Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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With due acknowledgement of the vagaries of determining colour shades based on a scan on the computer screen, I would say (hopefully humbly) this looks like a faded #17a (violet). The #16 is generally a black brown shade, or at least a very deep chocolate brown--the observed "grayish" aspects of this specimen are outside any of those parameters. That's my non-expert opinion, for whatever it might be worth.
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05:23:04pm
Good luck with this one, it's real tough!! There are several colour shades and several different perfs for each stamp. I have both stamps and the best way to tell a #16 from a #17 is ... If it's a certified #16 (mine is) you're safe (probably!), if there is no such certificate then it's probably a #17. Is that any help, not really!!
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I really don't think it's a 16. If I thought the odds were even I might send it to Greene.
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@bigcreekdad
Can you scan the reverse side?
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09:48:47pm
Canada #16, currently being offered by City Stamp Montreal for US$4,995. with Vincent Graves Greene certificate.
(VGG certs are the premier certificates for Canadian and BNA material)
Roy
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09:56:03pm
and, IMO, yours is a badly faded, originally grey violet shade -- see how much the pen cancellation has faded.
And here is a good sample of the shades of this issue (image swiped from ebay)
The many printings are enumerated by both Jarrett (1929) and Boggs (1940), if my memory serves. I would have to dig out my volumes of both of these books to actually confirm that.
Roy
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Looks like someone went to work on getting rid of a cancel? I'm seeing a worked-over 17.
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@bigcreekdad
Run it thru ImageSeluth and show us the results?
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04:09:13pm
What an amazing set of stamps Roy found on E-Bay!!! Too bad we can't see the reverse side!
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@Harvey
What value would you expect by seeing the reverse side if you could see it?
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06:34:29pm
"What value would you expect by seeing the reverse side if you could see it?"
Absolutely none!!
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I believe it is just curiosity.
I'd like to know how many were hinged or not etc;
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08:46:40pm
"I'd like to know how many were hinged or not etc;"
It doesn't matter if used stamps have been hinged, as long as they haven't been thinned. They can always be soaked (there are exceptions with a very few water fugitive inks.)
"Used, never hinged" is laughed at by any experienced collector.
Roy
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I did not realize that Roy.
It doesn't add any value on Key stamps?
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01:13:40pm
"It doesn't add any value on Key stamps?"
Nope. Since all traces of any good quality hinge can be removed by soaking, you have no way of knowing that it had "never" been hinged. In general, you can't tell the difference between a stamp I just soaked off an envelope and one that was hinged in an album that I soaked the hinge off of.
Of course, poor quality, old hinges or homemade mounting efforts can leave thins, gum stains or little square toned spots on used stamps. That's an entirely different matter and needs to be disclosed specifically when selling.
Roy
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Thanks!
I try to find used stamps with "sound backs".
Not like I really see the other side in my book, but it is nice to know it is in good shape.
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05:20:18pm
"I try to find used stamps with "sound backs"."
100% agree!
Me too.
Roy
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05:31:08pm
I must be the odd one out on this one! As long as there are no thins or writing in pen I really don't care about the back of the stamp, I never have. I don't even try to remove hinge remnants in case I cause damage, I am not the most patient person in the world and might cause damage with short cuts. We are all different and that, IMHO, is a good thing!!
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That is, what makes everyone unique!
I am willing to spend the time "working on a HV stamp", though it can get quite tedious!
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I'm thinking a very faded out 17, but grayish like around the oval throws me a monkey wrench. The #16 is way pricier so that should be enough to convince me. Watch Y'all think?
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05:19:23pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
With due acknowledgement of the vagaries of determining colour shades based on a scan on the computer screen, I would say (hopefully humbly) this looks like a faded #17a (violet). The #16 is generally a black brown shade, or at least a very deep chocolate brown--the observed "grayish" aspects of this specimen are outside any of those parameters. That's my non-expert opinion, for whatever it might be worth.
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Back when I had a bunch! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
26 Feb 2025
05:23:04pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
Good luck with this one, it's real tough!! There are several colour shades and several different perfs for each stamp. I have both stamps and the best way to tell a #16 from a #17 is ... If it's a certified #16 (mine is) you're safe (probably!), if there is no such certificate then it's probably a #17. Is that any help, not really!!
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
I really don't think it's a 16. If I thought the odds were even I might send it to Greene.
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
@bigcreekdad
Can you scan the reverse side?
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BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
26 Feb 2025
09:48:47pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
Canada #16, currently being offered by City Stamp Montreal for US$4,995. with Vincent Graves Greene certificate.
(VGG certs are the premier certificates for Canadian and BNA material)
Roy
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BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
26 Feb 2025
09:56:03pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
and, IMO, yours is a badly faded, originally grey violet shade -- see how much the pen cancellation has faded.
And here is a good sample of the shades of this issue (image swiped from ebay)
The many printings are enumerated by both Jarrett (1929) and Boggs (1940), if my memory serves. I would have to dig out my volumes of both of these books to actually confirm that.
Roy
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
Looks like someone went to work on getting rid of a cancel? I'm seeing a worked-over 17.
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
@bigcreekdad
Run it thru ImageSeluth and show us the results?
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this post
Back when I had a bunch! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
27 Feb 2025
04:09:13pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
What an amazing set of stamps Roy found on E-Bay!!! Too bad we can't see the reverse side!
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
@Harvey
What value would you expect by seeing the reverse side if you could see it?
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this post
Back when I had a bunch! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
27 Feb 2025
06:34:29pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
"What value would you expect by seeing the reverse side if you could see it?"
Absolutely none!!
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
I believe it is just curiosity.
I'd like to know how many were hinged or not etc;
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BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
27 Feb 2025
08:46:40pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
"I'd like to know how many were hinged or not etc;"
It doesn't matter if used stamps have been hinged, as long as they haven't been thinned. They can always be soaked (there are exceptions with a very few water fugitive inks.)
"Used, never hinged" is laughed at by any experienced collector.
Roy
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re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
I did not realize that Roy.
It doesn't add any value on Key stamps?
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this post
BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
28 Feb 2025
01:13:40pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
"It doesn't add any value on Key stamps?"
Nope. Since all traces of any good quality hinge can be removed by soaking, you have no way of knowing that it had "never" been hinged. In general, you can't tell the difference between a stamp I just soaked off an envelope and one that was hinged in an album that I soaked the hinge off of.
Of course, poor quality, old hinges or homemade mounting efforts can leave thins, gum stains or little square toned spots on used stamps. That's an entirely different matter and needs to be disclosed specifically when selling.
Roy
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Approvals
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
Thanks!
I try to find used stamps with "sound backs".
Not like I really see the other side in my book, but it is nice to know it is in good shape.
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this post
BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
28 Feb 2025
05:20:18pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
"I try to find used stamps with "sound backs"."
100% agree!
Me too.
Roy
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this post
Back when I had a bunch! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
28 Feb 2025
05:31:08pm
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
I must be the odd one out on this one! As long as there are no thins or writing in pen I really don't care about the back of the stamp, I never have. I don't even try to remove hinge remnants in case I cause damage, I am not the most patient person in the world and might cause damage with short cuts. We are all different and that, IMHO, is a good thing!!
1 Member
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Login to Like.
Approvals
re: Color help Canada #16 or 17?
That is, what makes everyone unique!
I am willing to spend the time "working on a HV stamp", though it can get quite tedious!
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this post