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Off Topic/Non-philatelic Disc. : Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

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philb
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28 Oct 2021
10:27:17am

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I saw yesterday that Tesla(Elon Musk) made more money already this year than Warren Buffett made in 91 years. I live in what used to be a rural area and i can not help but notice the amount of Tesla cars i see on the roads in the area.
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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
28 Oct 2021
11:08:43am

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Tesla IS big in our area; there's also a lot of accommodation for electric recharging stations in our area; not sure if that's everywhere, but most stores allocate a couple of electric slots.

Our area is also a hotbed of car fascination. There's old ones, new ones, blue ones, the occasional borrowed one, plus the major car show at the Fair and usually a local one or two each week near Holy Cow.


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smauggie
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28 Oct 2021
12:57:13pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Elon Musk's first company, he had no money for rent so he had to sleep in his office. Because of his good idea for the company and a ton of hard work he sold his share of his first company for 300 million dollars. With this money he started Tesla and SpaceX. While his wealth has risen like a rocket, it started in poverty and hard work. He still works like a fiend and still sleeps in the office sometimes when up late working.


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philb
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28 Oct 2021
03:26:48pm

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Yup ! and the stock exchange does not hurt !

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partsguy
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28 Oct 2021
06:24:36pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

I believe that we're seeing many more charging stations due to government funding. For instance, NY is offering a $5000 tax credit through 2022 for businesses to install them. I think there's also tax breaks for private individuals to install them at home.

NY seems to be looking forward to the day when the only way to see an internal combustion vehicle will be at Rhinebeck.... anyone familiar with the Rush song "Red Barchetta"?

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philb
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28 Oct 2021
09:52:22pm

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

i am not familiar with it..but before covid they used to have the hot rod and classic car show at the Rhinebeck fairgrounds.

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angore
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29 Oct 2021
06:20:37am
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

The bottom is filled with a lot of people that did not make it despite all their efforts for a variety of reasons beyond their control. The successes get far more notice than the failures.

I do not see many Teslas around here even though it is a green thinking area. The infrastructure is not well established here.

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sheepshanks
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29 Oct 2021
10:01:51am
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Being in a chilly spot of Canada in the winter, I wonder how the EV's will pan out when we are stuck on the highway in a snow storm, road closed, minus 35c outside.
How much power is the heating system going to use, keeping the inside at a survivably warm temperature.
The highway can be closed for a day or more, with nobody moving. Are a fleet of tow trucks going to be needed the next day?
As the vehicle ranges are now, I could not drive into Winnipeg and back, even in summer on a charge. I'm about 200k away.
Our major highways do not have regular service stations/areas (unlike UK)so at present you usually have to pull off into a local town to get fuel.
How much are we going to have to pay to charge at a public point when the government realise just how much fuel revenue they are losing on petrol/gas sales?
Hopefully the range improves and costs will reduce a heck of a lot before I need to buy another vehicle. Maybe I can get a cheap ex-Hertz rental in 5 years time.

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philb
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29 Oct 2021
10:19:33am

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

i must be careful what i post..my wife reads the discussions...if it were up to me i would NEVER purchase a brand new car..the two year olds are just broken in. Here i go talking money again...the Teslas cost what $60,000 plus ? I never spent half that much on a vehicle.

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smauggie
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29 Oct 2021
03:05:11pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Quote:

"How much power is the heating system going to use, keeping the inside at a survivably warm temperature."



That is a serious consideration even here in Minnesota.
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Harvey
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29 Oct 2021
03:32:52pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

We have a problem here in Nova Scotia since a lot of our power is coal generated. It doesn't change the footprint very much to drive electric vehicles until we can get away from our dependency on coal. Places like China and possibly Great Britain, plus many areas in Europe, would have the same problem. I'm just guessing without any real research, so I might be out to lunch!

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partsguy
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29 Oct 2021
06:30:38pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Rhinebeck is supposed to have their show again in 2022.... my late ex-father-in-law won a few plaques for his Model T and AA back when we were living in the area!

Red Barchetta is a Rush song based on a short story that appeared in Road&Track in the 1970's. Its set in a dystopian future (1982) where old cars are banned, yet the young man sneaks away for a country drive in his uncle's old sports car, chased by a couple of new "air cars"... it has a creepy "big brother" feel, all that "we know what's good for you" kind of nonsense.

The original story can be found here:

http://www.2112.net/powerwindows/transcripts/19731100roadandtrack.htm

and the song is on Rush's classic "Moving Pictures" album.




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angore
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30 Oct 2021
06:10:44am
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

I believe electrics are the future but the power source storage technology is not there yet and do not see how it will be for many years to be a full replacement. For those of us who need to make interstate drives we will need a current technology car even if we had an EV.

It is not like being able to stop at a station and get a quick power source (battery) replacement. The sales will be in the urban areas and likely plateau until the technology improves. Both of our cars are higher mileage so have thought about an EV for local use since nearly all our driving is less than 125 miles.


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amsd
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30 Oct 2021
08:50:44am

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

i wonder if something along the lines of the old stage coach system might work, where folks buy into a group of cars and can arrange to pick one up in Hoboken, Pittsburgh, Indianapolis..... etc., leaving the current car at each spot where it's replaced by, ummm, a new mustang or charger or, gulp, pinto

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BenFranklin1902
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Tom in Exton, PA
24 Nov 2021
11:38:18am
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Quote:

"i wonder if something along the lines of the old stage coach system might work, where folks buy into a group of cars and can arrange to pick one up in Hoboken, Pittsburgh, Indianapolis..... etc., leaving the current car at each spot where it's replaced by, ummm, a new mustang or charger or, gulp, pinto"



That wouldn't be much different than the car sharing companies that operate in big cities. Folks there don't need to own a car, using local mass transit for their day to day, but get a car through a car sharing membership when they need one. I see these on the road... Zip Car is one such company and the cars are usually something middle of the road like a Honda Civic.

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raymor
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24 Nov 2021
05:31:23pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

On the subject of electric cars, I can see some advantages they might have over gas powered cars, no emissions, cheaper to service (probably) however, one aspect of going electric I do not see mentioned is this. Taxes on gas go to maintaining roads and infrastructure. If gas sales drop due to an increase in sales of EVs, then you can be sure that governments will need to find a way of taxing EVs to make up for the loss of gas tax revenue. How about a $1,000 tax per year to maintain the same roads that gas vehicles are paying for?

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sheepshanks
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24 Nov 2021
05:47:20pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Quote:

"How about a $1,000 tax per year to maintain the same roads that gas vehicles are paying for?"



Trouble is that in order to gather the tax, the government would have to set up a whole new department, thus meaning they would have to adjust the tax by at least 200% to end up with the $1000.
Easier way is to add the shortfall to the electric company taxes and have it collected for them. This of course would mean that the payment for charging your vehicle would have to increase at the charging point. I have no clue as to how much it currently costs to charge an EV, presumably different rates depending on the charging time and power output of the charger.
I'm sure the folks at government level already have in mind how they are going to recoup the vast sums currently raised on fuel tax, just not seen any articles of reference.
No doubt it will be brought to public attention once we have all had to change vehicles.

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partsguy
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25 Nov 2021
12:02:31pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

"It is not like being able to stop at a station and get a quick power source (battery) replacement."

This was actually done by a couple of different electric vehicle companies in the 1910's/20's!!!
You purchased a vehicle, but it didn't include a battery... You contracted with the local power company, who kept charged-up batteries, made available anytime needed, on an exchange basis (it took about five minutes to swap a battery pack), and customers paid for the service based on mileage and weight capacity. (This was first successfully used with commercial trucks).

For a good short read on EV's, have a look here:

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=6384804

the GeVeCo story is on page 5, and a photo of an early "charging station" can be seen on page 6.

For a more thorough overview of the GeVeCo system, there is a Google books document version of the 1915 journal "The Motor Truck", volume 6, page 506
The link is huuuuuuge, so not included here, but searching "geveco battery service" at Google books will get you there if you are so inclined!!!!

As for benefits over ICEV's, EV's "reduced emissions" only refers to VEHICLE emissions. The true emissions figures will come from the power plants creating the electricity used by the zero-emissions vehicles.
"Cheaper to service" is also relative. Consumer MAINTENANCE expenses will likely be much cheaper, but when there ARE failures, actually repairing these units (and the cost of the specialized components, which will be dealer-only for the first several years), will make current ICEV repair cost look cheap... while battery technology is exponentially better than it was even ten years ago, the parts and labor involved in replacing battery packs can be equivalent to replacing an engine. Modern EV service also requires specialized training, equipment, and safety protocols which limits the serviceability of these units for DIY and many independent garages. Be prepared when your only service option is the selling dealer franchise!

TomD


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oldguy
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29 Nov 2021
07:30:28pm
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

"Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up?"

As a generic question here are some recent observations.

The current gaming generation is really not interested in 'starting at the bottom and working their way up". In fact they are not really interested in working, period. They are more interested in free time to do their own thing... enable by all the social welfare programs.

We had a hire ad out for a 40 hour per week job at $15/hr. We learned the 'new' facts of 2021 employment market.

1. $15 minimum wage raises many people above the Federal definition of "poverty level" which means if they work 40 hours per week they lose all their free social welfare benefits - child care, Medicare benefits, SNAP, etc. For example, the poverty level for a family of 4 is ~$26,000, but the income of just one parent working 40 hours at $15, is ~$32,000 ... result loss of government benefits. Work less hours, keep benefits. The law of unintended consequences.

2. A hiring prospect explained that he and his friends figured out that they didn't need to work 40 hours. At $15 an hour they could make all the money they use to make and need in 3 days, so that gives them 4 days of freedom for their gaming life style.

Welcome to the employer's new post COVID-19 world ...

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philb
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29 Nov 2021
08:54:03pm

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Oldguy, the world has changed..i think about my uncles coming home from WW2 and how they worked 70 hours a week building Long Island so they could own a home. Now it seems like leisure and entertainment is paramount...work is secondary...i think that the media might have something to do with it.

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BenFranklin1902
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Tom in Exton, PA
30 Nov 2021
10:05:21am
re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

Quote:

"A hiring prospect explained that he and his friends figured out that they didn't need to work 40 hours. At $15 an hour they could make all the money they use to make and need in 3 days, so that gives them 4 days of freedom for their gaming life style."



My wife used to work in HR for a school bus company. Even back then, they needed to hire a driver a day to keep their roles full. I can only imagine how that's going now!

The applicants were a lot of people in their 30s to 60s, many of which never held a job for more than minimum wage. That was $8 an hour in our state. The bus gig paid $16-18 back then, so this was big money to those folks.

The bus drivers day was less than ideal. A six hour day with a big gap in the middle of the day. A 30 hour week. But that 30 hours at $17 was $190 more a week than working minimum wage full time. AND here's the big bonus... summers off! They could collect state unemployment all summer and do nothing! They didn't have to look for work since they were on a "seasonal layoff" with a callback date!

There were drivers there 20 plus years doing that!



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philb
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30 Nov 2021
11:11:14am

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re: Whatever happened to start at the bottom and work your way up ?

i know a fellow who retired recently as a state bus inspector...he does not need the cash but he applied to drive bus at our local high school...you would think they would grab a guy like that...but when i ask him if he is driving yet...there is some red tape in the way. They would probably hire a person with no experience quicker than him.

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