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General Philatelic/Gen. Discussion : How much is enough or too much to pay?

 

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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
09:16:52am
From rrraphy in another thread...

"Many very low catalog price stamps are virtually impossible to find. I have a few such holes in my collections that drive me nuts. They list at the minimum, but after years of looking, I have yet to see one listed anywhere. For a handful of them, I would gladly pay 10x the listed catalog, if I saw them around."



Same! My Germany+ collections have become quite decent, including Bohemia & Moravia - which is complete except for two $0.60 stamps that I have but not with the label attached - and I have never come across them! Also, Berlin - virtually complete including the expensive ones, but can't find one darn cheapie from the Berlin Gate series of 1966-69!


Now here's another thing, and I think maybe I'm too tied into being cheap, and relying on catalogue value as an accurate proxy for actual value. Note: I almost never list-to-sell stamps for more than 10-15% of CV and target purchases at 20-30% (maybe 40% if I really really want something).

But I recently came across a full set of 10 Wurttemberg Officials (in great shape) all of which I need and have never seen (perhaps only one or two from the series occasionally). The asking price was 125% of CV so I initially said no thanks, but then went back to offer my "max" 40%. I was met with "Good luck ever getting the complete set in this condition for any price in the next 10 years, but since I like you I'll take 70%".

In the absence of any other info (other than the ultimate price being less than 10% of my remaining budget for stamp purchases this year) is that something others here would say "thanks but no thanks, my price-flexibility is not...uh...flexible" so I'll wait and keep looking? Or, as Ralph intimates above, is this a case of "I've never seen it, I might never see it again, and really 70% of a somewhat subjective price is not a bad bet"?

Thoughts?

Thanks, Dave.
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jbaxter5256
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23 Sep 2021
09:52:18am
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

If a stamp is something that I really want as long as it is not really significantly higher than catalog I will pay its price. I do try to avoid stamps that are not sound but prices can vary quite a bit.

Now the caveat though is that there are not a lot of stamp issues where my desire is high enough to cause me to pay more than 50% of catalog and often more like 30%. Knowing that a dealer often sells sound stamps at 20-25% of stamps causes me to look at their listings on a regular basis just in case something is offered that I don't have, not necessarily because it is something I really want at a given time.

The biggest issue I run into with pricing is that many dealers/collectors attempt to sell older stamps which are definitely not a full VF at 50% of catalog which is not a discounted price at all! This is especially prevalent in APS circuit books. However, they are often a good source for the occasional missing item from a set which can be highly motivating for a purchase! Happy

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HockeyNut
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23 Sep 2021
10:16:50am
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"My Germany+ collections have become quite decent, including Bohemia & Moravia - which is complete except for two $0.60 stamps that I have but not with the label attached - and I have never come across them! Also, Berlin - virtually complete including the expensive ones, but can't find one darn cheapie from the Berlin Gate series of 1966-69!"



Maybe I can help!

Show me a picture of the stamps of Bohemia & Moravia and the one of the Berlin Gate serie you need.
Then I want to see if I have those stamps double.
Maybe we can work something out here.

MNH or Cancelled??
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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
10:28:29am
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Thanks Henry. I’ll PM you to take this exchange off-line.

Dave

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Charlie2009
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23 Sep 2021
11:56:26am
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

There is really only one set that's not that easy to find, at least in used condition. One can find the odd one here and there but that's about it.

Image Not Found

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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
01:25:20pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

That was exactly the set Anton! I’ve only seen a few singles offered on eBay over the years (some as high as US$53) but ended up settling at US$40 with free shipping thrown in. Very gratifying to see a large space completed!

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads

23 Sep 2021
01:59:53pm

Auctions
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Dave,

catalogues are a starting point, and often not an accurate one at that (I need some MCV stamps i never see), and since most of my purchases are of covers, it's easy to ignore CV altogether.

instead, I look at sales figures (not in any organized way, just anecdotally and putthing things into the siever others might call memory) and go for there.

I think if something is essentially never available, and then it is, AND you want it, well, go grab it.

David

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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
02:25:44pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Thanks David. I followed your wise advice (and included the great comments by others).

Looking at a variety of places to buy stamps, this complete set was the only one available (IN THE WORLD APPARENTLY!!!) as of today, and the only one I've ever seen. In fact, I could find only a few of the singles right now (and per-unit priced much higher than my aggregate deal).

So, this may prove the point of asking "Do I want it? Can I afford it? How happy will I be to consummate it?" rather than "What does a semi-subjective book say it's worth? What is the least amount I can pay for it?"

So thanks to everyone for the helpful feedback!

Dave.

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BenFranklin1902
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Tom in Exton, PA

23 Sep 2021
07:53:09pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

That's all well and good for standard single stamps, but what about other stuff?

For instance, my 1903 Ben Franklin collection is down to finding unique items, some of which I've never seen before. Whether it's an unusual multiple, a private perf I've never seen or interesting franking on a cover, there is no catalog. I have to gauge my desire and pocketbook against what the seller is asking. Note- there are some items I've bookmarked on eBay hoping the seller will hear a voice of reason someday!

In my New Jersey cancellation cover collection, I have a few ways to check desirability... first I have a book that outlines every post office ever in existence, and it's dates. So I find a cover from a post office that was only there for five years in the 1880s? How do I value that?

It's getting tougher and tougher for me to find any covers I need for this collection. Still, some of my favorite dealers on my feed who start everything at $1 come across a few things from time to time. I don't have any issue paying a few dollars for an insignificant cover since someone spent their time marketing it to me on eBay. That's worth something and I'm happy to pay some for that.

Still there are dealers who have had the same covers for sale at huge prices for years in their eBay stores! And I'm not paying it!

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Love & Peace

23 Sep 2021
08:03:22pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"How much is enough or too much to pay?"

Good question. It's difficult to answer because it will depend on individual. There is no correct or incorrect answer.
.
If you are on budget, then stay at your % of CV. However, there are rare stamps that will complete your collection and these rare stamps may never be seen again. In this case, you might want to buy it even if you went way above CV.
.
For my stamp club, we don't have budget. We will buy it way above CV or out bid everyone. There are certain stamps no longer exist in the world and this is why we will pay at all cost.

French Polynesia Stamp Club

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"Love & Peace. Bonjour Mesdames et messieurs. Que l'amour et la paix soient avec toi. Merci."
angore
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Al
Collector, Moderator

24 Sep 2021
05:49:59am
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

It is strictly a personal decision.

Some live by the notion they always want to get a good deal so their focus on solely on cost against a standard for the satisfaction of a good deal. These people usually always talk about their great deals. This is no isolated to stamps.

Some live on desire to acquire and buy whatever makes them happy and the actual value is much less important. Some live beyond their means.

Then there are people in between the extremes.

Now, many reference catalog values but the catalog is an imperfect indicator of market value. In fact, I think it sets values more than it reflects values.

What is the value of happiness if that is your goal?

In stamps, one question is if you believe you can actually get it for less later.

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cdj1122
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..

24 Sep 2021
11:53:45pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

My decision tree;

1.) "Oh, there is a stamp I don't recall having, or even seeing recently." (Me browsing an auction or sales list."

2.) Do I want it, or need it for the appropriate album ?

3.) Can I afford it.
a. No ( move on down the track.)
b. Yes ( Take out emotional scale and weigh the options.)

4a.) Dam, I really feel warm and fuzzy about having that copy.) = buy it.
4b.) Warm but not fuzzy, am I likely to see a similar copy again.
a. No (recheck scale)
b. Yes, There are lots of examples in the marketplace. Some at better prices.
4c.) cold - Take a pass.


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cougar
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26 Sep 2021
04:31:21pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"How much is enough or too much to pay?"



To me the answer lies in how many stamps are left out there to collect. If it is just a few, I will pay whatever unreasonable price is asked of me and end the search.

My problem is, the stamps I need are not dozens, not hundreds, not even thousands, but more like hundreds of thousands. This makes me quickly aware that if I spent even a fraction of the catalog price, I may be putting the shelter over my family's head in jeopardy. Same shelter that is used by me, my dog and my existing stamp collection.Happy


This makes me modify my collector's behavior. The catalog of stamps with all listed stamp issues is like the world's population of game animals, birds and fish.

I go out hunting daily, or whenever I feel like it; if I shoot down a couple of grouse or catch a couple of trout for the day, I call it a good day and look forward to the next.

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Sarge

26 Sep 2021
05:53:00pm
re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

I agree hole heartily with the last two posts.

I for one give myself a speed limit $ amount of what I am willing to spend usually no more than 30% of retail value for the day. There are exceptions to this rule that I have imposed on myself. Big Grin

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Author/Postings
HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
09:16:52am

From rrraphy in another thread...

"Many very low catalog price stamps are virtually impossible to find. I have a few such holes in my collections that drive me nuts. They list at the minimum, but after years of looking, I have yet to see one listed anywhere. For a handful of them, I would gladly pay 10x the listed catalog, if I saw them around."



Same! My Germany+ collections have become quite decent, including Bohemia & Moravia - which is complete except for two $0.60 stamps that I have but not with the label attached - and I have never come across them! Also, Berlin - virtually complete including the expensive ones, but can't find one darn cheapie from the Berlin Gate series of 1966-69!


Now here's another thing, and I think maybe I'm too tied into being cheap, and relying on catalogue value as an accurate proxy for actual value. Note: I almost never list-to-sell stamps for more than 10-15% of CV and target purchases at 20-30% (maybe 40% if I really really want something).

But I recently came across a full set of 10 Wurttemberg Officials (in great shape) all of which I need and have never seen (perhaps only one or two from the series occasionally). The asking price was 125% of CV so I initially said no thanks, but then went back to offer my "max" 40%. I was met with "Good luck ever getting the complete set in this condition for any price in the next 10 years, but since I like you I'll take 70%".

In the absence of any other info (other than the ultimate price being less than 10% of my remaining budget for stamp purchases this year) is that something others here would say "thanks but no thanks, my price-flexibility is not...uh...flexible" so I'll wait and keep looking? Or, as Ralph intimates above, is this a case of "I've never seen it, I might never see it again, and really 70% of a somewhat subjective price is not a bad bet"?

Thoughts?

Thanks, Dave.
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holocauststampsproje ...
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jbaxter5256

23 Sep 2021
09:52:18am

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

If a stamp is something that I really want as long as it is not really significantly higher than catalog I will pay its price. I do try to avoid stamps that are not sound but prices can vary quite a bit.

Now the caveat though is that there are not a lot of stamp issues where my desire is high enough to cause me to pay more than 50% of catalog and often more like 30%. Knowing that a dealer often sells sound stamps at 20-25% of stamps causes me to look at their listings on a regular basis just in case something is offered that I don't have, not necessarily because it is something I really want at a given time.

The biggest issue I run into with pricing is that many dealers/collectors attempt to sell older stamps which are definitely not a full VF at 50% of catalog which is not a discounted price at all! This is especially prevalent in APS circuit books. However, they are often a good source for the occasional missing item from a set which can be highly motivating for a purchase! Happy

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HockeyNut

23 Sep 2021
10:16:50am

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"My Germany+ collections have become quite decent, including Bohemia & Moravia - which is complete except for two $0.60 stamps that I have but not with the label attached - and I have never come across them! Also, Berlin - virtually complete including the expensive ones, but can't find one darn cheapie from the Berlin Gate series of 1966-69!"



Maybe I can help!

Show me a picture of the stamps of Bohemia & Moravia and the one of the Berlin Gate serie you need.
Then I want to see if I have those stamps double.
Maybe we can work something out here.

MNH or Cancelled??
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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
10:28:29am

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Thanks Henry. I’ll PM you to take this exchange off-line.

Dave

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Charlie2009

23 Sep 2021
11:56:26am

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

There is really only one set that's not that easy to find, at least in used condition. One can find the odd one here and there but that's about it.

Image Not Found

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HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
01:25:20pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

That was exactly the set Anton! I’ve only seen a few singles offered on eBay over the years (some as high as US$53) but ended up settling at US$40 with free shipping thrown in. Very gratifying to see a large space completed!

Like
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"Thank you to all members of Stamporama who generously donate stamps to our project."

holocauststampsproje ...
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amsd

Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
23 Sep 2021
01:59:53pm

Auctions

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Dave,

catalogues are a starting point, and often not an accurate one at that (I need some MCV stamps i never see), and since most of my purchases are of covers, it's easy to ignore CV altogether.

instead, I look at sales figures (not in any organized way, just anecdotally and putthing things into the siever others might call memory) and go for there.

I think if something is essentially never available, and then it is, AND you want it, well, go grab it.

David

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"Save the USPS, buy stamps; save the hobby, use commemoratives"

juicyheads.com/link. ...
HolocaustStamps

Collecting one stamp for each of the 1.5 Million children murdered in The Holocaust.

23 Sep 2021
02:25:44pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

Thanks David. I followed your wise advice (and included the great comments by others).

Looking at a variety of places to buy stamps, this complete set was the only one available (IN THE WORLD APPARENTLY!!!) as of today, and the only one I've ever seen. In fact, I could find only a few of the singles right now (and per-unit priced much higher than my aggregate deal).

So, this may prove the point of asking "Do I want it? Can I afford it? How happy will I be to consummate it?" rather than "What does a semi-subjective book say it's worth? What is the least amount I can pay for it?"

So thanks to everyone for the helpful feedback!

Dave.

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BenFranklin1902

Tom in Exton, PA
23 Sep 2021
07:53:09pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

That's all well and good for standard single stamps, but what about other stuff?

For instance, my 1903 Ben Franklin collection is down to finding unique items, some of which I've never seen before. Whether it's an unusual multiple, a private perf I've never seen or interesting franking on a cover, there is no catalog. I have to gauge my desire and pocketbook against what the seller is asking. Note- there are some items I've bookmarked on eBay hoping the seller will hear a voice of reason someday!

In my New Jersey cancellation cover collection, I have a few ways to check desirability... first I have a book that outlines every post office ever in existence, and it's dates. So I find a cover from a post office that was only there for five years in the 1880s? How do I value that?

It's getting tougher and tougher for me to find any covers I need for this collection. Still, some of my favorite dealers on my feed who start everything at $1 come across a few things from time to time. I don't have any issue paying a few dollars for an insignificant cover since someone spent their time marketing it to me on eBay. That's worth something and I'm happy to pay some for that.

Still there are dealers who have had the same covers for sale at huge prices for years in their eBay stores! And I'm not paying it!

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Love & Peace
23 Sep 2021
08:03:22pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"How much is enough or too much to pay?"

Good question. It's difficult to answer because it will depend on individual. There is no correct or incorrect answer.
.
If you are on budget, then stay at your % of CV. However, there are rare stamps that will complete your collection and these rare stamps may never be seen again. In this case, you might want to buy it even if you went way above CV.
.
For my stamp club, we don't have budget. We will buy it way above CV or out bid everyone. There are certain stamps no longer exist in the world and this is why we will pay at all cost.

French Polynesia Stamp Club

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"Love & Peace. Bonjour Mesdames et messieurs. Que l'amour et la paix soient avec toi. Merci."
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angore

Al
Collector, Moderator
24 Sep 2021
05:49:59am

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

It is strictly a personal decision.

Some live by the notion they always want to get a good deal so their focus on solely on cost against a standard for the satisfaction of a good deal. These people usually always talk about their great deals. This is no isolated to stamps.

Some live on desire to acquire and buy whatever makes them happy and the actual value is much less important. Some live beyond their means.

Then there are people in between the extremes.

Now, many reference catalog values but the catalog is an imperfect indicator of market value. In fact, I think it sets values more than it reflects values.

What is the value of happiness if that is your goal?

In stamps, one question is if you believe you can actually get it for less later.

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Stamp Collecting is a many splendored thing"

Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
24 Sep 2021
11:53:45pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

My decision tree;

1.) "Oh, there is a stamp I don't recall having, or even seeing recently." (Me browsing an auction or sales list."

2.) Do I want it, or need it for the appropriate album ?

3.) Can I afford it.
a. No ( move on down the track.)
b. Yes ( Take out emotional scale and weigh the options.)

4a.) Dam, I really feel warm and fuzzy about having that copy.) = buy it.
4b.) Warm but not fuzzy, am I likely to see a similar copy again.
a. No (recheck scale)
b. Yes, There are lots of examples in the marketplace. Some at better prices.
4c.) cold - Take a pass.


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cougar

26 Sep 2021
04:31:21pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

"How much is enough or too much to pay?"



To me the answer lies in how many stamps are left out there to collect. If it is just a few, I will pay whatever unreasonable price is asked of me and end the search.

My problem is, the stamps I need are not dozens, not hundreds, not even thousands, but more like hundreds of thousands. This makes me quickly aware that if I spent even a fraction of the catalog price, I may be putting the shelter over my family's head in jeopardy. Same shelter that is used by me, my dog and my existing stamp collection.Happy


This makes me modify my collector's behavior. The catalog of stamps with all listed stamp issues is like the world's population of game animals, birds and fish.

I go out hunting daily, or whenever I feel like it; if I shoot down a couple of grouse or catch a couple of trout for the day, I call it a good day and look forward to the next.

Like 
2 Members
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Sarge

26 Sep 2021
05:53:00pm

re: How much is enough or too much to pay?

I agree hole heartily with the last two posts.

I for one give myself a speed limit $ amount of what I am willing to spend usually no more than 30% of retail value for the day. There are exceptions to this rule that I have imposed on myself. Big Grin

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Login to Like
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