Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Any ideas?
PP
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time, density, convention, complexity
American postal codes (ZIP +4++) are incredibly detailed descriptions of where a piece of mail is going (I thnk it's up to 14 numbers now). But the rest, name, street, city/state/zip is now very different from a German postal address, although their postal codes are different.
2 centuries ago, often all you'd need is a name and town. or name and county, sometimes. as things got denser, more information was required.
and sometimes, things get through in spite of things, like no address.
one of the clerks, Gail, at my local PO had kept a letter with no address for months; she was just about to send it to the dead letter office when her eye caught a cachet on another letter that similar to the one being held. compared them and sent the first one and the second one to me. Oddly, it wasn't for me, but for Phil (who lives in the same town; and who's a member of SOR).
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When looking at old covers (Pre-1950), I am amazed that the post office actually delivered some of them. The handwriting is so poor on some of them, you wonder how the postman could read it. Of course, there are many others with absolutely beautiful penmanship.
David
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Even in Europe, address styles differ between countries and eras. In Germany, the custom was to write addresses in the order name - town - street, and only in the 1980s the international style name - street - town became mandatory. Even then, due to different approaches to automated mail processing, the placement of the postcode differed between FRG and GDR (in front of the town name in the FRG, below the town name in the GDR). As you may have seen, in some countries such as the Soviet Union the order of the address was completely inverted: town - street - name, and what's more, they put the sender's address at the bottom of the letter. Different places, different customs ...
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"Even then, Due to different approaches to automated mail processing, the placement of the postcode differed between FRG and GDR (in front of the town name in the FRG, below the town name in the GDR)."
And Deutsche Post can be *#%!s about proper addressing also. A few years ago I sent a Christmas card to Germany which was RTS'd (Return to Sender) because of improper address. I got it back in July. I scanned it and emailed my cousin to inquire where I erred in his address. He told me I put the postal code after the city instead of in front, but that the postal clerk who returned it was simply being an ***, and they could easily have delivered it.
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"2 centuries ago, often all you'd need is a name and town. or name and county, sometimes. as things got denser, more information was required."
It was in the mid-60s when my parents (living in the US, then) wanted to contact an old family friend in Germany whom they had not seen for some years, and whose address they did not have. Since it was a small town, they put a description of the address, - -something like, "the small yellow house near the hill with a very large tree." The friend, and my parents, got a good chuckle when the letter actually got delivered.
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Speaking of OLD addressing, one of my favorite covers in an old Denmark collection (sorry, don't have it anymore, so can't post a picture) truly showed what was possible, back then. It was from the 1870's and was addressed simply:
"Pastor H. Andersen,
Her"
Sent in a town of about 800, all that was necessary was the person's name and that it was someone who lived "here."
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I've seen such covers and postcards addressed to "hier" or "here" as well - it seems that this was practised up to the introduction of postcodes, or perhaps by older people even as long as mail was processed locally. In this age of mail centres you cannot do it any more.
But the detailed nature of UK postcodes makes very short addresses possible - since virtually every street has its own postcode, you just need this and the house number since mail is delivered to addresses there, not to specific persons. So, an address like "99, XY1 2AB" would see your letter delivered.
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I have several cards and letters addressed to mister so and so, "hier" or "alhier", which is the Dutch equivalent. Even a condolence card addressed to someone in Amsterdam with this kind of incomplete address. Back in the day (early 1900s) that was obviously enough.
I also have a few letters and cards addressed to my great grandfather as "J.Metselaar, blacksmith in Den Oever", sent from another part of the country. Wonderful isn't it?
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12:16:32pm
Has anyone studied the styles of addressing on covers? I find it interesting that European cover addresses have a different format than American - underlining, spacing, location, and so on. This is especially true once we have typewriters. On older covers addresses are all over the place.
Any ideas?
PP
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re: Addressing
time, density, convention, complexity
American postal codes (ZIP +4++) are incredibly detailed descriptions of where a piece of mail is going (I thnk it's up to 14 numbers now). But the rest, name, street, city/state/zip is now very different from a German postal address, although their postal codes are different.
2 centuries ago, often all you'd need is a name and town. or name and county, sometimes. as things got denser, more information was required.
and sometimes, things get through in spite of things, like no address.
one of the clerks, Gail, at my local PO had kept a letter with no address for months; she was just about to send it to the dead letter office when her eye caught a cachet on another letter that similar to the one being held. compared them and sent the first one and the second one to me. Oddly, it wasn't for me, but for Phil (who lives in the same town; and who's a member of SOR).
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re: Addressing
When looking at old covers (Pre-1950), I am amazed that the post office actually delivered some of them. The handwriting is so poor on some of them, you wonder how the postman could read it. Of course, there are many others with absolutely beautiful penmanship.
David
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this post
re: Addressing
Even in Europe, address styles differ between countries and eras. In Germany, the custom was to write addresses in the order name - town - street, and only in the 1980s the international style name - street - town became mandatory. Even then, due to different approaches to automated mail processing, the placement of the postcode differed between FRG and GDR (in front of the town name in the FRG, below the town name in the GDR). As you may have seen, in some countries such as the Soviet Union the order of the address was completely inverted: town - street - name, and what's more, they put the sender's address at the bottom of the letter. Different places, different customs ...
Login to Like
this post
re: Addressing
"Even then, Due to different approaches to automated mail processing, the placement of the postcode differed between FRG and GDR (in front of the town name in the FRG, below the town name in the GDR)."
And Deutsche Post can be *#%!s about proper addressing also. A few years ago I sent a Christmas card to Germany which was RTS'd (Return to Sender) because of improper address. I got it back in July. I scanned it and emailed my cousin to inquire where I erred in his address. He told me I put the postal code after the city instead of in front, but that the postal clerk who returned it was simply being an ***, and they could easily have delivered it.
Login to Like
this post
re: Addressing
"2 centuries ago, often all you'd need is a name and town. or name and county, sometimes. as things got denser, more information was required."
It was in the mid-60s when my parents (living in the US, then) wanted to contact an old family friend in Germany whom they had not seen for some years, and whose address they did not have. Since it was a small town, they put a description of the address, - -something like, "the small yellow house near the hill with a very large tree." The friend, and my parents, got a good chuckle when the letter actually got delivered.
3 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Addressing
Speaking of OLD addressing, one of my favorite covers in an old Denmark collection (sorry, don't have it anymore, so can't post a picture) truly showed what was possible, back then. It was from the 1870's and was addressed simply:
"Pastor H. Andersen,
Her"
Sent in a town of about 800, all that was necessary was the person's name and that it was someone who lived "here."
Login to Like
this post
re: Addressing
I've seen such covers and postcards addressed to "hier" or "here" as well - it seems that this was practised up to the introduction of postcodes, or perhaps by older people even as long as mail was processed locally. In this age of mail centres you cannot do it any more.
But the detailed nature of UK postcodes makes very short addresses possible - since virtually every street has its own postcode, you just need this and the house number since mail is delivered to addresses there, not to specific persons. So, an address like "99, XY1 2AB" would see your letter delivered.
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Approvals
re: Addressing
I have several cards and letters addressed to mister so and so, "hier" or "alhier", which is the Dutch equivalent. Even a condolence card addressed to someone in Amsterdam with this kind of incomplete address. Back in the day (early 1900s) that was obviously enough.
I also have a few letters and cards addressed to my great grandfather as "J.Metselaar, blacksmith in Den Oever", sent from another part of the country. Wonderful isn't it?
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