Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
The stamps on the left are imperforate.
Some countries in the past have deliberately issued imperforated sheetlets.
Has New Zealand done the same?
My Stanley Gibbons New Zealand catalogue only goes up to 2005.
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Only suggestion I can come up with is they were from a self adhesive sheet and cut rather than peeled from the backing paper.
This link has technical details.
https://virtualnewzealandstamps.blogspot.com/2015/04/2009-2010-scenic-definitives.html#more
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Looking at a blown up image, the word Tolaga on the perfed stamp appears different to that on the other two, or is that a mark on the mount?
Can you read the cancellation date on the imperf stamps, the printed date looks to be the same, 2009.
Maybe someone is faking NZ stamps as well as UK ones!
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Sheepshanks:- Thanks for that link.
Unfortunately no further forward. No mention of booklets, coils, sheetlets that contain 2 x 30cent stamps together.
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That link does say the SA are tagged with red phosphor.
2009 Technical information.
Date of issue:
1 July 2009.
Stamps:
One self-adhesive and six gummed stamps.
Denominations:
30c, $1.80 (gummed and self-adhesive), $2.30, $2.80, $3.30, $4.00.
Designed by:
Stamps Business, New Zealand Post, Wellington.
Printer and process:
Southern Colour Print, New Zealand by offset lithography.
Number of colours:
Four process colours (self-adhesive tagged with red phosphor).
Stamp size:
30mm x 25mm.
Paper type:
Gummed: Tullis Russell 104gsm red phosphor gummed stamp paper; self-adhesive: Avery Dennison B100 PS1 Gloss Back Adhesive 210gsm.
Stamps per sheet:
30c - 100 stamps, $1.80, $2.30, $2.80, $3.30, $4.00 - 50 stamps.
Perforation gauge:
Gummed: 13.33; self-adhesive: die cut.
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I must have missed what to click on to get the specification.
The 30cent was only on gummed paper not self adhesive.
I looked at them under UV light, both long and short wave. When compared side by side there was no noticable difference between them that could be spotted by the naked eye.
There are no ghost perforation marks between the two under magnification that I can see.
They may be genuine imperforated or part of a sheet of printers waste.
Its just a shame they are not on cover.
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Ian, just realised that I was reading that wrong (thinking both 30 cents and 1,80 were SA), Maybe contact the owners of that website with your query.
Did you check on that Tolega anomaly?
My 2014 Scott does not have any variations or SS shown for that value.
The specs were further down the page, easily missed.
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Apparently there was a 2018 reprint where the imprint is different but have not found an image.
Issued as counter roll and booklet
Edit.
Looking at the perfed stamp again, the letter "d" of Zealand looks a different typeface?
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I did find the specs down near the bottom of the page. I was looking for pictures so the brain ignored all the writing after 2009.
The tolega anomaly appears to be caused by a miniscule shift of the green colour.
I'll have a look at the d later. (I can't do it now as the missus is asleep and the stamp is in the next room)
I won't contact that site as they are in the process of trying to offload it.
I'll try and find photos of the coil and booklet.
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Where did you find mention of a reprint in 2018 and they were available in coils and Booklets as 30c in 2018 was never a postal rate.
50 cents appears to be the smallest value stamp in booklets from 2009.
I've hunted the internet and can find no mention that the 30c is imperf or as a coil or in a booklet.
The PE45a mentioned in your last post is a major perf shift error.
I'll email a New Zealand stamp dealer tommorrow for information.
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I websearched Talaga 30c stamp and this was one of the sites returned. New issue notes for 2018. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree?
https://323yfe3mr9mijtj8a3j9xqh6-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/ACS-8431-CP-Newsletter-December-2018_WEB.pdf
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Sheepshanks:-
The imperf stamps are dated 2009 so they cannot be the 2018 variant as they would be dated 2018.
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This is very true, not sure my brain is working properly today.
Perhaps someone photocopied them and cut them out, but that would not account for the phosphor.
Will be interesting to know the real reason, hopefully for you they will prove to be an imperf pair.
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Sheepshanks:-
I've just emailed a New Zealand dealer. Its the middle of the night there but hopefully they will respond tommorrow.
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Ian I think I may have found an answer for you.
From this website,
https://stampsnz.com/2009_best_new_zealand_post_reward_points.html
"Each year New Zealand Post produces a limited number of miniature sheets, imperforate sheets of stamps and such as a reward for direct customers. These items can only be purchased from bonus Points accumulated from purchases in the year. None of the items here are available for general sale.
As there are so few produced, the items are quite hard to come by."
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Sheepshanks:-
Much appreciated and nice try.
However there is no miniature sheet with two 30c stamps side by side imperforated, so far.
I emailed Campbell Patterson a couple of days back but they are yet to respond.
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Ian, I read it that they produce imperforate sheets other than those shown on the above website. Maybe as one-offs for their direct customers, could be any design was how I took it.
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Sheepshanks:-
The site that you linked is not New Zealand Posts' site.
It appears to be a Commercial Site that lists New Zealand stamps for sale.
The "Best of" series for rewarding loyal customers of New Zealand are shown on the site, if you notice that the prices they show for them allows for their scarcity.
If anyone finds them in a collection or mixed box at auction buy them as they are at a premium.
The imperf sheets are few and far between and are not an annual event.
Here is an interesting site:-
https://shop.completestamp.com/collectables/new-zealand-stamps-postal-history?category=Errors - 2000 - on Issues&
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Ian, sorry to belabour a point, this is from NZ post website regarding their rewards points program.
" 2000 points One set of imperforated stamp sheets of each denomination, selected from one of our stamp issues from the current calendar year stamp programme."
It's possible a dealer buying bulk new issues would accumulate those points, they are allocated at one point for every dollar spent. Maybe they chose to use them as postage at some time or whoever bought the sheet from them used them.
Presume you have not had an answer back from the dealer?
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Sheepshanks
You must have done better than me as I searched their site for the rewards programme but nothing came up and I tried various keywords all to no avail. If you could post the link I would be grateful.
Still no response from Campbell Paterson.
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Ian, this is the page.
https://collectables.nzpost.co.nz/about-kiwi-collector-rewards/
It was under account information, which only appears after you click on help and information.
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Sheepshanks:-
Thanks. To get an imperf sheet you need to buy $2000 worth of items in a year. That counts me out.
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"That counts me out"
Well maybe she who must be obeyed could put it down as a business expense.
I guess a serious new issue collector or stamp dealer would spend far more than that, but not the like of us part timers, although if it is you that has just one the Euro jackpot of £122 million, I guess you could now afford any stamps you want.
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I haven't checked my lottery ticket yet!
I always let "she who thinks she must be obeyed" check it first!
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She checked the lottery ticket and we WON!!!!!
Yes £121,999,997.20
less than £122,000,000
YUP the enormous sum of £2.80
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Nearly covered the ticket cost then. All I won last night was a free play.
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Just to let people know.
I have been unable to find any further information as to where these originate or value. I have tried a few "reputable" authorities but have never had a response so far.
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I've heard back from New Zealand Post.
They confirm that the stamps came from an imperf sheet of stamps which was part of their rewards scheme and issued during 2010.
They would not tell me how many of these sheets were produced or distributed.
To earn the complete set of imperf sheets for the 2009 Scenic Definitives, of which the 30c is one of the set of 6 stamps, you have to purchase NZ$2000 (US$1453.91 at todays rate) worth of items from New Zealand Post.
I presume that most collectors would keep the imperf sheets for themselves thus I think that there would be few Used examples.
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01:25:49am
" ... None of the items here are available for general sale. ..."
Would that not mean they are labels and not legitimately, "postage stamps ?"
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It all depends on your own definition postage use.
The pair I own have been used and been through the postal system.
It would have been great if the stamps were on a cover.
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11:31:14am
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The stamps on the left are imperforate.
Some countries in the past have deliberately issued imperforated sheetlets.
Has New Zealand done the same?
My Stanley Gibbons New Zealand catalogue only goes up to 2005.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Only suggestion I can come up with is they were from a self adhesive sheet and cut rather than peeled from the backing paper.
This link has technical details.
https://virtualnewzealandstamps.blogspot.com/2015/04/2009-2010-scenic-definitives.html#more
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Looking at a blown up image, the word Tolaga on the perfed stamp appears different to that on the other two, or is that a mark on the mount?
Can you read the cancellation date on the imperf stamps, the printed date looks to be the same, 2009.
Maybe someone is faking NZ stamps as well as UK ones!
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03:34:42pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:- Thanks for that link.
Unfortunately no further forward. No mention of booklets, coils, sheetlets that contain 2 x 30cent stamps together.
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this post
re: New Zealand Query
That link does say the SA are tagged with red phosphor.
2009 Technical information.
Date of issue:
1 July 2009.
Stamps:
One self-adhesive and six gummed stamps.
Denominations:
30c, $1.80 (gummed and self-adhesive), $2.30, $2.80, $3.30, $4.00.
Designed by:
Stamps Business, New Zealand Post, Wellington.
Printer and process:
Southern Colour Print, New Zealand by offset lithography.
Number of colours:
Four process colours (self-adhesive tagged with red phosphor).
Stamp size:
30mm x 25mm.
Paper type:
Gummed: Tullis Russell 104gsm red phosphor gummed stamp paper; self-adhesive: Avery Dennison B100 PS1 Gloss Back Adhesive 210gsm.
Stamps per sheet:
30c - 100 stamps, $1.80, $2.30, $2.80, $3.30, $4.00 - 50 stamps.
Perforation gauge:
Gummed: 13.33; self-adhesive: die cut.
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03:52:14pm
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re: New Zealand Query
I must have missed what to click on to get the specification.
The 30cent was only on gummed paper not self adhesive.
I looked at them under UV light, both long and short wave. When compared side by side there was no noticable difference between them that could be spotted by the naked eye.
There are no ghost perforation marks between the two under magnification that I can see.
They may be genuine imperforated or part of a sheet of printers waste.
Its just a shame they are not on cover.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Ian, just realised that I was reading that wrong (thinking both 30 cents and 1,80 were SA), Maybe contact the owners of that website with your query.
Did you check on that Tolega anomaly?
My 2014 Scott does not have any variations or SS shown for that value.
The specs were further down the page, easily missed.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Apparently there was a 2018 reprint where the imprint is different but have not found an image.
Issued as counter roll and booklet
Edit.
Looking at the perfed stamp again, the letter "d" of Zealand looks a different typeface?
Login to Like
this post
06:40:54pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
I did find the specs down near the bottom of the page. I was looking for pictures so the brain ignored all the writing after 2009.
The tolega anomaly appears to be caused by a miniscule shift of the green colour.
I'll have a look at the d later. (I can't do it now as the missus is asleep and the stamp is in the next room)
I won't contact that site as they are in the process of trying to offload it.
I'll try and find photos of the coil and booklet.
Login to Like
this post
07:33:56pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Where did you find mention of a reprint in 2018 and they were available in coils and Booklets as 30c in 2018 was never a postal rate.
50 cents appears to be the smallest value stamp in booklets from 2009.
I've hunted the internet and can find no mention that the 30c is imperf or as a coil or in a booklet.
The PE45a mentioned in your last post is a major perf shift error.
I'll email a New Zealand stamp dealer tommorrow for information.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
I websearched Talaga 30c stamp and this was one of the sites returned. New issue notes for 2018. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree?
https://323yfe3mr9mijtj8a3j9xqh6-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/ACS-8431-CP-Newsletter-December-2018_WEB.pdf
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08:54:30pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:-
The imperf stamps are dated 2009 so they cannot be the 2018 variant as they would be dated 2018.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
This is very true, not sure my brain is working properly today.
Perhaps someone photocopied them and cut them out, but that would not account for the phosphor.
Will be interesting to know the real reason, hopefully for you they will prove to be an imperf pair.
Login to Like
this post
11:50:28am
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:-
I've just emailed a New Zealand dealer. Its the middle of the night there but hopefully they will respond tommorrow.
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: New Zealand Query
Ian I think I may have found an answer for you.
From this website,
https://stampsnz.com/2009_best_new_zealand_post_reward_points.html
"Each year New Zealand Post produces a limited number of miniature sheets, imperforate sheets of stamps and such as a reward for direct customers. These items can only be purchased from bonus Points accumulated from purchases in the year. None of the items here are available for general sale.
As there are so few produced, the items are quite hard to come by."
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08:33:39pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:-
Much appreciated and nice try.
However there is no miniature sheet with two 30c stamps side by side imperforated, so far.
I emailed Campbell Patterson a couple of days back but they are yet to respond.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Ian, I read it that they produce imperforate sheets other than those shown on the above website. Maybe as one-offs for their direct customers, could be any design was how I took it.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
05:21:45am
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:-
The site that you linked is not New Zealand Posts' site.
It appears to be a Commercial Site that lists New Zealand stamps for sale.
The "Best of" series for rewarding loyal customers of New Zealand are shown on the site, if you notice that the prices they show for them allows for their scarcity.
If anyone finds them in a collection or mixed box at auction buy them as they are at a premium.
The imperf sheets are few and far between and are not an annual event.
Here is an interesting site:-
https://shop.completestamp.com/collectables/new-zealand-stamps-postal-history?category=Errors - 2000 - on Issues&
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Ian, sorry to belabour a point, this is from NZ post website regarding their rewards points program.
" 2000 points One set of imperforated stamp sheets of each denomination, selected from one of our stamp issues from the current calendar year stamp programme."
It's possible a dealer buying bulk new issues would accumulate those points, they are allocated at one point for every dollar spent. Maybe they chose to use them as postage at some time or whoever bought the sheet from them used them.
Presume you have not had an answer back from the dealer?
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07:52:56pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks
You must have done better than me as I searched their site for the rewards programme but nothing came up and I tried various keywords all to no avail. If you could post the link I would be grateful.
Still no response from Campbell Paterson.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Ian, this is the page.
https://collectables.nzpost.co.nz/about-kiwi-collector-rewards/
It was under account information, which only appears after you click on help and information.
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08:19:47pm
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re: New Zealand Query
Sheepshanks:-
Thanks. To get an imperf sheet you need to buy $2000 worth of items in a year. That counts me out.
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
"That counts me out"
Well maybe she who must be obeyed could put it down as a business expense.
I guess a serious new issue collector or stamp dealer would spend far more than that, but not the like of us part timers, although if it is you that has just one the Euro jackpot of £122 million, I guess you could now afford any stamps you want.
Login to Like
this post
08:57:45pm
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re: New Zealand Query
I haven't checked my lottery ticket yet!
I always let "she who thinks she must be obeyed" check it first!
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
11:12:17am
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re: New Zealand Query
She checked the lottery ticket and we WON!!!!!
Yes £121,999,997.20
less than £122,000,000
YUP the enormous sum of £2.80
Login to Like
this post
re: New Zealand Query
Nearly covered the ticket cost then. All I won last night was a free play.
Login to Like
this post
03:34:48pm
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
Just to let people know.
I have been unable to find any further information as to where these originate or value. I have tried a few "reputable" authorities but have never had a response so far.
Login to Like
this post
11:20:57am
Approvals
re: New Zealand Query
I've heard back from New Zealand Post.
They confirm that the stamps came from an imperf sheet of stamps which was part of their rewards scheme and issued during 2010.
They would not tell me how many of these sheets were produced or distributed.
To earn the complete set of imperf sheets for the 2009 Scenic Definitives, of which the 30c is one of the set of 6 stamps, you have to purchase NZ$2000 (US$1453.91 at todays rate) worth of items from New Zealand Post.
I presume that most collectors would keep the imperf sheets for themselves thus I think that there would be few Used examples.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
30 May 2021
01:25:49am
re: New Zealand Query
" ... None of the items here are available for general sale. ..."
Would that not mean they are labels and not legitimately, "postage stamps ?"
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05:07:01am
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re: New Zealand Query
It all depends on your own definition postage use.
The pair I own have been used and been through the postal system.
It would have been great if the stamps were on a cover.
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