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Sales, Swaps, Auction & Approvals/Auction Disc. : My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

 

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Stampaholic
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15 Feb 2021
05:48:37am

Auctions
I have and continue to have a policy that I do not bid against my buyers. Here on Stamporama
or any other auction site if I know it's one of my buyers. I have had this policy since about 2006 when I first started selling on the internet. I'm not going to change my policy. Therefore under the current situation I will not bid against anyone (be it buyer or otherwise) here. I keep my promises and honor and respect anyone else who keeps their promises also.Thumbs Up

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" I have a burning love for stamps. Lord A'mighty ,feel my temperature risin'! "
Brechinite

15 Feb 2021
09:44:25am

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"Therefore under the current situation I will not bid against anyone (be it buyer or otherwise) here.
"



I am not against Stampaholic's policy.

It is any members right to do what they want within the rules.

I would like to point out that we can no longer identify who is bidding on what.

If everybody stuck to the Quotation above:-

What is the point of Listing anything for Auction here???????

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Harvey
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!

15 Feb 2021
10:44:04am
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I don't think there are very many of us who would get upset in you bid against us. I only buy, I have no interest in selling stamps, but I honestly would not mind if someone I bought from bid against me, most of the sellers here also collect! I'm an ex-antique dealer and I used to run into this all the time at auctions, people I sold to got really upset when I bid against them. They totally ignored the fact that I collected as well. I just ignored them and if there was an object I wanted, I bid - I really didn't care if they felt betrayed by that or not. Carl, if you want something for whatever reason, you should go for it. Happy

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Tom in Exton, PA

16 Feb 2021
10:15:49am
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I know EBay masked bidders a long time ago because people were following bidders and placing bids to bully them, or just because it was easier to bid on things a knowledgeable person had already cherry picked. On eBay, wise sellers used a separate account for bidding just to avoid issues with their customers.

I remember one incident where someone found a very rare super hero figure cheap as part of a lot. He turned around and listed it, from the same account, for a lot of money. The original seller saw this and caused a big stink on message boards. And buyers could see what he had paid, best to separate!

I also like that on eBay people I knew didn’t know my seller account name. I’m one where if someone I know needs something I’m likely to just give it to them, but there are times you do need to get fair value for an item. There were many times, after the bidding was over, where I discovered that the buyer was a friend of mine. The auction had run fair and square so there were no hurt feelings ether way.

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Stampaholic
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16 Feb 2021
10:51:34am

Auctions
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

For many, many years CPConway and I had an ongoing bidding war on Ebay. Was frustrating. When Charlie joined Stamporama and started buying my lots I quit bidding against him. I saved him a good bit of money. Unfortunately,Charlie passed away a few years ago.
The thing is I consider many members here friends, I don't bid against friends.
A few I know personally from having met them at stamp shows. There's no way I would bid against Ernie or any of them and even though I have never met Liz, I wouldn't never bid against her (even though she probably wouldn't mind). My understanding is Stamporama is a friendly site, unlike Ebay or Hipstamp. I've been a member of Stamporama 11 years,now
and have several buyers that have bought hundreds of dollars worth of lots. I certainly wouldn't bid against any of them. I have on rare occasions bid on lots only after I have contacted another bidder to ask if they were done bidding, then I would bid, but can't do that now.
BTW: Harvey, appreciate your offer but I just won't change my policy.
Also BTW: Today I hit the big 74.Thumbs Up

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roy
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16 Feb 2021
05:37:11pm
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

But what do you if the seller is a friend too, and you see his stuff going for a ridiculously low price because nobody will bid 'cause they all know the guy who has the only bid and share your approach?

Your friendship towards the buyers you know is coming at the expense of the sellers. That's why the bidders' identities are now anonymous.

In the "real" auction market, it is called "collusion".

Roy




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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads

16 Feb 2021
05:57:20pm

Auctions
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

happy birthday Carl

may someone list that elusive stamp you want and you bid first and everyone else either already has it or uses the Carl principle

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Brechinite

16 Feb 2021
06:14:15pm

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

What is the point of Listing anything for Auction here???????

No point whatsoever if the attitude represented here is likened by the majority.

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rrraphy
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Retired Consultant APS#186030

16 Feb 2021
08:47:25pm

Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I have usually (but not always) avoided to bid against club members who were my buyers as well. (occasionally though I must have a stamp...I am after all a collector first!). It has occasionally posed a dilemma. But knowing who you are bidding against preserves a Club atmosphere.
I think ebay hid the buyer's id to prevent buyers and sellers from contacting one another and deal outside their marketplace. Hipstamp similarly discourages contacts. Alas, buyers cannot contact one another....Between seller and buyer, you can exchange emails after you buy and bypass the system thereafter, so even their efforts are doomed, but it does eliminates buyers contacting one another, which is a shame, a real shame.

Do we really want to segregate our members? There is no financial incentive for SOR.
Here we want Club members to relate together, I think. Should someone buy a set of stamps, you can possibly contact the buyer and ask if they wish to part with the one stamp you want, if they already have it for example.

In person when we met at our Stamp Club you see and know who you bid against. It brings in an extra human element, like deciding on how much to push the bidding based on what you know about the other member, taking into account collecting interests and even financial parameters. For those reasons I always prefer to know who I am bidding against. Not to say that anonymity does not have some benefits, but to me in a Club setting, it is not equal to what you lose. Still it is not a clear cut situation.

I don't think collusion was ever part of the equation?

rrr...

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musicman
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APS #213005

16 Feb 2021
09:18:45pm
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, CARL!!!

Party

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Laeding
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17 Feb 2021
12:28:58am
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I have no problem at all bidding against anyone, friend, dealer, club member, third cousin, etc.

At one time, i was a very serious buyer at auctions, particularly in Scandinavia, whether online or floor bidding. One of the houses would show our ID's in the online auctions, and I found myself going to battle with the same ID numbers on a regular basis. For their online auctions, there was no way to "snipe" as they would simply add 2 minutes to the clock if there was a bid in the last 30 seconds or so and so on and so forth, so it really was a battle for many of the lots. To make things even more challenging, the next lot would be counting down while I was bidding on previous lot in "overtime," so I was often bidding in the same auction on several screens/devices. Sometimes I won, sometimes I lost, and I never knew to whom, nor did I care, but I always felt that they must have been people I would have enjoyed meeting and getting to know as we shared the same collecting interest.

At our local club, we all know who collects what -- and no one has a problem bidding against one another (there are several dealers, too) but I suspect some folks back down when certain people are bidding on certain lots.

When it comes to EBAY and the other online markets, if asked, I am more than happy to let my friends know whether I'm bidding on an item they are interested in.

At local auctions, collector friends have no problem bidding against each other, and I know some enlist the services of an agent. Did some of them work out deals on certain lots? Probably. As I specialize in a certain area, the Danish West Indies, many collectors and dealers who know me will often have me look over lots that contain DWI to see what I think of that section either to get my assessment of the value (and correctly ID material) and/or if there was anything I might be interested in purchasing if they won the lot, and this has been very helpful to my friends (namely the dealers) and my own collection. These are typically lots such as US, Possessions, WW, and Scandinavia that I generally had no interest in bidding on as I would have to breakdown and unload the material i don't want.

A dealer friend (specializes in classic US) called me a number of years age after winning a collection of DWI to help in ID'ing everything properly and pricing for sale. The material was really great, and I knew exactly what he paid for it (a bargain) and thought he'd have no problem in turning it over for a very nice profit if it was priced right -- I even had other collectors I knew who between them would have snapped it all up very quickly. He told me the prices I had recommended were too low. Years later, most of it was still in his inventory. I gently suggested dropping the prices and blowing it out, and he told me "well, then I wouldn't have anything in this area to offer to sell."

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Stampaholic
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17 Feb 2021
02:12:40am

Auctions
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

OK! let's try this. I have been buying from a dealer at the stamp shows in Orlando for 20 years.I wanted to go to Michael Roger's auctions and needed a reference. He gave me a good reference and I got to attend the auctions. most times we were at the auction at the same time. there was no way I was going to bid against him on a lot. If it wasn't for him I wouldn't have even been there. I believe it has something to do with loyalty.
to the best of my knowledge most of buyers have appreciated my policy or principle as David calls it. "principle", a good word in my book.Happy
BTW: thanks for the birthday wishes. I got a helluva birthday present this evening : got my corona virus vaccine shot. Big Grin



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Brechinite

17 Feb 2021
04:57:43am

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

There is no "solution" to the points raised.

It is down to each individual's own conscience, set of principles and morality.

Just don't try to force ones own "code" on others..

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DaveSheridan
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17 Feb 2021
05:53:42am
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

Some may find it honourable, I find it rather odd.

As a seller, I want every man (and his dog if available) to bid on my items. If every second potential buyer pulls out because of honour, sellers' livelihoods would be shot to s***!


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Brechinite

17 Feb 2021
08:13:53am

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"If every second potential buyer pulls out"



Why do you think a lot of sellers use "Buy It Now". Where the auction price is equal to or one cent less than the "Buy It Now" price.

Of course some sellers may load the "Buy It Now" price because they know that a lower auction starting bid is pointless here.

At any auction whether it be online or physical any bidder has no god given right to seek favouritism from the auctioneer or any other participant. I have seen "friends" come to blows because one bid against the other.....how childish!
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snowy12
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24 Jun 2021
09:44:52am

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I never knowingly resell something I have purchased on the same site .But with Carls philosophy as another member said you might as well not have auctions .
Our club had a monster auction on Monday and ther was some ferocious bidding even though we all know each other.
If it is a stamp,cover or what ever you let your collection suffer because you don't want to bid against someone you know sorry I don't agree.
Brian

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Brechinite

24 Jun 2021
10:43:49am

Auctions - Approvals
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"All is fair in love, war and auctions!"

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philb
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24 Jun 2021
12:16:45pm

Auctions
re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

Stampaholic do you send invoices ? phil

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Author/Postings
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Stampaholic

15 Feb 2021
05:48:37am

Auctions

I have and continue to have a policy that I do not bid against my buyers. Here on Stamporama
or any other auction site if I know it's one of my buyers. I have had this policy since about 2006 when I first started selling on the internet. I'm not going to change my policy. Therefore under the current situation I will not bid against anyone (be it buyer or otherwise) here. I keep my promises and honor and respect anyone else who keeps their promises also.Thumbs Up

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" I have a burning love for stamps. Lord A'mighty ,feel my temperature risin'! "
Brechinite

15 Feb 2021
09:44:25am

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"Therefore under the current situation I will not bid against anyone (be it buyer or otherwise) here.
"



I am not against Stampaholic's policy.

It is any members right to do what they want within the rules.

I would like to point out that we can no longer identify who is bidding on what.

If everybody stuck to the Quotation above:-

What is the point of Listing anything for Auction here???????

Like 
3 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.

"Gonnae no dae that!..........Just gonnae no!"

This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
15 Feb 2021
10:44:04am

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I don't think there are very many of us who would get upset in you bid against us. I only buy, I have no interest in selling stamps, but I honestly would not mind if someone I bought from bid against me, most of the sellers here also collect! I'm an ex-antique dealer and I used to run into this all the time at auctions, people I sold to got really upset when I bid against them. They totally ignored the fact that I collected as well. I just ignored them and if there was an object I wanted, I bid - I really didn't care if they felt betrayed by that or not. Carl, if you want something for whatever reason, you should go for it. Happy

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" An expert is one who knows more and more about less and less until they finally know everything about nothing. A generalist is someone who knows less and less about more and more until eventually they know nothing about everything!"
Members Picture
BenFranklin1902

Tom in Exton, PA
16 Feb 2021
10:15:49am

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I know EBay masked bidders a long time ago because people were following bidders and placing bids to bully them, or just because it was easier to bid on things a knowledgeable person had already cherry picked. On eBay, wise sellers used a separate account for bidding just to avoid issues with their customers.

I remember one incident where someone found a very rare super hero figure cheap as part of a lot. He turned around and listed it, from the same account, for a lot of money. The original seller saw this and caused a big stink on message boards. And buyers could see what he had paid, best to separate!

I also like that on eBay people I knew didn’t know my seller account name. I’m one where if someone I know needs something I’m likely to just give it to them, but there are times you do need to get fair value for an item. There were many times, after the bidding was over, where I discovered that the buyer was a friend of mine. The auction had run fair and square so there were no hurt feelings ether way.

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"Check out my eBay Stuff! Username Turtles-Trading-Post"
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Stampaholic

16 Feb 2021
10:51:34am

Auctions

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

For many, many years CPConway and I had an ongoing bidding war on Ebay. Was frustrating. When Charlie joined Stamporama and started buying my lots I quit bidding against him. I saved him a good bit of money. Unfortunately,Charlie passed away a few years ago.
The thing is I consider many members here friends, I don't bid against friends.
A few I know personally from having met them at stamp shows. There's no way I would bid against Ernie or any of them and even though I have never met Liz, I wouldn't never bid against her (even though she probably wouldn't mind). My understanding is Stamporama is a friendly site, unlike Ebay or Hipstamp. I've been a member of Stamporama 11 years,now
and have several buyers that have bought hundreds of dollars worth of lots. I certainly wouldn't bid against any of them. I have on rare occasions bid on lots only after I have contacted another bidder to ask if they were done bidding, then I would bid, but can't do that now.
BTW: Harvey, appreciate your offer but I just won't change my policy.
Also BTW: Today I hit the big 74.Thumbs Up

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" I have a burning love for stamps. Lord A'mighty ,feel my temperature risin'! "

BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
16 Feb 2021
05:37:11pm

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

But what do you if the seller is a friend too, and you see his stuff going for a ridiculously low price because nobody will bid 'cause they all know the guy who has the only bid and share your approach?

Your friendship towards the buyers you know is coming at the expense of the sellers. That's why the bidders' identities are now anonymous.

In the "real" auction market, it is called "collusion".

Roy




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"Over 8,000 new covers coming to Buckacover.com on Thursday August 24. See my homepage for details."

www.Buckacover.com
Members Picture
amsd

Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
16 Feb 2021
05:57:20pm

Auctions

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

happy birthday Carl

may someone list that elusive stamp you want and you bid first and everyone else either already has it or uses the Carl principle

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"Save the USPS, buy stamps; save the hobby, use commemoratives"

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Brechinite

16 Feb 2021
06:14:15pm

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

What is the point of Listing anything for Auction here???????

No point whatsoever if the attitude represented here is likened by the majority.

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"Gonnae no dae that!..........Just gonnae no!"
Members Picture
rrraphy

Retired Consultant APS#186030
16 Feb 2021
08:47:25pm

Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I have usually (but not always) avoided to bid against club members who were my buyers as well. (occasionally though I must have a stamp...I am after all a collector first!). It has occasionally posed a dilemma. But knowing who you are bidding against preserves a Club atmosphere.
I think ebay hid the buyer's id to prevent buyers and sellers from contacting one another and deal outside their marketplace. Hipstamp similarly discourages contacts. Alas, buyers cannot contact one another....Between seller and buyer, you can exchange emails after you buy and bypass the system thereafter, so even their efforts are doomed, but it does eliminates buyers contacting one another, which is a shame, a real shame.

Do we really want to segregate our members? There is no financial incentive for SOR.
Here we want Club members to relate together, I think. Should someone buy a set of stamps, you can possibly contact the buyer and ask if they wish to part with the one stamp you want, if they already have it for example.

In person when we met at our Stamp Club you see and know who you bid against. It brings in an extra human element, like deciding on how much to push the bidding based on what you know about the other member, taking into account collecting interests and even financial parameters. For those reasons I always prefer to know who I am bidding against. Not to say that anonymity does not have some benefits, but to me in a Club setting, it is not equal to what you lose. Still it is not a clear cut situation.

I don't think collusion was ever part of the equation?

rrr...

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musicman

APS #213005
16 Feb 2021
09:18:45pm

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY, CARL!!!

Party

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Laeding

17 Feb 2021
12:28:58am

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I have no problem at all bidding against anyone, friend, dealer, club member, third cousin, etc.

At one time, i was a very serious buyer at auctions, particularly in Scandinavia, whether online or floor bidding. One of the houses would show our ID's in the online auctions, and I found myself going to battle with the same ID numbers on a regular basis. For their online auctions, there was no way to "snipe" as they would simply add 2 minutes to the clock if there was a bid in the last 30 seconds or so and so on and so forth, so it really was a battle for many of the lots. To make things even more challenging, the next lot would be counting down while I was bidding on previous lot in "overtime," so I was often bidding in the same auction on several screens/devices. Sometimes I won, sometimes I lost, and I never knew to whom, nor did I care, but I always felt that they must have been people I would have enjoyed meeting and getting to know as we shared the same collecting interest.

At our local club, we all know who collects what -- and no one has a problem bidding against one another (there are several dealers, too) but I suspect some folks back down when certain people are bidding on certain lots.

When it comes to EBAY and the other online markets, if asked, I am more than happy to let my friends know whether I'm bidding on an item they are interested in.

At local auctions, collector friends have no problem bidding against each other, and I know some enlist the services of an agent. Did some of them work out deals on certain lots? Probably. As I specialize in a certain area, the Danish West Indies, many collectors and dealers who know me will often have me look over lots that contain DWI to see what I think of that section either to get my assessment of the value (and correctly ID material) and/or if there was anything I might be interested in purchasing if they won the lot, and this has been very helpful to my friends (namely the dealers) and my own collection. These are typically lots such as US, Possessions, WW, and Scandinavia that I generally had no interest in bidding on as I would have to breakdown and unload the material i don't want.

A dealer friend (specializes in classic US) called me a number of years age after winning a collection of DWI to help in ID'ing everything properly and pricing for sale. The material was really great, and I knew exactly what he paid for it (a bargain) and thought he'd have no problem in turning it over for a very nice profit if it was priced right -- I even had other collectors I knew who between them would have snapped it all up very quickly. He told me the prices I had recommended were too low. Years later, most of it was still in his inventory. I gently suggested dropping the prices and blowing it out, and he told me "well, then I wouldn't have anything in this area to offer to sell."

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Stampaholic

17 Feb 2021
02:12:40am

Auctions

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

OK! let's try this. I have been buying from a dealer at the stamp shows in Orlando for 20 years.I wanted to go to Michael Roger's auctions and needed a reference. He gave me a good reference and I got to attend the auctions. most times we were at the auction at the same time. there was no way I was going to bid against him on a lot. If it wasn't for him I wouldn't have even been there. I believe it has something to do with loyalty.
to the best of my knowledge most of buyers have appreciated my policy or principle as David calls it. "principle", a good word in my book.Happy
BTW: thanks for the birthday wishes. I got a helluva birthday present this evening : got my corona virus vaccine shot. Big Grin



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" I have a burning love for stamps. Lord A'mighty ,feel my temperature risin'! "
Brechinite

17 Feb 2021
04:57:43am

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

There is no "solution" to the points raised.

It is down to each individual's own conscience, set of principles and morality.

Just don't try to force ones own "code" on others..

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"Gonnae no dae that!..........Just gonnae no!"
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DaveSheridan

17 Feb 2021
05:53:42am

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

Some may find it honourable, I find it rather odd.

As a seller, I want every man (and his dog if available) to bid on my items. If every second potential buyer pulls out because of honour, sellers' livelihoods would be shot to s***!


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www.ebay.com.au/str/ ...
Brechinite

17 Feb 2021
08:13:53am

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"If every second potential buyer pulls out"



Why do you think a lot of sellers use "Buy It Now". Where the auction price is equal to or one cent less than the "Buy It Now" price.

Of course some sellers may load the "Buy It Now" price because they know that a lower auction starting bid is pointless here.

At any auction whether it be online or physical any bidder has no god given right to seek favouritism from the auctioneer or any other participant. I have seen "friends" come to blows because one bid against the other.....how childish!
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"Gonnae no dae that!..........Just gonnae no!"
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snowy12

24 Jun 2021
09:44:52am

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

I never knowingly resell something I have purchased on the same site .But with Carls philosophy as another member said you might as well not have auctions .
Our club had a monster auction on Monday and ther was some ferocious bidding even though we all know each other.
If it is a stamp,cover or what ever you let your collection suffer because you don't want to bid against someone you know sorry I don't agree.
Brian

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Brechinite

24 Jun 2021
10:43:49am

Auctions - Approvals

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

"All is fair in love, war and auctions!"

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"Gonnae no dae that!..........Just gonnae no!"
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philb

24 Jun 2021
12:16:45pm

Auctions

re: My policy concerning my buyers and bidding.

Stampaholic do you send invoices ? phil

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"And every hair is measured like every grain of sand"
        

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