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General Philatelic/Identify This? : Revenue Cancellation

 

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Oiltechken

17 Apr 2022
03:02:07pm
This is Bermuda Scott 53 or 96 (I haven’t checked for watermark yet). Scott say both these are found with revenue cancellations, which is what I think this is. My question is, if it is a revenue cancel, does it change the value? (Which I have seen on some other stamps.)
Thanks so much in advance, you all are great!Q!
Happy Easter & best regards,
Ken
P.S., I scored this stamp in a $20 box lot at my local stamp club semi-annual auction. (The Waterville, Maine Stamp Club)

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Oiltechken

17 Apr 2022
03:02:56pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

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smauggie
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17 Apr 2022
06:58:48pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

Basically, if it is used as a revenue, which yours is, then it is no longer a postage stamp and the catalog number in the catalog no longer applies.

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michael78651

17 Apr 2022
07:22:57pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

The basic rule of thumb in Scott is that unless there is a stated value for revenue usage, then the value of of a stamp with a revenue cancel is generally 10% of the stated catalogue value for a stamp used postally.

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musicman
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APS #213005

17 Apr 2022
07:58:15pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

http://www.bermudastamps.co.uk/issues/re ...

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Bobstamp
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18 Apr 2022
02:30:17am
re: Revenue Cancellation

Value be darned, it’s a really nice stamp! I’d be tempted to mount it all by itself on an album page.

Bob

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musicman
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APS #213005

18 Apr 2022
07:49:04am
re: Revenue Cancellation

In my experiences with collecting WW revenues, quite often they are purposely cancelled in such a way as to clearly show its use as a revenue, particularly if the stamp itself is originally intended for use as postage or revenue collection.

This one appears to have been cancelled as clearly as possible for such taxation.

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DavidG
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APS member since 2004

18 Apr 2022
09:32:53am
re: Revenue Cancellation

Note that the stamp, like most of the stamps from our Commonwealth read "Postage and Revenue". The higher value stamps were mostly used for revenue purposes. 10 Shillings is a half pound. That was a lot of money in those days. You'd have to mail something very large to use that much postage.

Michael is correct, that these stamps used fiscally are 10% of the Scott value.

Bob is correct, values be damned! It is a beautiful stamp.

To note, finding some of the used low-value stamps, with a revenue cancellation can be more difficult.

David
Ottawa, Canada

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BermudaSailor
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18 Apr 2022
10:01:02am
re: Revenue Cancellation

Your stamp was used to pay for the Exit tax imposed on all passengers leaving Bermuda. Specifically it was used by a passenger leaving Bermuda on the March 12, 1925 sailing of the Canadian Forester sailing for Nassau Bahamas.

It's value is less than a postally used copy, but in my view has a lot more interest.

I wrote an article about the use of these stamps as Exit Tax for the Bermuda Post a few years ago. If you'd like a copy let me know.

David

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DaveSheridan
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18 Apr 2022
10:20:23am
re: Revenue Cancellation

SG has this note after the 1924 issue:

Image Not Found

SG CV for it is £250, so at 10% this paid for your auction winThumbs Up



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DannyS
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18 Apr 2022
11:19:11am
re: Revenue Cancellation

Certainly back in the 90s a fiscal cancel did give me the opportunity to pick up high value Nyasaland stamps cheaply. In recent years they don't seem to be offered at a very low price. SG took a booth at an international stamp exhibition in Bangkok a few years back and I asked what they had for Nyasaland and they showed me a pair of very high value stamps with such a cancel and they weren't cheapHappy I think the 10% rule may not work anymore.

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roy
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18 Apr 2022
12:33:19pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

Catalogues are great for information, but not so great for actual market prices.

A search on ebay for "Bermuda revenue cancel" returns 9 hits:

Here are the cheap ones:

Image Not Found

But clicking on the "Completed and Sold" option returns 0 sales for the last 90 days.

That tells me selling these is a lot of wishful thinking on the part of the sellers and even "Best Offers" aren't coming in

Since many "Best Offer" sellers are willing to take anything over 50% of their asking price, especially when the item has been up for a long time, that tells me that the "market price" (i.e. where somebody will actually buy it) is something less than 50% of these prices, or $20-25 - as a first guess.

If I had one, I'd offer it at $30 and see what happens.

Let's face it, if every traveler leaving Bermuda had to have one of these on a ticket or whatever, until the head tax rate increased to 12/6 (10/- from Jan 1922 to Dec 1928), at a time when Bermuda was a very popular destination, they are pretty common. But I agree they are beautiful, and since the postally used versions are so scarce, the demand is inordinately higher than normal. If that weren't the case, they would probably sell for $5 or less. (Sort of like the inordinate demand for Penny Blacks, relative to their actual scarcity.)

Roy

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cdj1122
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..

19 Apr 2022
09:00:40am
re: Revenue Cancellation

The original question was;
" .... My question is, if it is a revenue cancel, does it change the value? ...."

Th answer is, to a POSTAGE stamp collector, usually it becomes minimal,
but,
to a REVENUE stamp collector, it might go up, possibly quite a bit.
And if it proved to be a postage usage, the opposite would likely be true,

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roy
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19 Apr 2022
06:48:59pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

Thought I would check my database to see if I have sold one of these on "cover" and lo and behold, I sold this one a few years ago. Not a KGV but a KGVI £1 which was the last "head tax" before they discontinued the tax.

Image Not Found

Unfortunately, the year is not readable.

Roy

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BermudaSailor
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20 Apr 2022
08:58:09am
re: Revenue Cancellation

"KGVI £1 which was the last "head tax" before they discontinued the tax"

.


Actually, Bermuda has continued to collect the Exit Tax until this day. They just don't use stamps to reflect its payment. Rather, the tax is added to the cost of your ticket, either air or cruise.

David

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OLDPAUL

21 Apr 2022
11:17:35pm
re: Revenue Cancellation

Hi Ken,
My 1996 British Commonwealth Revenues Cat. by J. Barefoot Ltd. Lists this stamp as #5 with the Multiple Crow CA watermark at 15.00 pounds. If it has the Multiple Crown Script CA watermark, it is #9 in the catalog also 15.00 pounds. I am sure there is a newer edition of this catalog. Stay Safe and Keep Stamping! OLDPAUL.

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Author/Postings
Oiltechken

17 Apr 2022
03:02:07pm

This is Bermuda Scott 53 or 96 (I haven’t checked for watermark yet). Scott say both these are found with revenue cancellations, which is what I think this is. My question is, if it is a revenue cancel, does it change the value? (Which I have seen on some other stamps.)
Thanks so much in advance, you all are great!Q!
Happy Easter & best regards,
Ken
P.S., I scored this stamp in a $20 box lot at my local stamp club semi-annual auction. (The Waterville, Maine Stamp Club)

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Oiltechken

17 Apr 2022
03:02:56pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

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smauggie

17 Apr 2022
06:58:48pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

Basically, if it is used as a revenue, which yours is, then it is no longer a postage stamp and the catalog number in the catalog no longer applies.

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michael78651

17 Apr 2022
07:22:57pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

The basic rule of thumb in Scott is that unless there is a stated value for revenue usage, then the value of of a stamp with a revenue cancel is generally 10% of the stated catalogue value for a stamp used postally.

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musicman

APS #213005
17 Apr 2022
07:58:15pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

http://www.bermudastamps.co.uk/issues/re ...

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Bobstamp

18 Apr 2022
02:30:17am

re: Revenue Cancellation

Value be darned, it’s a really nice stamp! I’d be tempted to mount it all by itself on an album page.

Bob

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musicman

APS #213005
18 Apr 2022
07:49:04am

re: Revenue Cancellation

In my experiences with collecting WW revenues, quite often they are purposely cancelled in such a way as to clearly show its use as a revenue, particularly if the stamp itself is originally intended for use as postage or revenue collection.

This one appears to have been cancelled as clearly as possible for such taxation.

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DavidG

APS member since 2004
18 Apr 2022
09:32:53am

re: Revenue Cancellation

Note that the stamp, like most of the stamps from our Commonwealth read "Postage and Revenue". The higher value stamps were mostly used for revenue purposes. 10 Shillings is a half pound. That was a lot of money in those days. You'd have to mail something very large to use that much postage.

Michael is correct, that these stamps used fiscally are 10% of the Scott value.

Bob is correct, values be damned! It is a beautiful stamp.

To note, finding some of the used low-value stamps, with a revenue cancellation can be more difficult.

David
Ottawa, Canada

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BermudaSailor

18 Apr 2022
10:01:02am

re: Revenue Cancellation

Your stamp was used to pay for the Exit tax imposed on all passengers leaving Bermuda. Specifically it was used by a passenger leaving Bermuda on the March 12, 1925 sailing of the Canadian Forester sailing for Nassau Bahamas.

It's value is less than a postally used copy, but in my view has a lot more interest.

I wrote an article about the use of these stamps as Exit Tax for the Bermuda Post a few years ago. If you'd like a copy let me know.

David

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DaveSheridan

18 Apr 2022
10:20:23am

re: Revenue Cancellation

SG has this note after the 1924 issue:

Image Not Found

SG CV for it is £250, so at 10% this paid for your auction winThumbs Up



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DannyS

18 Apr 2022
11:19:11am

re: Revenue Cancellation

Certainly back in the 90s a fiscal cancel did give me the opportunity to pick up high value Nyasaland stamps cheaply. In recent years they don't seem to be offered at a very low price. SG took a booth at an international stamp exhibition in Bangkok a few years back and I asked what they had for Nyasaland and they showed me a pair of very high value stamps with such a cancel and they weren't cheapHappy I think the 10% rule may not work anymore.

Like
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this post

BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
18 Apr 2022
12:33:19pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

Catalogues are great for information, but not so great for actual market prices.

A search on ebay for "Bermuda revenue cancel" returns 9 hits:

Here are the cheap ones:

Image Not Found

But clicking on the "Completed and Sold" option returns 0 sales for the last 90 days.

That tells me selling these is a lot of wishful thinking on the part of the sellers and even "Best Offers" aren't coming in

Since many "Best Offer" sellers are willing to take anything over 50% of their asking price, especially when the item has been up for a long time, that tells me that the "market price" (i.e. where somebody will actually buy it) is something less than 50% of these prices, or $20-25 - as a first guess.

If I had one, I'd offer it at $30 and see what happens.

Let's face it, if every traveler leaving Bermuda had to have one of these on a ticket or whatever, until the head tax rate increased to 12/6 (10/- from Jan 1922 to Dec 1928), at a time when Bermuda was a very popular destination, they are pretty common. But I agree they are beautiful, and since the postally used versions are so scarce, the demand is inordinately higher than normal. If that weren't the case, they would probably sell for $5 or less. (Sort of like the inordinate demand for Penny Blacks, relative to their actual scarcity.)

Roy

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"BuckaCover.com - Since 2003 - Over One million covers sold - What have you been missing?"

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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
19 Apr 2022
09:00:40am

re: Revenue Cancellation

The original question was;
" .... My question is, if it is a revenue cancel, does it change the value? ...."

Th answer is, to a POSTAGE stamp collector, usually it becomes minimal,
but,
to a REVENUE stamp collector, it might go up, possibly quite a bit.
And if it proved to be a postage usage, the opposite would likely be true,

Like
Login to Like
this post

".... You may think you understood what you thought I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you think you heard is not what I thought I meant. .... "

BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
19 Apr 2022
06:48:59pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

Thought I would check my database to see if I have sold one of these on "cover" and lo and behold, I sold this one a few years ago. Not a KGV but a KGVI £1 which was the last "head tax" before they discontinued the tax.

Image Not Found

Unfortunately, the year is not readable.

Roy

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"BuckaCover.com - Since 2003 - Over One million covers sold - What have you been missing?"

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BermudaSailor

20 Apr 2022
08:58:09am

re: Revenue Cancellation

"KGVI £1 which was the last "head tax" before they discontinued the tax"

.


Actually, Bermuda has continued to collect the Exit Tax until this day. They just don't use stamps to reflect its payment. Rather, the tax is added to the cost of your ticket, either air or cruise.

David

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OLDPAUL

21 Apr 2022
11:17:35pm

re: Revenue Cancellation

Hi Ken,
My 1996 British Commonwealth Revenues Cat. by J. Barefoot Ltd. Lists this stamp as #5 with the Multiple Crow CA watermark at 15.00 pounds. If it has the Multiple Crown Script CA watermark, it is #9 in the catalog also 15.00 pounds. I am sure there is a newer edition of this catalog. Stay Safe and Keep Stamping! OLDPAUL.

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