Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Looking for opinions and guidance - would you add this to your collection? If so, what pricing v. catalogue would you feel comfortable with? My expertise in this particular area is very limited, so: would you want this particular stamp as part of your collection?
I'm a new member of this site - and very much interested in your feedback. Thanks.
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It’s just my opinion but the 5.00 Jubilee is not easy to find. The price should be below cat. value wether a little or a lot depends on the severity of the defect. If you agree on a price, buy it with an eye to replacing it later and selling this one. It is a hard stamp to find.
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I would prefer a sound copy.
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03:07:47pm
This is just a quote I saw online:
"Any imperfection embedded in the stamp often of significantly different color than the stamp itself. Inclusions usually detract from the value of the stamp, but often only marginally."
I have all of the series mint except for the $4 and $5 and would buy only a perfect one when I replace my used copy, but that's just me! It's hard to come up with a price because good copies of this stamp tend to be expensive. The Unitrade value for mint VF is $2000 (Unitrade is in Canadian dollars) and I would expect you would have to pay at least half CV and subtract about $100 for the inclusion and convert to USD and you end up with about $670. That's just a guide and it actually seems a bit low to me because the stamp is in demand. I would say you'll end up about there though, just a guess!!
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Me, personally, I would not buy at any price as a face visible defect like that would prevent me from enjoying the stamp in my album. I would just see the defect and not any other merits the stamp may have. I know other people get more enjoyment out of obtaining stamps for a really good price and could ignore if the price was right.
As far a value - the closest thing I have seen for stamp fair market value (FMV) is PSE - you can actually put the Scott number for Canadian stamps here to get some idea of value in different grades:
https://gradingmatters.com/can.html
As far as grading - per below - a minor fault subtracts 25 points from the grade - so if centering is really VF80, 80 minus 25 is 55 so they are saying value is equivalent to a VG centered stamp:
https://gradingmatters.com/all-about-gra ...
I think FMV and stamp grading are interesting topics that could be their own threads.
Josh
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@Tristan0999
My 2 cents worth.
Search for an auction for the stamp in question!
I mostly find better deals in an auction.
It doesn't happen every day or very often, but sometimes I win the auction where no one else bid!
Auctions are a good way to get the stamp(s)!
Just my way, end of my two cents worth!
1898
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Thank you all for your responses. Harvey & 1898 - I appreciate your inputs and advice. Josh - your referrals are very helpful, much appreciated.
Bernie
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I just looked on Hipstamp. I see four sales from $400 (regummed) to $1500. Ones still for sale go up to $2500. With a fault to the stamp you described I'd probably keep looking. I agree with the poster who said this fault would be the first thing you'd see when you viewed your Jubilee collection.
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Bigcreekdad - I agree; it will make the searching and the wait that much more rewarding when the "right" item is (finally) found.
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If you are talking about the $649 price for one on Hip Stamp, this, or any other situation where you are expending that amount for a stamp with defect, I would expect a cert. E.g., the one I am seeing could either be an inclusion or some sort of thin, filled or not. Only close examination or cert could determine that.
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There's another in the mid-$700 range. Same thing there. I would not trust it to be mint or original gum wiithout a certification unless you are buying from the APS store in Hip Stamp. And even in that case, I would want/prefer a cert for that price.
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04:19:49pm
With all of this talk in posts about certification I'm just curious how much it costs and how long does it take to get the stamp back? If we're talking a fairly long period of time I assume it means the seller would have to wait for it to come back before he/she can sell the stamp. Just curious!
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Cost, for example PSE, can be from $35 for classic issues to 5% of catalog value. Turn around I believe now is about 30 business days.
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The reason I mention the certification is that I have been filling in some gaps recently with a couple expensive items from public auctions (not your standard Ebay or Hip Stamp auction, which seem to have lower quality items in the area I am looking). Many of the really good examples of stamps, say in classic US area, have certs. If you are going to splurge, you might as well buy the best copy you can afford - you will be happier with a quality item (e.g., four margins, good centering, no defects, and an existing cert to back it up) - then at least your heirs night have some hope of the item retaining value over time. Then again, we all have different motivations. Some areas we might just be happy to fill that space, whereas others we want better items. The items I recently purchased, five in all, had at least one or two certs, not recent certs, and one fairly easy to identify had no cert.
The other thing that makes up for a cert when identification is pretty straightforward is reputation of the seller. That's why I suggest that buying from an APS member, while no guarantee, is better than just any seller off of Hip Stamp, unless you know the seller, etc. Your mileage may vary.
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05:05:29pm
I have bought a few expensive items with certification and some without. I only buy from dealers on line I have had good success with unless the items are common and cheap. A while ago, over the period of the best part of a year, I bought a complete BC collection and spent a substantial sum. The person I bought from has been selling to me, him and his father, since 1972. So the trust is there and I know he would take the items back if there was a problem. The most expensive items were #1 and #3 and I have the provenance for these items. I know the auction where they were sold and the lot numbers and it was a very reputable auction company. The buyer was also a well known collector. This was a once in a lifetime opportunity. I spent $4000 CD for #1 and I thought that was a good price. But only a fool would spend that kind of money without being sure of what it is! I can be foolish at times, maybe even a bit silly, but I am not stupid!! You must have faith in your seller, they must take returns, and then use common sense and go from there!
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Hungary....am I getting too sensitive? You mention that you would buy from an APS member on Hipstamp. Are you implying that non APA Hipstamp sellers are a cut below?
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John, my post should not be interpreted as implying anything except what was said. For my part, if I don’t know a seller, but the seller is a member of an organization with a code of conduct, then that is a plus. Further, if said organization is the broker of the deal, via another website or not, meaning they receive the stamp from the seller, post the item, and handle the transaction, then that also adds a level of comfort. Also, a 30 day money back guarantee is another benefit that adds assurance to a potential sale. Nothing is infallible and everyone has their own level of comfort, preferences and their own relationships with sellers.
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I left APS over it's decision to partner with Hipstamp. During my time with APS, I didn't see any attempt by them to monitor or supervise the items sold by members. There are still a number of very well-known unscrupulous members on their books.
I'm a member of the PTS and IPDA, which I think are both better baskets to put your eggs in.
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I'm sorry, but the two above posts offend me as a Hipstamp seller. Forget about me, but there are many damn good and honorable sellers on Hipstamp. As many others do, I go out of my way to show and describe my wares accurately. Also, I give refunds with no questions asked if a buyer wants to return within 7 days of receipt. Finally, there is feedback to add, or subtract, a level of comfort.
Why does paying APS dues automatically make me a more trustworthy/reliable seller?
This seemingly blanket thinking is unfair. So many people look WAY down at Ebay philatelic sellers, but I, by and large, have found the sellers there I buy from (with one large exception) are honorable. Some may not be as knowledgeable ( inaccurately described stamps), but I've never had a return request by me refused. Most apologize and refund promptly. And they likely learn from the experience and become better in identifying their wares.
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If my post offended, I apologise. That wasn't my intention at all!
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Hungary - I've certainly enjoyed reading your recent posts in this thread; your thoughts, especially regarding expertising / certification are very much in line with my own, especially as regards the more expensive items.
The two copies of Canada #65 that you referred to are indeed the ones that I had been interested in - in both cases the seller had agreed to have them expertized if I had made the decision to purchase either. Many thanks for your interest and in your input.
Bernie
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John, I don't believe I said or implied there were not “good and honorable sellers on Hipstamp” nor did I say “paying APS dues automatically” makes someone a more trustworthy/honorable seller. Nothing can automatically do that - it has to be demonstrated. I don’t look down on Ebay or Hipstamp sellers and I made no statement to that effect. Actually, I make most of my purchases on Ebay. If I gave the impression I meant those things, it was not intended.
(edited for clarity)
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Hungary....I'm ready for a truce here. It was my interpretation of what you wrote. Thanks for clarifying. Have a good one./John
Tristan....can you tell us what you decide? And maybe post a pic of the beauty if you purchase it.
I've got a $1 Jubilee is great condition (LH), and I'm trying to decide whether to have it expertise before listing in my store.
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08:50:12am
"I've got a $1 Jubilee is great condition (LH), and I'm trying to decide whether to have it expertise before listing in my store."
Not necessary unless you are uncertain of the gum, or unless it is XF-Superb centering. The gum on the Jubilees is quite distinctive. Should be no problem deciding if original gum or not. XF-Superb could go for a significant premium over the usual "percentage of catalog", but wouldn't generate as much excitement as a NH example. Those who will pay the big price want everything perfect.
Roy
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Thanks Roy. I've been holding for over a month. I'll take a good look at the gum. If it looks OK, I will go ahead and list it without the cert. Honestly, I didn't send it off right way as I was wondering how much a cert would add. I am relatively OK that the stamp is genuine.
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02:32:02pm
I have the opportunity to purchase a copy of the $5 Jubilee issue (Scott / Unitrade #65) - the stamp, although very well centered, mint w/ minimal HR and very good color, does have an obvious defect: a natural inclusion visible on the forehead of the young queen.
Looking for opinions and guidance - would you add this to your collection? If so, what pricing v. catalogue would you feel comfortable with? My expertise in this particular area is very limited, so: would you want this particular stamp as part of your collection?
I'm a new member of this site - and very much interested in your feedback. Thanks.
Login to Like
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02:55:43pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
It’s just my opinion but the 5.00 Jubilee is not easy to find. The price should be below cat. value wether a little or a lot depends on the severity of the defect. If you agree on a price, buy it with an eye to replacing it later and selling this one. It is a hard stamp to find.
Login to Like
this post
This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
05 Sep 2023
03:07:47pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
This is just a quote I saw online:
"Any imperfection embedded in the stamp often of significantly different color than the stamp itself. Inclusions usually detract from the value of the stamp, but often only marginally."
I have all of the series mint except for the $4 and $5 and would buy only a perfect one when I replace my used copy, but that's just me! It's hard to come up with a price because good copies of this stamp tend to be expensive. The Unitrade value for mint VF is $2000 (Unitrade is in Canadian dollars) and I would expect you would have to pay at least half CV and subtract about $100 for the inclusion and convert to USD and you end up with about $670. That's just a guide and it actually seems a bit low to me because the stamp is in demand. I would say you'll end up about there though, just a guess!!
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Me, personally, I would not buy at any price as a face visible defect like that would prevent me from enjoying the stamp in my album. I would just see the defect and not any other merits the stamp may have. I know other people get more enjoyment out of obtaining stamps for a really good price and could ignore if the price was right.
As far a value - the closest thing I have seen for stamp fair market value (FMV) is PSE - you can actually put the Scott number for Canadian stamps here to get some idea of value in different grades:
https://gradingmatters.com/can.html
As far as grading - per below - a minor fault subtracts 25 points from the grade - so if centering is really VF80, 80 minus 25 is 55 so they are saying value is equivalent to a VG centered stamp:
https://gradingmatters.com/all-about-gra ...
I think FMV and stamp grading are interesting topics that could be their own threads.
Josh
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04:09:12pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
@Tristan0999
My 2 cents worth.
Search for an auction for the stamp in question!
I mostly find better deals in an auction.
It doesn't happen every day or very often, but sometimes I win the auction where no one else bid!
Auctions are a good way to get the stamp(s)!
Just my way, end of my two cents worth!
1898
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05:58:44pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Thank you all for your responses. Harvey & 1898 - I appreciate your inputs and advice. Josh - your referrals are very helpful, much appreciated.
Bernie
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
I just looked on Hipstamp. I see four sales from $400 (regummed) to $1500. Ones still for sale go up to $2500. With a fault to the stamp you described I'd probably keep looking. I agree with the poster who said this fault would be the first thing you'd see when you viewed your Jubilee collection.
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03:00:45pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Bigcreekdad - I agree; it will make the searching and the wait that much more rewarding when the "right" item is (finally) found.
Login to Like
this post
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
If you are talking about the $649 price for one on Hip Stamp, this, or any other situation where you are expending that amount for a stamp with defect, I would expect a cert. E.g., the one I am seeing could either be an inclusion or some sort of thin, filled or not. Only close examination or cert could determine that.
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
There's another in the mid-$700 range. Same thing there. I would not trust it to be mint or original gum wiithout a certification unless you are buying from the APS store in Hip Stamp. And even in that case, I would want/prefer a cert for that price.
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
08 Sep 2023
04:19:49pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
With all of this talk in posts about certification I'm just curious how much it costs and how long does it take to get the stamp back? If we're talking a fairly long period of time I assume it means the seller would have to wait for it to come back before he/she can sell the stamp. Just curious!
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Cost, for example PSE, can be from $35 for classic issues to 5% of catalog value. Turn around I believe now is about 30 business days.
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
The reason I mention the certification is that I have been filling in some gaps recently with a couple expensive items from public auctions (not your standard Ebay or Hip Stamp auction, which seem to have lower quality items in the area I am looking). Many of the really good examples of stamps, say in classic US area, have certs. If you are going to splurge, you might as well buy the best copy you can afford - you will be happier with a quality item (e.g., four margins, good centering, no defects, and an existing cert to back it up) - then at least your heirs night have some hope of the item retaining value over time. Then again, we all have different motivations. Some areas we might just be happy to fill that space, whereas others we want better items. The items I recently purchased, five in all, had at least one or two certs, not recent certs, and one fairly easy to identify had no cert.
The other thing that makes up for a cert when identification is pretty straightforward is reputation of the seller. That's why I suggest that buying from an APS member, while no guarantee, is better than just any seller off of Hip Stamp, unless you know the seller, etc. Your mileage may vary.
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this post
This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
08 Sep 2023
05:05:29pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
I have bought a few expensive items with certification and some without. I only buy from dealers on line I have had good success with unless the items are common and cheap. A while ago, over the period of the best part of a year, I bought a complete BC collection and spent a substantial sum. The person I bought from has been selling to me, him and his father, since 1972. So the trust is there and I know he would take the items back if there was a problem. The most expensive items were #1 and #3 and I have the provenance for these items. I know the auction where they were sold and the lot numbers and it was a very reputable auction company. The buyer was also a well known collector. This was a once in a lifetime opportunity. I spent $4000 CD for #1 and I thought that was a good price. But only a fool would spend that kind of money without being sure of what it is! I can be foolish at times, maybe even a bit silly, but I am not stupid!! You must have faith in your seller, they must take returns, and then use common sense and go from there!
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Hungary....am I getting too sensitive? You mention that you would buy from an APS member on Hipstamp. Are you implying that non APA Hipstamp sellers are a cut below?
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
John, my post should not be interpreted as implying anything except what was said. For my part, if I don’t know a seller, but the seller is a member of an organization with a code of conduct, then that is a plus. Further, if said organization is the broker of the deal, via another website or not, meaning they receive the stamp from the seller, post the item, and handle the transaction, then that also adds a level of comfort. Also, a 30 day money back guarantee is another benefit that adds assurance to a potential sale. Nothing is infallible and everyone has their own level of comfort, preferences and their own relationships with sellers.
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
I left APS over it's decision to partner with Hipstamp. During my time with APS, I didn't see any attempt by them to monitor or supervise the items sold by members. There are still a number of very well-known unscrupulous members on their books.
I'm a member of the PTS and IPDA, which I think are both better baskets to put your eggs in.
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
I'm sorry, but the two above posts offend me as a Hipstamp seller. Forget about me, but there are many damn good and honorable sellers on Hipstamp. As many others do, I go out of my way to show and describe my wares accurately. Also, I give refunds with no questions asked if a buyer wants to return within 7 days of receipt. Finally, there is feedback to add, or subtract, a level of comfort.
Why does paying APS dues automatically make me a more trustworthy/reliable seller?
This seemingly blanket thinking is unfair. So many people look WAY down at Ebay philatelic sellers, but I, by and large, have found the sellers there I buy from (with one large exception) are honorable. Some may not be as knowledgeable ( inaccurately described stamps), but I've never had a return request by me refused. Most apologize and refund promptly. And they likely learn from the experience and become better in identifying their wares.
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
If my post offended, I apologise. That wasn't my intention at all!
Login to Like
this post
04:56:31pm
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Hungary - I've certainly enjoyed reading your recent posts in this thread; your thoughts, especially regarding expertising / certification are very much in line with my own, especially as regards the more expensive items.
The two copies of Canada #65 that you referred to are indeed the ones that I had been interested in - in both cases the seller had agreed to have them expertized if I had made the decision to purchase either. Many thanks for your interest and in your input.
Bernie
Login to Like
this post
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
John, I don't believe I said or implied there were not “good and honorable sellers on Hipstamp” nor did I say “paying APS dues automatically” makes someone a more trustworthy/honorable seller. Nothing can automatically do that - it has to be demonstrated. I don’t look down on Ebay or Hipstamp sellers and I made no statement to that effect. Actually, I make most of my purchases on Ebay. If I gave the impression I meant those things, it was not intended.
(edited for clarity)
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Hungary....I'm ready for a truce here. It was my interpretation of what you wrote. Thanks for clarifying. Have a good one./John
Tristan....can you tell us what you decide? And maybe post a pic of the beauty if you purchase it.
I've got a $1 Jubilee is great condition (LH), and I'm trying to decide whether to have it expertise before listing in my store.
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11 Sep 2023
08:50:12am
re: $5 Jubilee Issue
"I've got a $1 Jubilee is great condition (LH), and I'm trying to decide whether to have it expertise before listing in my store."
Not necessary unless you are uncertain of the gum, or unless it is XF-Superb centering. The gum on the Jubilees is quite distinctive. Should be no problem deciding if original gum or not. XF-Superb could go for a significant premium over the usual "percentage of catalog", but wouldn't generate as much excitement as a NH example. Those who will pay the big price want everything perfect.
Roy
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re: $5 Jubilee Issue
Thanks Roy. I've been holding for over a month. I'll take a good look at the gum. If it looks OK, I will go ahead and list it without the cert. Honestly, I didn't send it off right way as I was wondering how much a cert would add. I am relatively OK that the stamp is genuine.
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