are not repeated in the next addition. 1998 has 98 changes,1999 has 99 changes,etc.So if you skip a year,or 10,you wont know what and when the changes occured.The following catalog will have the changes incorporated into the listings as though they were always that way.No notation of the change,, from the previous designation to the new one.

Some older numbers changed too,,and several times.And in past as well as currently.

If you purchas an old stamp collection,most likely you will find many "wrong" ID numbers.Yes they are wrong useing a catalog of today.But when those stamps were hinged into the albums,they were correct.
And why I have catalogs from 1939 to 1998 and US specialized to 2008. As library reference,and to follow the ID number changes.
If you dont keep your old catalogs,at least copy the page/s of the ADC section so you can follow the changes,and back reference a possible misidentified item.
Or in this case,this thread,--missing numnbers.
TOM

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Harley

25 Jan 2010
10:21:47pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

A quick check,and from 1931 to 1952 only # 75 and 93 are missing,same in 1969,,I stopped here.
but some where along the line the others were dropped.
Someone want to follow through?????
TOM
edit to add--
1931 cat. list.
Malta
74- A16 2sh ultramarine & dull violet
(blue) 7.00 mint and used.
76- A18 10sh black 100.00 mint or used.
Ibeleive 76 is now 93,which is also a missing number in 1931,but present in 1998. No. 93 is listed and with same discription as 76 of 1931 cat.list.
I believe the missing numbers are only missing numbers,for the stamps are there,just different ID numbers today.
(need those number change charts).

(Message edited by HARLEY on January 25, 2010)

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Cjd
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26 Jan 2010
12:19:27am
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Malta's rather chaotic stamp-issuing practices had to give the Scott editors some heartburn back in the earlier days. They were changing from postage and revenue to postage, only, and back, via designs and overprints, and they had to have two sets of "self government" overprints, considering the first bout of self-government didn't take.

Pretty fascinating for a little country. Good looking stamps, too.

Collin

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Fatherauld

26 Jan 2010
07:50:00pm
re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Thanks for you input everyone. This has turned into quite an interesting thread.

Regards ... Tim.

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Author/Postings
Fatherauld

25 Jan 2010
04:35:00pm

OK, silly question time. I'm working on building album pages for my Malta stamps and just noticed that the Scott Cat that I'm working from often skips a sequence of numbers between series of stamps. Why would they do that?

Regards ... Tim.

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this post
Members Picture
Rgnpcs

25 Jan 2010
05:01:50pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Could be a printing error in the catalog.
What numbers are you referring too?
Ask Linn's this question.
Richaard

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members.ebay.com/abo ...

President - West Essex Philatelic Society www.wepsonline.org
25 Jan 2010
06:13:29pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

There are a couple of reasons I can think of.

1) Sometimes a stamp gets a catalog number then it turns out not to be a valid stamp used for postage. Once that is realized, then the number is removed from the catalogue.

2) Scott sometimes sets aside a group of numbers for a set. If the country does not issue enough stamps that were set aside, those numbers never get used.

This has happened with US Stamps there is no 3034-3035 or 3037-3043.

Bob

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"APS - AFDCS - GBCC - USSS - SCC - IPDA"

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Harley

25 Jan 2010
06:20:29pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Scott assigns groups of numbers to a series of stamps that usually add new issues of the same series or designs over several years.
Rather than cronologicaly listed dates as issued,the reserved numbers keeps the seris in one location,,instead of hunting them throughout the catalog(year of issue at later date).
Now,,if those series are discontinued,the numbers are not,they remain in limbo(missing).
If they dont reserve enough numbers,a change or rearrangement of numbers occur,such as the recent US forever stamp issues.
Sometimes they get it right,sometimes they dont,,and changes,additions and deletions are made.There is a section with that title in every Scott US catalog.
TOM

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this post
Fatherauld

25 Jan 2010
06:52:19pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Is Scott Cat reliable from one publication to the next. My Scott Cat is the 2007 edition. I am currently working in the early Malta stamps (around 1920 at the moment). If I purchase the 2010 edition, is it reasonably likely that the numbers will remain the same?

Regards ... Tim.

Like
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this post
Members Picture
amsd

Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
25 Jan 2010
07:18:30pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

they are mostly reliable, Tim, although with billions of entries and tons of changes with each new edition, errors are made, although, as fellow with ink in my veins, the errors are quite minimal. While I have many beefs with Scott, the number of errors in their 7-volume set is remarkably small.

the second question is more problematic, because Scott does rearrange, reassign, eliminate, and add number all the time, and they aren't necessarily the result of a corrected, or introduced, error, but rather a rethinking of the catalogue or new information. I don't know Malta at all, so i can't speak to specifics of that country or its catalogue, but it's not uncommon for Scott to resssign US number, usually more recent ones, but occasionally going all the way back to the beginning.

But most betting people would say it's unlikely that any given set of numbers will change between any two sets of years, UNLESS you're looking at an expanding set. For stamps of the 20s, i'd say there would be little chance of any change, other than in catalogue value.

David

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this post

"Save the USPS, buy stamps; save the hobby, use commemoratives"

juicyheads.com/link. ...
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Sponthetrona2

Keep Postal systems alive, buy stamps and mail often
25 Jan 2010
07:57:12pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

I just looked up Malta in an 2003 Scott catalog and I could only find 74-76 missing. Perhaps these were either stamps of great value and not available in the open market place or just deliberately left off to fill in a possible gap. I looked all the way up to the late 80's and they seemed to continue numerically. Perry

Like
Login to Like
this post
Harley

25 Jan 2010
10:01:25pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

My World Wide catalogs are old,1998,mainly because I've stopped collecting everything,but the J-O catalog (where Malta is) has ,under- "Vol 4, Number Aditions,Deletions & Changes"-page 960,has no changes to Malta.
However the other countries listed have,4 deleted,20 new numbers(added)and 11 number changes,which include several sets (total 24 number changes).And that's just for 1998.
As I said,this section is in the back of every Scott catalog,every year.And you can check this section to see what if any numbers have been added,deleted,or changed to a different number.
These changes are not repeated in the next addition. 1998 has 98 changes,1999 has 99 changes,etc.So if you skip a year,or 10,you wont know what and when the changes occured.The following catalog will have the changes incorporated into the listings as though they were always that way.No notation of the change,, from the previous designation to the new one.

Some older numbers changed too,,and several times.And in past as well as currently.

If you purchas an old stamp collection,most likely you will find many "wrong" ID numbers.Yes they are wrong useing a catalog of today.But when those stamps were hinged into the albums,they were correct.
And why I have catalogs from 1939 to 1998 and US specialized to 2008. As library reference,and to follow the ID number changes.
If you dont keep your old catalogs,at least copy the page/s of the ADC section so you can follow the changes,and back reference a possible misidentified item.
Or in this case,this thread,--missing numnbers.
TOM

Like
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this post
Harley

25 Jan 2010
10:21:47pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

A quick check,and from 1931 to 1952 only # 75 and 93 are missing,same in 1969,,I stopped here.
but some where along the line the others were dropped.
Someone want to follow through?????
TOM
edit to add--
1931 cat. list.
Malta
74- A16 2sh ultramarine & dull violet
(blue) 7.00 mint and used.
76- A18 10sh black 100.00 mint or used.
Ibeleive 76 is now 93,which is also a missing number in 1931,but present in 1998. No. 93 is listed and with same discription as 76 of 1931 cat.list.
I believe the missing numbers are only missing numbers,for the stamps are there,just different ID numbers today.
(need those number change charts).

(Message edited by HARLEY on January 25, 2010)

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Cjd

26 Jan 2010
12:19:27am

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Malta's rather chaotic stamp-issuing practices had to give the Scott editors some heartburn back in the earlier days. They were changing from postage and revenue to postage, only, and back, via designs and overprints, and they had to have two sets of "self government" overprints, considering the first bout of self-government didn't take.

Pretty fascinating for a little country. Good looking stamps, too.

Collin

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this post
Fatherauld

26 Jan 2010
07:50:00pm

re: Malta: Missing numbers and number changes in Scott catalog

Thanks for you input everyone. This has turned into quite an interesting thread.

Regards ... Tim.

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