Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
I've found for several years the normal seems to be 'no cancel or pen/marker cancel'.
At one time, when I was well enough I could go to our local post office and depending on the mood of one of the postal clerks I 'might' be able to talk them into hand cancelling the stamps for me.
The situation has drastically changed for me - I now have to depend on someone else to take my outgoing mail to a postal box and pick up my incoming mail from a corner community box.
To make matters even more challenging, our small local post office's sales counter is closed to the public. Incoming parcels are being delivered (first time in the 28 years I've lived here) and outgoing parcels are taken to one of the entrances where a postal worker takes the parcel, weighs it and applies applicable postage. I haven't personally seen how this exactly works but I do know no one except the postal workers are allowed inside the post office building.
Postage labels can be printed on-line and postage stamps (if actual stamps are wanted) can be ordered from the Philatelic Service.
Are there others besides myself that are continually receiving these type of complaints?
Maybe the answer is to put a 'cancelled' stamp inside the envelope so a buyer would be ensured they receive a 'used postage stamp' ?
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"Are there others besides myself that are continually receiving these type of complaints?"
Patches, you are not alone in this.
It all boils down to individuals' expectations of what they are paying for when they pay the seller for "shipping".
The buyer is paying for their purchase to be shipped from the seller to the buyer.
Nothing more, nothing less. No "extras".
Most sellers try and use stamps on their packages when shipping but sometimes circumstances do not allow this to happen.
Once an item enters the postal system sellers have no control over what happens to the item.
Unfortunately there are a percentage of buyers who demand and use threats because they expect far more than is possible.
Not every seller has access to a post office or are physically able to go to a post office.
The solution to this is Tolerance!
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Tolerance towards the senders of mail, of course. Tolerance towards the incompetence of service providers, no. The postal enterprises should be the recipients of any complaints about uncancelled stamps (for all the good it does, some are notoriously complaint resistant).
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For Americans, there is always the choice of obtaining a Mailer's Postmark Permit.
The club is gone, but y'all can PM me for a copy of the instructions.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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It's ludicrous for buyers to demand hand cancels or even stamps for that matter. If the seller gets the product to you he or she has fulfilled the obligation. Anything else is gravy.
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For the longest time, I liked the stamps NOT being cancelled.
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"If the seller gets the product to you he or she has fulfilled the obligation. Anything else is gravy."
Yup!
" I received a "BAD" rating on a Circuit yesterday because the stamps weren't cancelled."
Whoever gave you that rating was obviously a real self centred, arrogant plonker!
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02:56:09pm
Ian, you certainly have a way with words! Luv it!!!!
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Harvey:- That was the carefully crafted polite response.
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06:58:22pm
" .... The situation has drastically changed for me -
I now have to depend on someone else to take my outgoing
mail to a postal box and pick up my incoming mail from a
corner community box....."
Same here Liz, I put outgoing mail on the counter at the
entrance to the kitchen, usually under my son's keys or
hat and sunglasses. But he does not pass the post office
every day so the mail may get a tour of the Panhandle for
a day or two before it finds itself in the post office
mail slit.
AS to neat stamps with nice cancels; I always enjoy them,
but would never castigate the seller for the use of some
routine definitives or a massive smudged obliteration was
applied. Perhaps that poorly cancelled stamp might turn
out to be the British Guiana of this era.
Charlie
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When I receive mail with uncanceled stamps I wish to retain, I just have one of the clerks at my post office cancel them lightly for me. They do so without complaint. I do have all my mail delivered to my post office box and they (the clerks) are just a few steps away from my box.
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Folks.....
Unless the seller's terms include the promise of hand-cancelled stamps of a certain type or vintage, buyers have no reason to expect or demand a particular franking or cancellation. One of the respondents, Ian I think, correctly said buyers are paying for the delivery of the purchase. That's it.
Here's our rules on shipping:
"D2. If a lot description does not include shipping terms, the seller must abide by the default terms stated below:
Postage charged to the buyer must be the exact cost of shipping the purchase from the seller to the buyer
No other fees may be charged to the buyer"
Note: the buyer is paying for the franking cost.
Myself, I appreciate anyone who goes out of his or her way to give me the kind of cover I covet (current commemorative with contemporary seals all properly tied, just in case you were wondering), but they are not required to do so, and it is beyond the abiity of most to do it.
Others have already explained, countless times, how many countries' postal services are no longer selling stamps, or make it nearly impossible to attain them; even pre-COVID offices often made hand-cancelling impossible.
So, unless you are paying for the extra time and effort required ot attain a hand-cancel, you cannot expect it. And, it's not the sender's fault if it gets pen cancelled along the way. or scuffed. or wet.
And, finally, have mercy on those of us who are having a tough enough time just traversing a day's activities. Neither Dorian Gray nor Louis Lestat are members.
David
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"And, finally, have mercy on those of us who are having a tough enough time just traversing a day's activities."
Well said David!!
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I have no trouble getting a letter hand canceled at my small, local post office. However, it then enters the mail stream where it invariably gets run through the automatic cancelers. Then it arrives with two cancels, and both are hard to read.
I have an envelope on my stamp desk and keep uncancelled stamps together. When I am going to the post office, I take some with me and have them nicely hand stamped. Sometimes the clerk even lets me do them myself.
It's just hard for me to imagine how anyone can complain about items that arrive uncancelled. Once you drop them in the mail box, it's totally out of your control.
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02:45:08pm
" ... It's just hard for me to imagine how anyone can complain about items that arrive uncancelled ,,,"
It does not seem hard to me. There are some people who, were you to gift them an original inverted Jenny on cover and dated a hundred yeas ago, who would complain that the plate number is not attached.
The problem is not finding them, it's avoiding or getting rid of them.
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Canada Post comment
The only way I can be sure that stamps will be cancelled at my end is to walk the envelope to our local PO and request a "hand cancel". Mailbox drops are typically not cancelled or get some kind of sprayed on monstrosity. Fortunately for me the local post office clerks are very obliging, and it's not much out of my way to go there.
However, I do not expect nice cancels on my incoming mail - and consider them a bonus. There are limits to what a seller can do if they're not close to a PO, or if they have to deal with indifferent postal clerks.
Unfortunately (for stamp collectors in Canada), it's no longer 1970...
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I have requested a hand-cancel at the local post office. But their hand stamp isn't at all like the beautiful round steel hammers of yore. The one they use here is over-inked thing, but then at least the stamps are cancelled. In most cases however, they still get the spray cancel at their main depot in Mississauga, even when a letter has a taped on notice from the local post office asking for special handling of the letter.
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Just received, a mailing from Netherlands franked with five commemoratives and four definitives. Only three of the commemoratives are cancelled, and two of the definitives are covered with transparent adhesive tape. Fortunately, I don't collect any but a very few modern stamps, usually topicals/thematics that I can use in my collections. However, one stamp is rather curious.
I removed the taped-over definitives and discovered something very curious. The tape tore the ink off one of them, but only left a very sticky residue on the face of the other. But when I removed the tape from the one that still had the adhesive on the face, the stamp fell off the envelope. It had no adhesive at all on the back, just cardboard, printed with part of the same image on the face of the stamp and perforated exactly like the stamp:
Brief googling revealed that Netherlands, like Canada, has had a big problem with forged stamps. However, I could not find any evidence that this particular stamp was forged. Any explanations?
Several years ago I took an uncancelled, high-value Canadian definitive stamp, still on paper, to a postal sub-station to get it cancelled since used-but-uncancelled stamps are useless to collectors. Well, useless to this collector! The clerk refused to cancel it, and told me that it was "illegal" to do so.
Bob
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11:06:00pm
How could it be "illegal" when it protects revenue
by cancelling something that could be soaked and reused ?.
Was that in the US or in Canada?
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@cdj1122: That was in Canada, a substation near my apartment in Vancouver. Our postal substations are operated by retail stores, especially drug stores for some reason. Employees are hired and paid by the companies. They are more retail outlets than service providers, and are often staffed by people who know nothing whatsoever about philately.
Bob
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if I recall correctly, it is illegal to reuse postage in the US, but not specifically so in Canada
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Could the Dutch stamp with the blue and green print on the back be a self-adhesive one that is still on its backing paper? Perhaps the cutting die has punched through the latter as well, and the sender thought separating the stamp from the backing too much of a hassle.
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"if I recall correctly, it is illegal to reuse postage in the US, but not specifically so in Canada"
It is also illegal to reuse postage in Canada. A few years ago Canada Post caught someone reusing uncancelled stamps.
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Argh! The world is coming apart and people are still acting up about postal franking! ????
I have noticed that the dealers I buy from on eBay make the envelope as uninteresting as possible to keep from becoming theft targets. Some use meters, some just current definitive. The return address is simply a person’s name and address.
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"I have noticed that the dealers I buy from on eBay make the envelope as uninteresting as possible to keep from becoming theft targets. Some use meters, some just current definitive."
Yup that is the normal but you get grief if you try that from certain members of Stamporama and even threats that they will never buy from you again.
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Doug, thanks for correcting the record on Canadian postal laws. it never made sense, other than as a kind of northern laissez-faire approach.
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I am not at all sure that Doug is correct. An extremely knowledgeable friend of mine, who has worked his entire life in the philatelic trade, insists that Canadian law does NOT prohibit the use of uncancelled stamps. And there is no question that Canadian dealers do a brisk trade in on-paper, uncancelled stamps. But I can't quote the letter of the law or regulation, especially if Derren is correct and there is no law or regulation!
Bob
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Here in the UK it is illegal to re-use uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system. That's why the current Security Machins have the slits and self adhesive gum that cannot be soaked off with water.
However
It is NOT illegal to sell uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system to other people.
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"I am not at all sure that Doug is correct. An extremely knowledgeable friend of mine, who has worked his entire life in the philatelic trade, insists that Canadian law does NOT prohibit the use of uncancelled stamps. "
Canada Post Regulations prohibit reusing stamps that have been previous through the mail.
The regulations do not prohibit selling these stamps.
That was the regulations when I worked for Canada Post.
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So how does a Postal authority prove that an uncancelled stamp has been through the postal system, if there is no postmark?
Is it illegal to use a previously unused stamp which has had it's gum inadvertently removed?
"It got wet from the rain, on my way home from the post office, so I glued it on to a letter". Illegal? Prove it Mr Postmaster, or get lost.
"Oh, you say it went through the mail, but the canceller missed it? Again, prove it, or design a better cancelling system."
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""It got wet from the rain, on my way home from the post office, so I glued it on to a letter". Illegal? Prove it Mr Postmaster, or get lost."
UK Security Machin stamps cannot be removed by water. Post and Go stamps cannot be removed by water and the same applies to any other self adhesive stamp issued by Royal Mail.
All letters must have the senders name and postcode on the back therefore they should be traceable. If Royal Mail suspects stamps are being re-used they can keep a record of who may be re using and the person is warned and if they continue they are prosecuted.
The same applies to forgeries. Anybody who sells forgeries to be used on the mail can be prosecuted. Stamp dealers who sell them even to collectors can be prosecuted, this happened a few years back.
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Assume I bought stamps at the post office to bring home...NOT SELF ADHESIVE....and got soaked on the way. Next time I wish to send a letter, I notice that my half-a-pane is all glued together, so I soak it and dry it, then glue the stamps as needed for my letters.
UK Machins are not available here, although the great majority of stamps sold these days seem to be self-adhesive....and I never liked self adhesives anyway.
My late mother who was never stingy, but always frugal cut out uncancelled stamps, put them in the freezer until she needed one, and glued the stamp to an envelope. Why should we (collectively) pay for the postal system's inability to cancel all stamps properly?
Find a penny, pick it up (Or should that be find a dollar, pick it up?)
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Putting stamps in a freezer is a new one to me, what's the purpose?
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Freezer: Often, the freezing temperature will cause the stamps to simply fall off the paper. Might take a week or more. It's just easier than soaking, when it works.
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01:15:18am
" .... Why should we (collectively) pay for
the postal system's inability to cancel all
stamps properly? ...."
Well, putting proper postage on a envelope
it not paying anything extra, it is paying
for the services you are using.
Then, to answer the actual question,
people do it because it is the right thing
to do. Huzzar !
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"it is paying
for the services you are using"
"because it is the right thing
to do."
Couldn't have said it better myself, Charlie.
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10:48:43am
" .... It is NOT illegal to sell uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system to other people. ...."
For specialty study of fly-spec varieties, of course.
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Regarding the cleaning and reuse of stamps these articles from the Norphil website. There is a further article relating to the prosecution of others for the forgery of a few million stamps.
https://blog.norphil.co.uk/2019/12/if-you-cant-forge-them-just-wash-them.html
https://blog.norphil.co.uk/2019/06/pair-charged-with-forging-36-million.html
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A while back I decided to soak a mess of older US commemoratives that had been recently used on packages to me by prominent dealers. I was amazed at how many of them were affixed with Elmers Glue! Ummmm! ????
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03:35:25pm
" .... I was amazed at how many of them were
affixed with Elmer's Glue! ...."
I am afraid that Elmer's or Gluestick is done
more often that one might think.
I found one last week still on trimmed paper
and held on (poorly) with a piece of Scotch tape.
And to boot, I had been billed and paid for return postage.
" .... Therefore by their deeds you will know them. ...."
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People who use Elmers glue do not have long enough fingernails........ Just my two cents.
Greg
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03:43:32am
I am becoming so weary of answering complaints about buyer's envelopes arriving without the postage being cancelled or being cancelled by pen or marker. I try to explain that our mail does not get processed' here. It is taken by truck and ship to Vancouver's postal sorting station. I have absolutely no control over what happens to my outgoing mail once it leaves my hands.
I've found for several years the normal seems to be 'no cancel or pen/marker cancel'.
At one time, when I was well enough I could go to our local post office and depending on the mood of one of the postal clerks I 'might' be able to talk them into hand cancelling the stamps for me.
The situation has drastically changed for me - I now have to depend on someone else to take my outgoing mail to a postal box and pick up my incoming mail from a corner community box.
To make matters even more challenging, our small local post office's sales counter is closed to the public. Incoming parcels are being delivered (first time in the 28 years I've lived here) and outgoing parcels are taken to one of the entrances where a postal worker takes the parcel, weighs it and applies applicable postage. I haven't personally seen how this exactly works but I do know no one except the postal workers are allowed inside the post office building.
Postage labels can be printed on-line and postage stamps (if actual stamps are wanted) can be ordered from the Philatelic Service.
Are there others besides myself that are continually receiving these type of complaints?
Maybe the answer is to put a 'cancelled' stamp inside the envelope so a buyer would be ensured they receive a 'used postage stamp' ?
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04:40:25am
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"Are there others besides myself that are continually receiving these type of complaints?"
Patches, you are not alone in this.
It all boils down to individuals' expectations of what they are paying for when they pay the seller for "shipping".
The buyer is paying for their purchase to be shipped from the seller to the buyer.
Nothing more, nothing less. No "extras".
Most sellers try and use stamps on their packages when shipping but sometimes circumstances do not allow this to happen.
Once an item enters the postal system sellers have no control over what happens to the item.
Unfortunately there are a percentage of buyers who demand and use threats because they expect far more than is possible.
Not every seller has access to a post office or are physically able to go to a post office.
The solution to this is Tolerance!
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Tolerance towards the senders of mail, of course. Tolerance towards the incompetence of service providers, no. The postal enterprises should be the recipients of any complaints about uncancelled stamps (for all the good it does, some are notoriously complaint resistant).
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
For Americans, there is always the choice of obtaining a Mailer's Postmark Permit.
The club is gone, but y'all can PM me for a copy of the instructions.
Cheers,
/s/ ikeyPikey
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10:24:35am
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
It's ludicrous for buyers to demand hand cancels or even stamps for that matter. If the seller gets the product to you he or she has fulfilled the obligation. Anything else is gravy.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
For the longest time, I liked the stamps NOT being cancelled.
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01:39:11pm
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"If the seller gets the product to you he or she has fulfilled the obligation. Anything else is gravy."
Yup!
" I received a "BAD" rating on a Circuit yesterday because the stamps weren't cancelled."
Whoever gave you that rating was obviously a real self centred, arrogant plonker!
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
05 Jun 2020
02:56:09pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Ian, you certainly have a way with words! Luv it!!!!
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03:06:06pm
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Harvey:- That was the carefully crafted polite response.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
05 Jun 2020
06:58:22pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
" .... The situation has drastically changed for me -
I now have to depend on someone else to take my outgoing
mail to a postal box and pick up my incoming mail from a
corner community box....."
Same here Liz, I put outgoing mail on the counter at the
entrance to the kitchen, usually under my son's keys or
hat and sunglasses. But he does not pass the post office
every day so the mail may get a tour of the Panhandle for
a day or two before it finds itself in the post office
mail slit.
AS to neat stamps with nice cancels; I always enjoy them,
but would never castigate the seller for the use of some
routine definitives or a massive smudged obliteration was
applied. Perhaps that poorly cancelled stamp might turn
out to be the British Guiana of this era.
Charlie
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
When I receive mail with uncanceled stamps I wish to retain, I just have one of the clerks at my post office cancel them lightly for me. They do so without complaint. I do have all my mail delivered to my post office box and they (the clerks) are just a few steps away from my box.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Folks.....
Unless the seller's terms include the promise of hand-cancelled stamps of a certain type or vintage, buyers have no reason to expect or demand a particular franking or cancellation. One of the respondents, Ian I think, correctly said buyers are paying for the delivery of the purchase. That's it.
Here's our rules on shipping:
"D2. If a lot description does not include shipping terms, the seller must abide by the default terms stated below:
Postage charged to the buyer must be the exact cost of shipping the purchase from the seller to the buyer
No other fees may be charged to the buyer"
Note: the buyer is paying for the franking cost.
Myself, I appreciate anyone who goes out of his or her way to give me the kind of cover I covet (current commemorative with contemporary seals all properly tied, just in case you were wondering), but they are not required to do so, and it is beyond the abiity of most to do it.
Others have already explained, countless times, how many countries' postal services are no longer selling stamps, or make it nearly impossible to attain them; even pre-COVID offices often made hand-cancelling impossible.
So, unless you are paying for the extra time and effort required ot attain a hand-cancel, you cannot expect it. And, it's not the sender's fault if it gets pen cancelled along the way. or scuffed. or wet.
And, finally, have mercy on those of us who are having a tough enough time just traversing a day's activities. Neither Dorian Gray nor Louis Lestat are members.
David
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09:10:51am
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"And, finally, have mercy on those of us who are having a tough enough time just traversing a day's activities."
Well said David!!
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
I have no trouble getting a letter hand canceled at my small, local post office. However, it then enters the mail stream where it invariably gets run through the automatic cancelers. Then it arrives with two cancels, and both are hard to read.
I have an envelope on my stamp desk and keep uncancelled stamps together. When I am going to the post office, I take some with me and have them nicely hand stamped. Sometimes the clerk even lets me do them myself.
It's just hard for me to imagine how anyone can complain about items that arrive uncancelled. Once you drop them in the mail box, it's totally out of your control.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
07 Jun 2020
02:45:08pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
" ... It's just hard for me to imagine how anyone can complain about items that arrive uncancelled ,,,"
It does not seem hard to me. There are some people who, were you to gift them an original inverted Jenny on cover and dated a hundred yeas ago, who would complain that the plate number is not attached.
The problem is not finding them, it's avoiding or getting rid of them.
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07:57:46am
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Canada Post comment
The only way I can be sure that stamps will be cancelled at my end is to walk the envelope to our local PO and request a "hand cancel". Mailbox drops are typically not cancelled or get some kind of sprayed on monstrosity. Fortunately for me the local post office clerks are very obliging, and it's not much out of my way to go there.
However, I do not expect nice cancels on my incoming mail - and consider them a bonus. There are limits to what a seller can do if they're not close to a PO, or if they have to deal with indifferent postal clerks.
Unfortunately (for stamp collectors in Canada), it's no longer 1970...
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
I have requested a hand-cancel at the local post office. But their hand stamp isn't at all like the beautiful round steel hammers of yore. The one they use here is over-inked thing, but then at least the stamps are cancelled. In most cases however, they still get the spray cancel at their main depot in Mississauga, even when a letter has a taped on notice from the local post office asking for special handling of the letter.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Just received, a mailing from Netherlands franked with five commemoratives and four definitives. Only three of the commemoratives are cancelled, and two of the definitives are covered with transparent adhesive tape. Fortunately, I don't collect any but a very few modern stamps, usually topicals/thematics that I can use in my collections. However, one stamp is rather curious.
I removed the taped-over definitives and discovered something very curious. The tape tore the ink off one of them, but only left a very sticky residue on the face of the other. But when I removed the tape from the one that still had the adhesive on the face, the stamp fell off the envelope. It had no adhesive at all on the back, just cardboard, printed with part of the same image on the face of the stamp and perforated exactly like the stamp:
Brief googling revealed that Netherlands, like Canada, has had a big problem with forged stamps. However, I could not find any evidence that this particular stamp was forged. Any explanations?
Several years ago I took an uncancelled, high-value Canadian definitive stamp, still on paper, to a postal sub-station to get it cancelled since used-but-uncancelled stamps are useless to collectors. Well, useless to this collector! The clerk refused to cancel it, and told me that it was "illegal" to do so.
Bob
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
09 Jun 2020
11:06:00pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
How could it be "illegal" when it protects revenue
by cancelling something that could be soaked and reused ?.
Was that in the US or in Canada?
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
@cdj1122: That was in Canada, a substation near my apartment in Vancouver. Our postal substations are operated by retail stores, especially drug stores for some reason. Employees are hired and paid by the companies. They are more retail outlets than service providers, and are often staffed by people who know nothing whatsoever about philately.
Bob
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
if I recall correctly, it is illegal to reuse postage in the US, but not specifically so in Canada
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Could the Dutch stamp with the blue and green print on the back be a self-adhesive one that is still on its backing paper? Perhaps the cutting die has punched through the latter as well, and the sender thought separating the stamp from the backing too much of a hassle.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"if I recall correctly, it is illegal to reuse postage in the US, but not specifically so in Canada"
It is also illegal to reuse postage in Canada. A few years ago Canada Post caught someone reusing uncancelled stamps.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Argh! The world is coming apart and people are still acting up about postal franking! ????
I have noticed that the dealers I buy from on eBay make the envelope as uninteresting as possible to keep from becoming theft targets. Some use meters, some just current definitive. The return address is simply a person’s name and address.
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07:42:42pm
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"I have noticed that the dealers I buy from on eBay make the envelope as uninteresting as possible to keep from becoming theft targets. Some use meters, some just current definitive."
Yup that is the normal but you get grief if you try that from certain members of Stamporama and even threats that they will never buy from you again.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Doug, thanks for correcting the record on Canadian postal laws. it never made sense, other than as a kind of northern laissez-faire approach.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
I am not at all sure that Doug is correct. An extremely knowledgeable friend of mine, who has worked his entire life in the philatelic trade, insists that Canadian law does NOT prohibit the use of uncancelled stamps. And there is no question that Canadian dealers do a brisk trade in on-paper, uncancelled stamps. But I can't quote the letter of the law or regulation, especially if Derren is correct and there is no law or regulation!
Bob
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01:57:47pm
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Here in the UK it is illegal to re-use uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system. That's why the current Security Machins have the slits and self adhesive gum that cannot be soaked off with water.
However
It is NOT illegal to sell uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system to other people.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"I am not at all sure that Doug is correct. An extremely knowledgeable friend of mine, who has worked his entire life in the philatelic trade, insists that Canadian law does NOT prohibit the use of uncancelled stamps. "
Canada Post Regulations prohibit reusing stamps that have been previous through the mail.
The regulations do not prohibit selling these stamps.
That was the regulations when I worked for Canada Post.
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04:26:48pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
So how does a Postal authority prove that an uncancelled stamp has been through the postal system, if there is no postmark?
Is it illegal to use a previously unused stamp which has had it's gum inadvertently removed?
"It got wet from the rain, on my way home from the post office, so I glued it on to a letter". Illegal? Prove it Mr Postmaster, or get lost.
"Oh, you say it went through the mail, but the canceller missed it? Again, prove it, or design a better cancelling system."
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07:17:04pm
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
""It got wet from the rain, on my way home from the post office, so I glued it on to a letter". Illegal? Prove it Mr Postmaster, or get lost."
UK Security Machin stamps cannot be removed by water. Post and Go stamps cannot be removed by water and the same applies to any other self adhesive stamp issued by Royal Mail.
All letters must have the senders name and postcode on the back therefore they should be traceable. If Royal Mail suspects stamps are being re-used they can keep a record of who may be re using and the person is warned and if they continue they are prosecuted.
The same applies to forgeries. Anybody who sells forgeries to be used on the mail can be prosecuted. Stamp dealers who sell them even to collectors can be prosecuted, this happened a few years back.
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08:11:57pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Assume I bought stamps at the post office to bring home...NOT SELF ADHESIVE....and got soaked on the way. Next time I wish to send a letter, I notice that my half-a-pane is all glued together, so I soak it and dry it, then glue the stamps as needed for my letters.
UK Machins are not available here, although the great majority of stamps sold these days seem to be self-adhesive....and I never liked self adhesives anyway.
My late mother who was never stingy, but always frugal cut out uncancelled stamps, put them in the freezer until she needed one, and glued the stamp to an envelope. Why should we (collectively) pay for the postal system's inability to cancel all stamps properly?
Find a penny, pick it up (Or should that be find a dollar, pick it up?)
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Putting stamps in a freezer is a new one to me, what's the purpose?
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07:02:37pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Freezer: Often, the freezing temperature will cause the stamps to simply fall off the paper. Might take a week or more. It's just easier than soaking, when it works.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
13 Jun 2020
01:15:18am
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
" .... Why should we (collectively) pay for
the postal system's inability to cancel all
stamps properly? ...."
Well, putting proper postage on a envelope
it not paying anything extra, it is paying
for the services you are using.
Then, to answer the actual question,
people do it because it is the right thing
to do. Huzzar !
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
"it is paying
for the services you are using"
"because it is the right thing
to do."
Couldn't have said it better myself, Charlie.
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
15 Jun 2020
10:48:43am
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
" .... It is NOT illegal to sell uncancelled stamps that have been through the postal system to other people. ...."
For specialty study of fly-spec varieties, of course.
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
Regarding the cleaning and reuse of stamps these articles from the Norphil website. There is a further article relating to the prosecution of others for the forgery of a few million stamps.
https://blog.norphil.co.uk/2019/12/if-you-cant-forge-them-just-wash-them.html
https://blog.norphil.co.uk/2019/06/pair-charged-with-forging-36-million.html
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
A while back I decided to soak a mess of older US commemoratives that had been recently used on packages to me by prominent dealers. I was amazed at how many of them were affixed with Elmers Glue! Ummmm! ????
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Silence in the face of adversity is the father of complicity and collusion, the first cousins of conspiracy..
17 Jun 2020
03:35:25pm
re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
" .... I was amazed at how many of them were
affixed with Elmer's Glue! ...."
I am afraid that Elmer's or Gluestick is done
more often that one might think.
I found one last week still on trimmed paper
and held on (poorly) with a piece of Scotch tape.
And to boot, I had been billed and paid for return postage.
" .... Therefore by their deeds you will know them. ...."
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re: So many complaints about postage stamps not being cancelled.
People who use Elmers glue do not have long enough fingernails........ Just my two cents.
Greg
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