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Club Business & Announcements/Member Intro : Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

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Avi
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11 Oct 2009
12:18:58pm
I started collecting stamps at three times in my life, when I was in grade school, when I was at the end of HS and finally but not last while serving in VietNam.
I have stuck to the last at more than one time, gone back to the MNH "never touched by human hands" (LOL) and back to my collection of "Socked-in-the-Nose" stamps.
This time (68 years old) I think will stick to this beauties for (hopefully) many years to come.
Once you have a few CTO's you can see that no matter country, shape, denomination, etc will EVER be finished, so while somebody is looking for an elusive stamp I am searching for ANY SOTN cancelltion regardless of all above.
Thank you Lee! I really appreciate your gift!
The same to Elizabeth Jones.
A hug in general,
LuisM (Avi)
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Bobstamp
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11 Oct 2009
12:45:04pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

SOTN is the best!

Now please tell us how you started collecting stamps in Vietnam, of all places and times. (Note for those who don't know: Avi is a veteran of the Vietnam War, and thus a hero in my eyes.)

When I was in Vietnam, I mostly collected leaches, memories (most of them bad), and scars.

Bob I.

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Avi
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12 Oct 2009
01:07:40pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Hero? What heroe? I just got tangled in a position I couldn't get out, Ha Shem forbid I shot myself on a foot!
Very easy, some of the letters specially coming from th Southern States did bring quite a good postages. I placed all in a separate box which now I can not find but guess some day I will and post in an album all by itself.
Leaches......obnoxious and repugnant creatures! You could walk through the jungle for a day and never notice you had one sucking the blood from your belly, buttocks etc.
Remember, I always correct people when they tell me "Oh you WENT to 'Nam!" with "a correction please I was taken to VietNam!" quite different one from the other! Remember the leaches that were hanging from the foliage?
I met a guy that used to urinate blood, finally the medic took him to the hospital, the problem was a very thin but long (when fully developed) worm that entered the body through the urethra and took refuge in the bladder; this made me quite nervous and made sure there wasn't any blood when urinating.
When I returned couldn't give a horse's rear end what people used to yell at me "things like "How many kids did you kill?" and other epithets.
Also there was my mother at this end of the Earth and I told her to BUY stamps every time she saw a new one come out.
So there we are dear Bob I. we served because we had no other choice. Just think NOW a son or grandson wants to serve, what will be your answer? I know mine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hugs dear friend and all
LuisM

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Bobstamp
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12 Oct 2009
02:35:51pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Luis, there are heroes and there are heroes. Some are noticed and get medals, most are not. You're a hero because you did your best in a situation which tried our souls, damaged or ruined our bodies, and challenged our sanity. To me, it's a noble act when ordinary guys fight like hell, not for Democracy, not for God and Country, and not because they are patriotic, but for their buddies. By the grim end of my tour of duty, I didn't give a damn who won as long as we corpsmen and Marines got the hell out of there. Of course, no one won. Everyone lost. A true Pyrrhic victory.

I like your statement that you were taken to Vietnam, and didn't go willingly. I went, in the mistaken belief that I would actually be preserving something worth preserving, which was democracy in South Vietnam. It turned out that there was no democracy worth preserving, and that the great majority of Vietnamese didn't want us there.

As you know, I collect stamps and postal history related to the war. They well document the "descent into madness" of France, the U.S. and its allies, as well as the National Liberation Front, North Vietnam, and its allies. I've even got an Indochina cover and contents from the 1890s written by a French soldier who mentions the danger posed by Vietnamese snipers.

Bob

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
13 Oct 2009
10:00:25am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

I love reading these epistles, momentarily sad my connection is at a distance, although i'm of an age and eligibility that could have landed me there (kicking and screaming, I can assure you); but so glad, then and now, that i had nearly the best number ever. only the intercessions of, say, a Texas Lieutenant Governor or some such would have been safer.

And the Pyrrhic victory requires, i'm pretty sure, victory.

David

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Bobstamp
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13 Oct 2009
10:43:46am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Well, the communists won, and plunged Vietnam into a modern economic and political dark age. Their nation and its communities was blasted and burned and poisoned, its population decimated. Seems Pyrrhic to me!

Bob

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Sponthetrona2
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Keep Postal systems alive, buy stamps and mail often
13 Oct 2009
11:15:39am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Although I was associated in this country when called Indochina (short term visits) and then while serving in the U. S. Air Force during the early stages of the skirmish (Vietnam) I will only say this, war like all wars, are just a waste of 20 year kids who gave their lives for what their country (politicians) claimed was a National Security Issue. Yea right! Concerning collecting stamps and postal history I kick myself for not collecting more, but at that time in my life I had a new Japanese wife and two small children to support living in Japan. What I did collect I've saved as family history to give to my adopted Vietnamese daughter and my two half Japanese children. These are the innocents. Perry

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tooler
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21 Apr 2013
08:36:33pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Avi, I'm new here and still trying to find my way around. I also collect SOTN cancels.
Have a few hundred and always looking.

PS: How do I do an Avatar?

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lisagrant87
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21 Apr 2013
08:58:35pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Can someone show me an example of an SOTN? I'm curious!

Tooler - go to the membership page from the home page
Go to edit your Membership information
Towards the bottom of that page, under Misc, youll find the place to upload a picture.
Hope that helps!

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Logistical1
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21 Apr 2013
09:29:24pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Lisa SOTN is is a stamp with a cancel perfectly in the center of the stamp thus or "socked on the nose".

I probably have a couple hundred of them in the many shoe boxes of unsorted stamps in my closet. I really should start sorting through them one of these days

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BobbyBarnhart
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21 Apr 2013
09:34:52pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Lisa, I also see it frequently abbreviated "SON"

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lisagrant87
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21 Apr 2013
11:23:48pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

I sort of assumed that was what they were. How common is that? Do they generally happen by accident or by careful postal workers? Or is it mostly from people who cancel their own stamps?

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cdj1122
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22 Apr 2013
03:02:07am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

In some countries, Lisa they are quite common.In Denmark and Norway the postal employees seem to take their time and have some pride in their work. In the US almost all mail is run through an impersonal machine automatic canceller.
In the UK they were fairly common until about ten years ago when hey increased the size of the cancelers and further automated the process.
On all my mail, even common bill payments I always affix the postage stamp down a little from the top edge and in far enough that there is a chance the stamp will get a nice SOTN.

Far too many mailers, sometimes even collectors who ought to know better squeeze the postage stamp so close to the right edge and top that they never get a nice clean SOTN.

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
22 Apr 2013
08:37:57am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Lisa,

SON is virtually impossible except by design. One can, as Charlie suggests, place the stamp in part of the cover more likely to receive the desired portion of the cancel, but today's automated material are all spray ons not likely to bring about a pretty or legible cancel. For any kind of circular SON cancel, one needs to have a clerk hand cancel it.


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CapeStampMan
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Mike
22 Apr 2013
09:29:50am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Lisa,
My present Avatar is mostly SON, but not completely. Some collector's grade the degree, or amount of SON and have a value added for the higher degrees. Here is a pretty good example of a SON stamp:

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Of course it should be better centered, but this is just an example.

Mike

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BobbyBarnhart
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22 Apr 2013
11:20:33am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Just as a matter of curiosity, does a SON cancel have to be a CDS? Would any one(or more) of these be considered a SON?

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cdj1122
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
22 Apr 2013
11:49:25am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

I have been accumulating SOTNs for years.

Here is one page full, one of many.

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I also accumulate cancellations with some interesting placement.

Charlie,
Lecanto, Florids

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BobbyBarnhart
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22 Apr 2013
01:35:36pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

That last stamp is a jewel, Charlie!

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
22 Apr 2013
01:58:28pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

that's Queenie, right?

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22 Apr 2013
04:31:33pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

David -

Charlie might have to think about that one - that's a very confusing stamp! LOL

Kelly

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Mike
23 Apr 2013
11:17:36am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Very nice stamps Charlie, especially the last one!

Just for the heck of it I Googled SOTN and here is their response:

Socked on the nose ("SON"), also called Bullseye, in philately, refers to a cancellation of a postage stamp in which the postmark, typically a circle with the date and town name where mailed, has been applied centered on the stamp.[1][2] The ideal SON has the entire postmark inside the margins, although this is not always possible, because the stamp may be too small or the postmark too large.

Mike

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drmicro68
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23 Apr 2013
08:34:10pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

There WAS a "Bullseye Cancellation Society" that has come and gone. It was reincarnated a few years back, I joined, and then it disappeared again (at least I cannot find any contacts and the website is long gone). Goals of some SOTN collectors is to make a calendar with the dates found. One option is 1 stamp for each day of the year. Other do their birth year and/or their birth date. I decided to be (you've gotta be kidding) ambitious and make a calendar for every year I could find. Right now it is a few scattered pages/months/days/years and a few shoe boxes full waiting for placement. That may never come to pass. The BCS was encouraging, but never gained much traction in its last incarnation.

Roger

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tooler
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29 Apr 2013
01:34:48pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Someone wanted to see a SOTN cancel. (Socked On The Nose)Here's one from my collection.
Image Not Found

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cocollectibles
29 Apr 2013
03:35:03pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Tooler, great Vickie from Jersey! Thumbs Up

Here is one from my collection, of a Hong Kong Vickie with what LOOKS like a killer "M" cancel. There was much speculation as to whether this was a never issued Macau cancel but closer inspection actually shows it to be an A1 Amoy cancel, possibly an N1 Ningpo cancel. I still don't see it but that's the conclusion.

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If it were an M obliterator, it would be the only recorded usage of such. Of course, with my luck, ... no such luck!

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cocollectibles
29 Apr 2013
03:47:57pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Here are a couple of other SON/SOTN cancels, on China stamps. From my collection.

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lisagrant87
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29 Apr 2013
08:36:58pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

For something that's so rare, there sure are a lot of them out there! Are there this many postal workers who care when they cancel stamps? Or this many collectors who have their mail hand cancelled?

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rrraphy
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Retired Ap. Book Mod, Pres Golden Gate Stamp Club, Hi Tech Consultant
29 Apr 2013
09:51:30pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Here is my latest SON acquisition Sorry Kim, I paid more than a penny, but very little, as it was in a ww lot of mostly penny stuff....so it is not valid as your avatar prize. The cancel is a bit dark, and one corner perforation is nibbed, but it was quite an unexpected valuable find.

(moderator removed sale offer)

No certificate, but it was reviewed by experts at a stamp show, who verbally said it was used for postage.
rrr...

Image Not Found



(Modified by Moderator on 2013-04-30 05:40:18)

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BobbyBarnhart
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30 Apr 2013
05:37:36am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Sorry, rrr, but I had to modify your post slightly as offers to sell must be placed in the Sales topic and accompanied by certain necessary details which are missing here.

Bobby Barnhart
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jillcrow
30 Apr 2013
09:31:43am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Prurient details? I Don't Want To See I hope not.

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BobbyBarnhart
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30 Apr 2013
11:44:04am
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Just so everyone knows and can properly laugh at my unfortunate choice of words (I have since edited my post replacing the poor choice with the more appropriate “necessary”), I committed a major faux pas and deserve all the derision anyone wishes to toss my way.Blushing

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lisagrant87
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30 Apr 2013
05:31:16pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Bobby,
I admit, I had to look up the word, but when I did I was Laughing then Rolling On The Floor Laughing then Rolling On The Floor Laughing so hard I was Crying. I won't pick on you at all, instead I will thank you kindly for the much needed laugh. And I was laughing with you, not at you!! Thank you! Big Grin

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cocollectibles
01 May 2013
12:59:32pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Michael, that's a great SON, by definition on the nose too!Thumbs Up

One frustration I have with finding nice total SON cancels is that the cancel is oftentimes larger than the stamp, especially for smaller definitives. So I look for doubles or blocks, but then they sometimes have more than one cancel, which in my definition is not SON, unless there is a cancel clearly centered on each pair (or on each of the block). Here is my SON compromise for a pair. I recently got this from a dealer in GB, mostly for the Boer War era cancel. As you can see, not quite fully SON but the key wording on the cancel is captured.

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Cheers,
Peter

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Martyn
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01 May 2013
01:26:12pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

How about these two from Guyana? The first posted from Nigg P.O. (yes I know I shouldn't have taken it off the envelope)

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The next is one I acquired recently and is a CTO from Georgetown, I always thought CTO's just catch the corners of the stamp, not this one though.

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tooler
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01 May 2013
02:07:38pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Here is a nice SOTN: Great Britain Sc#251

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tooler
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01 May 2013
02:09:25pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Another one from Germany: Sc#154 SOTN

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tooler
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01 May 2013
02:20:19pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Here is one from Ceylon, a Telegraph stamp. I can't find the Sc# in the catalog. Any help would be appreciated.

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lisagrant87
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It is during our darkest moments that we must focus to see the light. - Aristotle Onassis
02 May 2013
02:35:02pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Mdroth-
I was referring to what amsd said in a previous post.

"SON is virtually impossible except by design. One can, as Charlie suggests, place the stamp in part of the cover more likely to receive the desired portion of the cancel, but today's automated material are all spray ons not likely to bring about a pretty or legible cancel. For any kind of circular SON cancel, one needs to have a clerk hand cancel it."

So they clearly aren't all that rare. Does that mean that a lot of people have clerks hand cancel their mail? I'm just curious because it seems to be something that wouldn't happen all that often but it apparently does.



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youpiao
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02 May 2013
04:26:01pm
re: Luis Mendes: Why I collect SOTN's

Not only are there lots of collectors who have clerks hand-stamp their covers, but there are even those collectors who create their own personal handstamp for cancelling stamps. You have to get a Mailer's Postmark Permit to do this, for which you will most likely need to go to a large PO. The clerk at my local small-town PO didn't know what the heck I was talking about when I inquired about one.

Tedski

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