Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I failed Computers for dummies so I can't get it here. Anyway, it works 99.9% of the time.
took me 6 months to figure it out and get it
to work this well. Will tell about it sometime.
Hope you like it. I do. will list some of ones
I've done for sale soon.
BTW: look under: Other Philately Related.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on March 09, 2010)
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Dear Stampaholic,
The site keeps me around as an example of one still working with clay tablets and a chisel. Know that any problem you have along the computer lines will be addressed by very knowledgeable folk, who are patient and kind.
Every now and again Merlin appears and makes things right with a wave of his wand-I kid you not. (Father Auld is his common name, but we know who he really is!!)
Never feel out of step if you want to share something here-we all appreciate learning new things.
All good thoughts,
Dan
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BTW: there's a couple of toughies in those self-
adhesives particularly the die cut imperfs that are real thin.
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Here are Stampaholic's Soaking instructions.
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Dear Stampoholic,
Told ya!!
Dear Wizard,
Many thanks
Dan
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Thank you, thank you, thank you. It works great!!!
Tom C.
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Cool! Consider it my donation to Stamporama members. Thanks, Father Tim!
You're welcome, Tom! My pleasure.
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Site for Soakability of recent US Stamps.
I found this quite helpful when it comes to soaking the unsoakble.
There is a color guide beside each stamps, Red do not soak, green- soak with care, yellow go ahead and soak
Lee
http://www.virtualstampclub.com/2008usnew.html
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Lee: good site and while I didn't check out all of them, if there any Ashton-Potter stamps that
do say soakable in water (green-light); I personally have not found any Ashton-Potter stamps that are.
Also Lee, you got your colors backward there,
yellow soak w/ caution, green go ahead and soak.
PS. Anybody know why a stoplight turns red?
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Hi Everyone;
I tried the method noted above on a few USA recent stamps. Of the 8 stamps I removed from paper most look good, except for this one. Garbage!!
As you can see, the surface of the stamp has small cracks all over it, and the black background is discoloured in some places.
Before you ask, NO I did place the stamp in ANY water.
My next question is how do you get the sticky gum off your fingers? LOL
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Lee Payette has this set listed in the auction at the moment and her copy of this stamp looks pretty good. I wasn't as lucky as she was. 
I did not bend the stamp at all but gently lifted it off the paper it was stuck to.
I'll don my face mask again tomorrow and try this lighter fluid/baby powder method with a few self-adhesive Australian stamps that I know are impossible to soak off paper no matter what you do. They totally disintegrate. Will let you know how I make out 
If it doesn't work I may place the unsoakable stamps in the wood stove and light a match (to the stamps not the lighter fluid).
If nothing else I smelled like a freshly powdered baby when I was finished and have a very few nice USA stamps.
Liz
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BTW: I have had some limited success soaking by
putting stamps in water and heating the bowl in the microwave. sometimes the hotter water breaks down the glue also. of course this is like sending cash in the mail, you know.
Actually , using lighter fluid serves a 2-fold purpose for me. In case my ex-wife ever tries to
take my collection, it will burn faster. lol.
On a more serious note: my critics (not here)
have said using lighter fluid is bad over time.
However I have used lighter fluid to watermark
stamps for almost 50 years. Have many old classics
in my collection in as good a shape as they were
50 years ago.
Have observed though that Gb defins sometimes darken when using lighter fluid to wm them.
Now as to the effects of baby powder. Although
I only have done this for a little over a year
the stamps seem to be holding up quite well.
There is a slight tendency for a small spot to
be a little sticky if the baby powder by chance lightly covering the back and wears off.
Also I tend to wipe the face of the stamp with a kleenex to get any powder off of it.
Anyone know the famous poet, Ogden Nash's poem about babies?
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a couple of observations, I had a few stamps that turned out like the one Liz pictured and discovered that it was because I had gotten the talc on the front, it is apparently abrasive so one must be careful about getting it on the front of the stamp. Also, I have found that using newspaper as opposed to a paper towel works better for me..and lastly, I have switched to corn starch but have no idea of the long term effects this may have..will let you know in a couple of years!!
Also by expiermenting--it doesn't work on GB but it does work on Canada--at least the two Canadian stamps I tried it on.
Tom C.
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GB started making stamps that are supposed to be
impossible to soak. Actually i haven't found any Canada that won't soak in water yet. If there are any , let me know. I have noticed that sometimes baby powder seems to get into the front of the stamp, I think perhaps because of the type of
printing process (possibly engraved stamps)?
I wipe the front of the stamp with a kleenex
real well to get any powder off.
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I haven't found any Canadian stamps yet that do not soak well. We still use a lot of sheet stamps. I guess it's about 50-50 between sheet and self-adhesive stamps.
Liz
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Does it go without saying that one wouldn't want to combine the lighter fluid technique and the microwave technique?
Then again, maybe its safe...my microwave doesn't have a warning label telling me not to do it.
I love how Canada stamps pop right off the paper...USPS could learn a thing or two (or twenty).
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Don't tell Canada Post how easy it is to soak Canadian stamps. They'll probably change their gumming technique and raise the prices again. Thanks to our federal government the tax on postage stamps when purchased will jump another 7-9% on June 30th, on top of the 5% GST we already pay, depending on which province you are in when you purchase the stamps.
The only complaint I have with Canadian stamps is SOME of the souvenir sheets. The stamps have a tendency to separate on the souvenir sheets if placed in water, no matter how carefully and how quickly or slowly you remove them.
Someone told me if you slip a piece of paper under the souvenir sheet while it is still in the water (once the s/sheet floats off the backing paper) and then lift the paper and the s/sheet out of the water it will not separate. This has not worked for me.
Most of the new 2009 and 2010 souvenir sheets soak ok but if the perforations run right to the edge of the sheet these sheets can give me a problem.
I'll try the lighter fluid method on a sheet that is damaged to see if it makes any difference with the perf separation problem. Maybe if I soak the paper on the back of the stamp while the sheet is laying facedown, remove the backing paper and just leave the souvenir sheet until it is dry I may have more success.
Perhaps I'm not holding my mouth correctly?
Tom - how do you avoid getting the baby powder on the front of the stamps? I wonder if corn starch is less abrasive than baby powder?
Question to all: Why do you have to put ANY powder of any kind on the stamps? Will they not dry almost instantly after being soaked in lighter fluid?
Someone is bound to pop into this discussion to say 'why put yourselves through all this aggrevation - either leave on the paper or collect the cover intact'. The answer is that we are stubborn and determined to find a way to remove our beautiful stamps from scraps of paper.
I'm NOT a cover collector! 'I' want my stamps off paper and put into my album!
BTW - I used lighter fluid on a couple of the newer Australian self-adhesive stamps and they look GOOD!
Liz
A Stubborn Individual who collects what stamps she wants the way SHE wants to collect them.
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In my experience some of the U.S. stamps never seem to lose their gum, despite long soaking in lighter fluid. One can, however, use a paper towel dipped in fluid to remove the gum completely by carefully rubbing from the center of the stamp outward. It's a slow process, but it eliminates the need for the corn starch or baby powder.
As for using a microwave to "boil" a stamp free, my "success" has been short lived. If one thinks about it, subjecting stamps to high heat and liquids is actually a reversal of the paper making process. So, if your intention is to make pulp, this is a method one might like to try.
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Right on! Liz! exactly why I came up with this
method. I like my stamps as stamps not with a piece of paper attached. Even Scott has caved to the process by saying the value is on or off paper.A few years ago, a stamp on paper would have been considered the same as a CTO, in my opinion.<p>
Why the baby powder? The gum stays sticky as "H".
took me some time to figure out a way to neutralize that. I've done about a 1000 stamps and Only like 1 out of a 100 have I had any problems with.<p>
As to the cornstarch, I tend to agree with Liz, it appears to me as abrasive or more than baby
powder. Also being a foodstuff, I think perhaps
it might turn color with age. food is dated, baby powder lasts forever.( aside note, using cornstarch should work well on Chinese stamps,
you could always stir fry them {just teasing, Tom].Also thought of using powdered sugar, but heck, I'd eat them. Then again, I might try sweet-n-low but I hate the taste of saccharin.<p>
Incidentally, baby powder s/b a controlled substance. It gets everywhere. won't have change the diaper on my computer for ages. Of course, that depends.
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I gotta tell you, though this way is a lot better than before I knew about unsoakble stamps. Have 4 sets of Star wars stamps to attest to that. And others that have flecks and specks and wrinkles,
not to mention downright disintregation. That
illegal immigration stamp(sorry)/CA vs. Mendez
stamp was a beach(I just bought a mint one at $.13 over face so as a I can use it ot get me a good used copy (after I use my lighter fluid on it
of course).
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BOB: I did say "limited" success.
Am saving the microwave, lighter fluid & boil method for when I visit Washington, D.C.(Yo! Secret Service! It's a joke!)
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I have been reading all the posts concerning the removal of stamps from paper, and after months of experimenting, I come come up with the solution. Here it was, right under my nose, but I finally figured it out. The answer is urine. Yes, I said urine. Just pee in a glass, and heat the urine so it is warm, not hot. Place stamp, or stamps in a tray, face down, and pour a little urine over them, and in just a few seconds the stamps will come right off the paper. Then rinse the stamps in cold water, and dry. I must caution you though that blue stamps may turn green, and orange stamps may turn red if left in the urine too long.
Richaard
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APRIL FOOL!
My previous message concerning the use of urine for removing stamps from paper is an April Fool joke, but who knows, it might really work.
I have not tried it out.
Richaard
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You got me!
Larry
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Unfortunately, I got Richards first posting before the second posting. What a wonderful idea Richard. It worked great. I wish that you'd been quicker in your second posting though.
Regards ... Tim.
(Message edited by fatherauld on April 01, 2010)
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And I get complaints about lighter fluid.
Good time for a joke but not April fools.
I stay away from April fools.Anyway.
redneck definition of "urinal": in everything.
Example: I took 8 pictures and urinal of them.
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BTW, I did not want to wait too long in posting my second post on soaking in urine, for I was afraid that some of you might have tried it, and licked your fingers, then you would be mad at me, maybe!
One has to enjoy life with laughter.
Richaard
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how do you get rid of the petroleum odor a lighter fluid soaked stamp now has?
I don't to the talcum powder as I like the gum with which I "reconstruct" the pane with used, canceled stamps. thanks for suggestion even if the stamps do stink.
Mike Cherrington
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just a little update here. For me this method is working great 99.9% of the time had a coil pr. of $.41 flags where the paper wouldn't hardly come off but other than that it's producing A-1 stamps
w/o paper.
Please be advised the lighter fluid does have
fumes and the the baby powder gets in the air
so you can breathe them both in if you don't watch.
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Hi! y'all. just thought I'd bring this up to date.
lots of people still complaining about the unsoakable. This little method is still doing the job. Had a little problem with my one of my express mail stamps (bummer). tiny bit of glue was stubborn
and stuck so I got a little paper separation on back. otherwise they're all coming off well.
BTW, not sure how this works on foreign stamps. haven't had any problems.
got back from cruise to the Bahamas. All I got was a few stamps and a bad cold.
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Use lighter fluid with plenty of ventilation. The stuff's carcinogenic. But life seems to be carcinogenic these days.
Bob
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noticed in my APS magazine: they finally did an article about soaking. They say use Bestine.
It works and it's good but it's also expensive.
like $4.50 for a 4oz. can & $10.00 for a larger one 8,9,or 10 ozs. Anyway. Rosonol at Walmart was $1.57 for 8 oz.
Now, let me tell what lighter fluid won't work on.
Lots of Austria . old Austria. I tried to get an
1858 Lombardy-Venetia off paper and it didn't do a thing. Zero,zilch, nada. BTW, it was the lowest value of the bunch, cv. of $7.50 and it is creased. Actually, I have had problems getting issues of Austria off paper as late as the 1950's.
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Lighter fluid is not used to remove stamps from paper. Where did you get the idea that it did It is used to watermark stamps.
Richaard
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Tom - there is no problem soaking Canadian self-adhesive stamps. At least I haven't found any issues that do not soak in water and they lift off or float over fairly easily.
IF I use lighter fluid for USA or Gt. Britain self-adhesive stamps I use it outdoors. Lighter fluid and baby powder does work for the removal of most modern self-adhesive stamps from paper.
Liz
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Liz; soaked some of those Canadian defins. had soak them 3 times in hot water and still had some trouble. Also had a problem with some of the Canada Tourist attraction stamps. they came off the paper easy but when they dried the gum was still there, so I used the baby powder.
Richard: Actually, I was watermarking stamps and
noticed on the can that it says "excellent for
removing labels". So I tried it on a few of those crummy forever stamps (US) and it worked great.
but they were still sticky. Then, I remembered
when I was young (was really poor when I was young, now I'm just poor)we used to put baby powder on old playing cards to keep them from sticking together so I tried it and it works great and that's how I came up with my "soaking
the unsoakable" method.
As I've stated before it works 99.9% of the time,
for me anyway. The hardest ones are the ATM booklet stamps mainly because they are so thin.
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Right on, Liz! Your experience is my experience.
Also, in addition to watermarking, lighter fluid (naphtha) can be used quite successfully to remove self adhesive stamps from paper, as you have noted. That also includes those difficult ones such as the U.S. Supreme Court as well as all the earlier black background stamps.
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Actually the can of lighter fluid doesn't say
anything about fumes being harmful (although there are fumes and I don't do more than 10 stamps at a time, just to be on the safe side).
It does say it can be harmful or fatal if swallowed. Also , it mentions that it can be a skin irritant ( I personnally have never had that
problem , but then again I'm a tough old bird and my skin's not as sensitive as some people). It does say to use lots of water to wash it off if
you do have that problem.
It also says keep out of reach of children.
And it is highly flammable.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on October 28, 2010)
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BTW: I don't think anyone ever answered me about
my stoplight riddle. "Why does a stoplight turn
red?". Answer: you'd turn red too if you had to change in the middle of the street.
Also Ogden Nash's poem on babies:
"A little bit of talcum
Is always walcum".
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About lighter fluid: Depending on the jurisdiction, products may or may not list the dangers inherent in using them, so you can't necessarily go by labels to inform you of any hazards. Corporate profits, at least the profits of many companies, depend on their customers NOT knowing about their hazardous products. That's why the tobacco industry has had to be beaten about the head and shoulders to get them to put warning labels on cigarettes.
Anyway, lighter fluid is carcinogenic and evaporates quickly. If you can smell it, you're breathing it. Always use it in a well ventilated area. I use it for watermarking in the kitchen under the oven hood, with the fan on high and the kitchen window open.
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Hey! gang! don't get me wrong here. I agree with all the advisory comments made. In my case The ac is straight across from me and is pulling the air and fumes right it's way.
And I ain't none too sure about the baby powder.
breathing in that stuff for the respiratory system probably is not the best thing in the world. the only warning on it is keep the lid closed tight and out of reach of children.
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Thank you for telling us why stop signs turn red. Interesting thread especially Richard's April Fool.
Thanks
Kathy
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12:24:35pm
In place of lighter fluid which is rather dangerous I have used rubbing alcohol (Isopropanol or "Surgical Spirits in the UK) for many years as a watermark detector. I find that a 20 or 30 second immersion of an old jar that can be immediately recovered loosens almost all the noxious gums being used these days.
.
It is also flamable but I believe less so than lighter fluid.
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12:24:35pm
In place of lighter fluid which is rather dangerous I have used rubbing alcohol (Isopropanol or "Surgical Spirits in the UK) for many years as a watermark detector. I find that a 20 or 30 second immersion of an old jar that can be immediately recovered loosens almost all the noxious gums being used these days.
.
It is also flamable but I believe less so than lighter fluid.
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Having done an immense study on how to remove s/a stamps I finally came up with this (and using anything to dust the back of the stamp, eventually dusts everything else and my customers won't buy a dusted stamp, they are very discernible).
I use lighter fluid and it slips right off the paper. I then take a Q-tip dipped in the solvent and gently rub off the rest of the adhesive. I then swish it gently around in a bowl of water with a few drops of liquid dish soap, then a bowl of rinse water which gets rid of the lighter fluid and then place it in my drying book for a few days. Within a minute all is done. No cracks, no remaining solvent or adhesive and I get a perfectly removed flat s/a stamp.
I've used lighter fluid to watermark stamps for years, but always use the "wash/rinse" method afterwards.
I will try the rubbing alcohol to see if I can eliminate the Q-tip step which would be a big plus! but believe I would still follow up with a "wash/rinse" afterward.
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Tried the alcohol, works good; however, fumes and flammability same as lighter fluid in my opinion.
Also will stick with the baby powder, faster & easier. Stamps I did two years ago shows no signs of any deterioration. stamps I watermarked 50 years in excellent shape.
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Yo! Pat! Check this out. Pros & Cons.
But not good for the kids. alcohol or lighter fluid either one.
I tried the really hot water method took me about 6 hours to get 100 Australia S/As off paper.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on February 11, 2011)
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This is one area that I just don't understand. I know the old school is to soak the paper off the stamp. However, as technology and stamp printing changes, it is obvious that it takes hours to remove the paper off a stamp that usually isn't worth much of anything other than minimum value. I just cut the paper as close as is safely possible without damaging the stamp, put it in a mount and put it in my album. I don't have the expense of buying all those chemicals, and the enormous amount of time taken to work on just one stamp. I have heard the argument that the paper from the envelope adds thickness to the stamp in the mount. Well, so does the backing paper of the unused stamp, so that is not a valid argument.
People have tried to explain this compulsion (and in some cases a manic need) to remove the paper from these stamps. As I said, it doesn't make sense to me. But, it's your collection, time and money. I'd rather buy more stamps with the money and spend the time adding those stamps to my albums. Personal choice to be sure, but it just baffles me the unwillingness to change and adapt, and sit there frustrated over the futility of the effort expended. All I can say is enjoy your work!? I'll just continue to shake my head in wonder over this....
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10:48:10am
I think that the idea of backing paper adding to the thickness is only a part of the problem. Paper used for envelopes varies dramatically in thickness.
There is no way of knowing what its acidity is. or what the chemical reaction between the stamp, the glutinous crap and the paper the stamp was used on might be.
Then there is the possibility that the reaction might migrate through the album page and over years affect the stamp on the page behind the source. You can often see this effect on old albums that used certain kinds of mounts during the thirties and forties in the brown stain that has travelled onto the next page.
I have the major part of my world wide collection (1840 - 1975) mounted with hinges in a set of Minkus Supreme and Minkus Master Global binders. As pages filled the thickness of the stamps has made the album look, almost stuffed. Leaving the layer of glue and the thickness of miscellaneous paper backings would double or even triple that stuffed look.
As to people who use various trimmed mounts, personally, unless you start with heavier paper for the album even their weight can make a filled album look dingy.
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I can agree with that, and have seen what you are talking about. But, with all the chemicals being used to remove the paper from the self-adhesives, what is the long-term affect on the paper, album pages, mounts, etc. from all that stuff? Not all of it is safe on paper.
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11:04:53pm
" ...But, with all the chemicals being used to remove the paper from the self-adhesives, what is the long-term affect on the paper, album pages, mounts, etc. from all that stuff?
If I were 17 years old and not 71 years young, I'd stick around fifty years and find out.
.
I have also considered that problem, or potential problem, but just do not know. I even wondered if, after ten or twenty years, the talcom powder being used on occasion would turn black or brown or even accumulate moisture that could harm the stamps.
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11:15:16pm
" ... I tried the method noted above on a few USA recent stamps. Of the 8 stamps I removed from paper most look good, except for this one. Garbage!! ..." 
I have tried with limited success to get decent used examples of this set. I have acceptable examples of five of them but found easily ten or twenty that were ruined in the same manner.
Yes, Garbage.
These people are killing the hobby.
And no, they care not one wit, preferring to have collectors settle for mint mini-sheets.
And as long as hobbiests fuel the insanity by purchasing and saving mint sheetlets the Postal people will continue producing garbage.
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I think that it's an overstatement to say that the current low standards of stamp production "are killing the hobby". Of the 70 or so members of my stamp club, there aren't more than a handful who buy collect current stamps on a regular basis. Most are far more interested in older issues, of which there seem to be plenty. There is also the bald fact that we stamp collectors represent a miniscule market for any and all postal administrations. What Cdj1122 says they don't give a whit. Actually, they don't give a damn!
Perhaps it's useful to compare stamp collecting to the collecting of, say, WWII memorabilia -- uniforms, insignia, caps, helmets, guns, canteens, mess kits, etc. It's a popular hobby, but no one is producing new "issues" these days! I approach philately from the viewpoint that no one, literally, is producing any stamps these days that mean a thing to me. I don't care that I can't soak many current stamps off paper without damaging them.
Of course, there are collectors who do care, but I'm afraid they're going to have to learn to live with it. Will the "unsoakability" of current stamps destroy stamp collecting. I doubt it. The wide range of collecting possibilities and the large supply of stamps and covers guarantees that collecting will outlast any of us.
Bob
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Hi everyone
A while ago I bought some used GB security machins on eBay from a seller in Singapore. These were off paper with the security tabs undamaged. I asked him how he managed to separate from paper and was told:
Hi again Mr Stuart, it is not exactly a trade secret, what I use is a French chemical to soak them " EAU ECARLATE" and remove the gum after lifted by scrapping, soak, scrape till no more glue
Obviously haven't tried as I have not managed to source any of this apart from in France.
Maybe another way around this problem.
Stuart
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Auctions
Placed my method of soaking on auction board.
I failed Computers for dummies so I can't get it here. Anyway, it works 99.9% of the time.
took me 6 months to figure it out and get it
to work this well. Will tell about it sometime.
Hope you like it. I do. will list some of ones
I've done for sale soon.
BTW: look under: Other Philately Related.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on March 09, 2010)
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Dear Stampaholic,
The site keeps me around as an example of one still working with clay tablets and a chisel. Know that any problem you have along the computer lines will be addressed by very knowledgeable folk, who are patient and kind.
Every now and again Merlin appears and makes things right with a wave of his wand-I kid you not. (Father Auld is his common name, but we know who he really is!!)
Never feel out of step if you want to share something here-we all appreciate learning new things.
All good thoughts,
Dan
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Auctions
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
BTW: there's a couple of toughies in those self-
adhesives particularly the die cut imperfs that are real thin.
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07:53:37pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Here are Stampaholic's Soaking instructions.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Dear Stampoholic,
Told ya!!
Dear Wizard,
Many thanks
Dan
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08:03:53am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Thank you, thank you, thank you. It works great!!!
Tom C.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Cool! Consider it my donation to Stamporama members. Thanks, Father Tim!
You're welcome, Tom! My pleasure.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Site for Soakability of recent US Stamps.
I found this quite helpful when it comes to soaking the unsoakble.
There is a color guide beside each stamps, Red do not soak, green- soak with care, yellow go ahead and soak
Lee
http://www.virtualstampclub.com/2008usnew.html
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Lee: good site and while I didn't check out all of them, if there any Ashton-Potter stamps that
do say soakable in water (green-light); I personally have not found any Ashton-Potter stamps that are.
Also Lee, you got your colors backward there,
yellow soak w/ caution, green go ahead and soak.
PS. Anybody know why a stoplight turns red?
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07:16:39am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Hi Everyone;
I tried the method noted above on a few USA recent stamps. Of the 8 stamps I removed from paper most look good, except for this one. Garbage!!
As you can see, the surface of the stamp has small cracks all over it, and the black background is discoloured in some places.
Before you ask, NO I did place the stamp in ANY water.
My next question is how do you get the sticky gum off your fingers? LOL
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07:33:21am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Lee Payette has this set listed in the auction at the moment and her copy of this stamp looks pretty good. I wasn't as lucky as she was.
I did not bend the stamp at all but gently lifted it off the paper it was stuck to.
I'll don my face mask again tomorrow and try this lighter fluid/baby powder method with a few self-adhesive Australian stamps that I know are impossible to soak off paper no matter what you do. They totally disintegrate. Will let you know how I make out
If it doesn't work I may place the unsoakable stamps in the wood stove and light a match (to the stamps not the lighter fluid).
If nothing else I smelled like a freshly powdered baby when I was finished and have a very few nice USA stamps.
Liz
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
BTW: I have had some limited success soaking by
putting stamps in water and heating the bowl in the microwave. sometimes the hotter water breaks down the glue also. of course this is like sending cash in the mail, you know.
Actually , using lighter fluid serves a 2-fold purpose for me. In case my ex-wife ever tries to
take my collection, it will burn faster. lol.
On a more serious note: my critics (not here)
have said using lighter fluid is bad over time.
However I have used lighter fluid to watermark
stamps for almost 50 years. Have many old classics
in my collection in as good a shape as they were
50 years ago.
Have observed though that Gb defins sometimes darken when using lighter fluid to wm them.
Now as to the effects of baby powder. Although
I only have done this for a little over a year
the stamps seem to be holding up quite well.
There is a slight tendency for a small spot to
be a little sticky if the baby powder by chance lightly covering the back and wears off.
Also I tend to wipe the face of the stamp with a kleenex to get any powder off of it.
Anyone know the famous poet, Ogden Nash's poem about babies?
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01:08:15pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
a couple of observations, I had a few stamps that turned out like the one Liz pictured and discovered that it was because I had gotten the talc on the front, it is apparently abrasive so one must be careful about getting it on the front of the stamp. Also, I have found that using newspaper as opposed to a paper towel works better for me..and lastly, I have switched to corn starch but have no idea of the long term effects this may have..will let you know in a couple of years!!
Also by expiermenting--it doesn't work on GB but it does work on Canada--at least the two Canadian stamps I tried it on.
Tom C.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
GB started making stamps that are supposed to be
impossible to soak. Actually i haven't found any Canada that won't soak in water yet. If there are any , let me know. I have noticed that sometimes baby powder seems to get into the front of the stamp, I think perhaps because of the type of
printing process (possibly engraved stamps)?
I wipe the front of the stamp with a kleenex
real well to get any powder off.
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11:25:58pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
I haven't found any Canadian stamps yet that do not soak well. We still use a lot of sheet stamps. I guess it's about 50-50 between sheet and self-adhesive stamps.
Liz
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Does it go without saying that one wouldn't want to combine the lighter fluid technique and the microwave technique?
Then again, maybe its safe...my microwave doesn't have a warning label telling me not to do it.
I love how Canada stamps pop right off the paper...USPS could learn a thing or two (or twenty).
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12:55:43am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Don't tell Canada Post how easy it is to soak Canadian stamps. They'll probably change their gumming technique and raise the prices again. Thanks to our federal government the tax on postage stamps when purchased will jump another 7-9% on June 30th, on top of the 5% GST we already pay, depending on which province you are in when you purchase the stamps.
The only complaint I have with Canadian stamps is SOME of the souvenir sheets. The stamps have a tendency to separate on the souvenir sheets if placed in water, no matter how carefully and how quickly or slowly you remove them.
Someone told me if you slip a piece of paper under the souvenir sheet while it is still in the water (once the s/sheet floats off the backing paper) and then lift the paper and the s/sheet out of the water it will not separate. This has not worked for me.
Most of the new 2009 and 2010 souvenir sheets soak ok but if the perforations run right to the edge of the sheet these sheets can give me a problem.
I'll try the lighter fluid method on a sheet that is damaged to see if it makes any difference with the perf separation problem. Maybe if I soak the paper on the back of the stamp while the sheet is laying facedown, remove the backing paper and just leave the souvenir sheet until it is dry I may have more success.
Perhaps I'm not holding my mouth correctly?
Tom - how do you avoid getting the baby powder on the front of the stamps? I wonder if corn starch is less abrasive than baby powder?
Question to all: Why do you have to put ANY powder of any kind on the stamps? Will they not dry almost instantly after being soaked in lighter fluid?
Someone is bound to pop into this discussion to say 'why put yourselves through all this aggrevation - either leave on the paper or collect the cover intact'. The answer is that we are stubborn and determined to find a way to remove our beautiful stamps from scraps of paper.
I'm NOT a cover collector! 'I' want my stamps off paper and put into my album!
BTW - I used lighter fluid on a couple of the newer Australian self-adhesive stamps and they look GOOD!
Liz
A Stubborn Individual who collects what stamps she wants the way SHE wants to collect them.
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07:23:48am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
In my experience some of the U.S. stamps never seem to lose their gum, despite long soaking in lighter fluid. One can, however, use a paper towel dipped in fluid to remove the gum completely by carefully rubbing from the center of the stamp outward. It's a slow process, but it eliminates the need for the corn starch or baby powder.
As for using a microwave to "boil" a stamp free, my "success" has been short lived. If one thinks about it, subjecting stamps to high heat and liquids is actually a reversal of the paper making process. So, if your intention is to make pulp, this is a method one might like to try.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Right on! Liz! exactly why I came up with this
method. I like my stamps as stamps not with a piece of paper attached. Even Scott has caved to the process by saying the value is on or off paper.A few years ago, a stamp on paper would have been considered the same as a CTO, in my opinion.<p>
Why the baby powder? The gum stays sticky as "H".
took me some time to figure out a way to neutralize that. I've done about a 1000 stamps and Only like 1 out of a 100 have I had any problems with.<p>
As to the cornstarch, I tend to agree with Liz, it appears to me as abrasive or more than baby
powder. Also being a foodstuff, I think perhaps
it might turn color with age. food is dated, baby powder lasts forever.( aside note, using cornstarch should work well on Chinese stamps,
you could always stir fry them {just teasing, Tom].Also thought of using powdered sugar, but heck, I'd eat them. Then again, I might try sweet-n-low but I hate the taste of saccharin.<p>
Incidentally, baby powder s/b a controlled substance. It gets everywhere. won't have change the diaper on my computer for ages. Of course, that depends.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
I gotta tell you, though this way is a lot better than before I knew about unsoakble stamps. Have 4 sets of Star wars stamps to attest to that. And others that have flecks and specks and wrinkles,
not to mention downright disintregation. That
illegal immigration stamp(sorry)/CA vs. Mendez
stamp was a beach(I just bought a mint one at $.13 over face so as a I can use it ot get me a good used copy (after I use my lighter fluid on it
of course).
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BOB: I did say "limited" success.
Am saving the microwave, lighter fluid & boil method for when I visit Washington, D.C.(Yo! Secret Service! It's a joke!)
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
I have been reading all the posts concerning the removal of stamps from paper, and after months of experimenting, I come come up with the solution. Here it was, right under my nose, but I finally figured it out. The answer is urine. Yes, I said urine. Just pee in a glass, and heat the urine so it is warm, not hot. Place stamp, or stamps in a tray, face down, and pour a little urine over them, and in just a few seconds the stamps will come right off the paper. Then rinse the stamps in cold water, and dry. I must caution you though that blue stamps may turn green, and orange stamps may turn red if left in the urine too long.
Richaard
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
APRIL FOOL!
My previous message concerning the use of urine for removing stamps from paper is an April Fool joke, but who knows, it might really work.
I have not tried it out.
Richaard
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08:37:47pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Unfortunately, I got Richards first posting before the second posting. What a wonderful idea Richard. It worked great. I wish that you'd been quicker in your second posting though.
Regards ... Tim.
(Message edited by fatherauld on April 01, 2010)
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
And I get complaints about lighter fluid.
Good time for a joke but not April fools.
I stay away from April fools.Anyway.
redneck definition of "urinal": in everything.
Example: I took 8 pictures and urinal of them.
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BTW, I did not want to wait too long in posting my second post on soaking in urine, for I was afraid that some of you might have tried it, and licked your fingers, then you would be mad at me, maybe!
One has to enjoy life with laughter.
Richaard
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08:33:27am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
how do you get rid of the petroleum odor a lighter fluid soaked stamp now has?
I don't to the talcum powder as I like the gum with which I "reconstruct" the pane with used, canceled stamps. thanks for suggestion even if the stamps do stink.
Mike Cherrington
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
just a little update here. For me this method is working great 99.9% of the time had a coil pr. of $.41 flags where the paper wouldn't hardly come off but other than that it's producing A-1 stamps
w/o paper.
Please be advised the lighter fluid does have
fumes and the the baby powder gets in the air
so you can breathe them both in if you don't watch.
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Hi! y'all. just thought I'd bring this up to date.
lots of people still complaining about the unsoakable. This little method is still doing the job. Had a little problem with my one of my express mail stamps (bummer). tiny bit of glue was stubborn
and stuck so I got a little paper separation on back. otherwise they're all coming off well.
BTW, not sure how this works on foreign stamps. haven't had any problems.
got back from cruise to the Bahamas. All I got was a few stamps and a bad cold.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Use lighter fluid with plenty of ventilation. The stuff's carcinogenic. But life seems to be carcinogenic these days.
Bob
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noticed in my APS magazine: they finally did an article about soaking. They say use Bestine.
It works and it's good but it's also expensive.
like $4.50 for a 4oz. can & $10.00 for a larger one 8,9,or 10 ozs. Anyway. Rosonol at Walmart was $1.57 for 8 oz.
Now, let me tell what lighter fluid won't work on.
Lots of Austria . old Austria. I tried to get an
1858 Lombardy-Venetia off paper and it didn't do a thing. Zero,zilch, nada. BTW, it was the lowest value of the bunch, cv. of $7.50 and it is creased. Actually, I have had problems getting issues of Austria off paper as late as the 1950's.
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Lighter fluid is not used to remove stamps from paper. Where did you get the idea that it did It is used to watermark stamps.
Richaard
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06:22:47pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Tom - there is no problem soaking Canadian self-adhesive stamps. At least I haven't found any issues that do not soak in water and they lift off or float over fairly easily.
IF I use lighter fluid for USA or Gt. Britain self-adhesive stamps I use it outdoors. Lighter fluid and baby powder does work for the removal of most modern self-adhesive stamps from paper.
Liz
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Liz; soaked some of those Canadian defins. had soak them 3 times in hot water and still had some trouble. Also had a problem with some of the Canada Tourist attraction stamps. they came off the paper easy but when they dried the gum was still there, so I used the baby powder.
Richard: Actually, I was watermarking stamps and
noticed on the can that it says "excellent for
removing labels". So I tried it on a few of those crummy forever stamps (US) and it worked great.
but they were still sticky. Then, I remembered
when I was young (was really poor when I was young, now I'm just poor)we used to put baby powder on old playing cards to keep them from sticking together so I tried it and it works great and that's how I came up with my "soaking
the unsoakable" method.
As I've stated before it works 99.9% of the time,
for me anyway. The hardest ones are the ATM booklet stamps mainly because they are so thin.
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07:14:14am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Right on, Liz! Your experience is my experience.
Also, in addition to watermarking, lighter fluid (naphtha) can be used quite successfully to remove self adhesive stamps from paper, as you have noted. That also includes those difficult ones such as the U.S. Supreme Court as well as all the earlier black background stamps.
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Actually the can of lighter fluid doesn't say
anything about fumes being harmful (although there are fumes and I don't do more than 10 stamps at a time, just to be on the safe side).
It does say it can be harmful or fatal if swallowed. Also , it mentions that it can be a skin irritant ( I personnally have never had that
problem , but then again I'm a tough old bird and my skin's not as sensitive as some people). It does say to use lots of water to wash it off if
you do have that problem.
It also says keep out of reach of children.
And it is highly flammable.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on October 28, 2010)
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BTW: I don't think anyone ever answered me about
my stoplight riddle. "Why does a stoplight turn
red?". Answer: you'd turn red too if you had to change in the middle of the street.
Also Ogden Nash's poem on babies:
"A little bit of talcum
Is always walcum".
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re: Soaking the Unsoakable
About lighter fluid: Depending on the jurisdiction, products may or may not list the dangers inherent in using them, so you can't necessarily go by labels to inform you of any hazards. Corporate profits, at least the profits of many companies, depend on their customers NOT knowing about their hazardous products. That's why the tobacco industry has had to be beaten about the head and shoulders to get them to put warning labels on cigarettes.
Anyway, lighter fluid is carcinogenic and evaporates quickly. If you can smell it, you're breathing it. Always use it in a well ventilated area. I use it for watermarking in the kitchen under the oven hood, with the fan on high and the kitchen window open.
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Hey! gang! don't get me wrong here. I agree with all the advisory comments made. In my case The ac is straight across from me and is pulling the air and fumes right it's way.
And I ain't none too sure about the baby powder.
breathing in that stuff for the respiratory system probably is not the best thing in the world. the only warning on it is keep the lid closed tight and out of reach of children.
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09:00:58pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Thank you for telling us why stop signs turn red. Interesting thread especially Richard's April Fool.
Thanks
Kathy
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
04 Dec 2010
12:24:35pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
In place of lighter fluid which is rather dangerous I have used rubbing alcohol (Isopropanol or "Surgical Spirits in the UK) for many years as a watermark detector. I find that a 20 or 30 second immersion of an old jar that can be immediately recovered loosens almost all the noxious gums being used these days.
.
It is also flamable but I believe less so than lighter fluid.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
04 Dec 2010
12:24:35pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
In place of lighter fluid which is rather dangerous I have used rubbing alcohol (Isopropanol or "Surgical Spirits in the UK) for many years as a watermark detector. I find that a 20 or 30 second immersion of an old jar that can be immediately recovered loosens almost all the noxious gums being used these days.
.
It is also flamable but I believe less so than lighter fluid.
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12:25:43pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Having done an immense study on how to remove s/a stamps I finally came up with this (and using anything to dust the back of the stamp, eventually dusts everything else and my customers won't buy a dusted stamp, they are very discernible).
I use lighter fluid and it slips right off the paper. I then take a Q-tip dipped in the solvent and gently rub off the rest of the adhesive. I then swish it gently around in a bowl of water with a few drops of liquid dish soap, then a bowl of rinse water which gets rid of the lighter fluid and then place it in my drying book for a few days. Within a minute all is done. No cracks, no remaining solvent or adhesive and I get a perfectly removed flat s/a stamp.
I've used lighter fluid to watermark stamps for years, but always use the "wash/rinse" method afterwards.
I will try the rubbing alcohol to see if I can eliminate the Q-tip step which would be a big plus! but believe I would still follow up with a "wash/rinse" afterward.
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Tried the alcohol, works good; however, fumes and flammability same as lighter fluid in my opinion.
Also will stick with the baby powder, faster & easier. Stamps I did two years ago shows no signs of any deterioration. stamps I watermarked 50 years in excellent shape.
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Yo! Pat! Check this out. Pros & Cons.
But not good for the kids. alcohol or lighter fluid either one.
I tried the really hot water method took me about 6 hours to get 100 Australia S/As off paper.
(Message edited by Stampaholic on February 11, 2011)
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06:13:58pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
This is one area that I just don't understand. I know the old school is to soak the paper off the stamp. However, as technology and stamp printing changes, it is obvious that it takes hours to remove the paper off a stamp that usually isn't worth much of anything other than minimum value. I just cut the paper as close as is safely possible without damaging the stamp, put it in a mount and put it in my album. I don't have the expense of buying all those chemicals, and the enormous amount of time taken to work on just one stamp. I have heard the argument that the paper from the envelope adds thickness to the stamp in the mount. Well, so does the backing paper of the unused stamp, so that is not a valid argument.
People have tried to explain this compulsion (and in some cases a manic need) to remove the paper from these stamps. As I said, it doesn't make sense to me. But, it's your collection, time and money. I'd rather buy more stamps with the money and spend the time adding those stamps to my albums. Personal choice to be sure, but it just baffles me the unwillingness to change and adapt, and sit there frustrated over the futility of the effort expended. All I can say is enjoy your work!? I'll just continue to shake my head in wonder over this....
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
12 Feb 2011
10:48:10am
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
I think that the idea of backing paper adding to the thickness is only a part of the problem. Paper used for envelopes varies dramatically in thickness.
There is no way of knowing what its acidity is. or what the chemical reaction between the stamp, the glutinous crap and the paper the stamp was used on might be.
Then there is the possibility that the reaction might migrate through the album page and over years affect the stamp on the page behind the source. You can often see this effect on old albums that used certain kinds of mounts during the thirties and forties in the brown stain that has travelled onto the next page.
I have the major part of my world wide collection (1840 - 1975) mounted with hinges in a set of Minkus Supreme and Minkus Master Global binders. As pages filled the thickness of the stamps has made the album look, almost stuffed. Leaving the layer of glue and the thickness of miscellaneous paper backings would double or even triple that stuffed look.
As to people who use various trimmed mounts, personally, unless you start with heavier paper for the album even their weight can make a filled album look dingy.
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12:00:02pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
I can agree with that, and have seen what you are talking about. But, with all the chemicals being used to remove the paper from the self-adhesives, what is the long-term affect on the paper, album pages, mounts, etc. from all that stuff? Not all of it is safe on paper.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
12 Feb 2011
11:04:53pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
" ...But, with all the chemicals being used to remove the paper from the self-adhesives, what is the long-term affect on the paper, album pages, mounts, etc. from all that stuff?
If I were 17 years old and not 71 years young, I'd stick around fifty years and find out.
.
I have also considered that problem, or potential problem, but just do not know. I even wondered if, after ten or twenty years, the talcom powder being used on occasion would turn black or brown or even accumulate moisture that could harm the stamps.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
12 Feb 2011
11:15:16pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
" ... I tried the method noted above on a few USA recent stamps. Of the 8 stamps I removed from paper most look good, except for this one. Garbage!! ..."
I have tried with limited success to get decent used examples of this set. I have acceptable examples of five of them but found easily ten or twenty that were ruined in the same manner.
Yes, Garbage.
These people are killing the hobby.
And no, they care not one wit, preferring to have collectors settle for mint mini-sheets.
And as long as hobbiests fuel the insanity by purchasing and saving mint sheetlets the Postal people will continue producing garbage.
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I think that it's an overstatement to say that the current low standards of stamp production "are killing the hobby". Of the 70 or so members of my stamp club, there aren't more than a handful who buy collect current stamps on a regular basis. Most are far more interested in older issues, of which there seem to be plenty. There is also the bald fact that we stamp collectors represent a miniscule market for any and all postal administrations. What Cdj1122 says they don't give a whit. Actually, they don't give a damn!
Perhaps it's useful to compare stamp collecting to the collecting of, say, WWII memorabilia -- uniforms, insignia, caps, helmets, guns, canteens, mess kits, etc. It's a popular hobby, but no one is producing new "issues" these days! I approach philately from the viewpoint that no one, literally, is producing any stamps these days that mean a thing to me. I don't care that I can't soak many current stamps off paper without damaging them.
Of course, there are collectors who do care, but I'm afraid they're going to have to learn to live with it. Will the "unsoakability" of current stamps destroy stamp collecting. I doubt it. The wide range of collecting possibilities and the large supply of stamps and covers guarantees that collecting will outlast any of us.
Bob
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05:52:21pm
re: Soaking the Unsoakable
Hi everyone
A while ago I bought some used GB security machins on eBay from a seller in Singapore. These were off paper with the security tabs undamaged. I asked him how he managed to separate from paper and was told:
Hi again Mr Stuart, it is not exactly a trade secret, what I use is a French chemical to soak them " EAU ECARLATE" and remove the gum after lifted by scrapping, soak, scrape till no more glue
Obviously haven't tried as I have not managed to source any of this apart from in France.
Maybe another way around this problem.
Stuart
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