Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
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You said you know nothing about stamps, but yet you believe you can make such a claim.
Typical. So typical to gravitate to the most expensive rather than to presume that one has the least expensive variety, and one that is damaged so severely that it is worth absolutely nothing. Extraordinary claims must have extraordinary evidence to support it. There is nothing here to support your claim.
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Have you checked the perforations? A 594 is perforated 11 x 11. Your stamp is perforated 11 x 10.5 so it is not a 594. The color is also not correct for a 594 (which is only found in a dark green), and stamps with this Franklin design that are this yellow/green are always a later (1927) printing. Your stamp is a #632.
http://www.stampsmarter.com/1847usa/1922identifier.html
Hunting for the rare stamps can be fun but we have to guard against conformation bias. It is best to always start with the assumption that you have the most common, inexpensive stamp.
Don
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With all the people who pop in here claiming that they have a #594, one would think that the #594 is more common than the #632.
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Other 594s "discovered" on Stamporama:
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=7763#55964
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=9891#68508
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=11959#102088
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I always liked the saying.
"If you hear the sound of hoof steps behind you, dont turn around expecting to see a zebra."
Dave
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One of my favorite quotes, from Bill Mauldin, the WWII cartoonist:
(Willy says to Joe, as they squat in a trench): "Why couldn't you have been born a beautiful woman?"
-Paul
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I find it amazing. All the veteran stamp collectors, who have searched for a 594 for years, even decades, and found none, but every non-collector seems to find them with no effort. They are RARE for a reason. I myself bought a hoard of about 3000 1c greens, hoping to get lucky. All I found was the Visine and Advil from the medicine cabinet.
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I participate in a half dozen other stamp forums. Threads like this are becoming commonplace lately. Someone finds an old stamp, usually a ratty one then just assumes it is the most valuable variant. In nearly all cases it is apparent the poster is not interested in becoming a collector. They just want to see if someone can confirm they have a treasure so they can make a killing on it then go on and forget about stamps.
I hope the OP doesn't feel we've been too hard on them. It's just that after awhile it gets old.
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In fairness I don't know many collectors (or dealers for that matter) who don't spend time poking through dollar boxes and old collections looking for hard to find items.
Among the "not too hard to find items" I look for at shows are grilled 3 cent banknotes on cover, Scott #25's priced as Scott #26, dpo's, manuscript cancels, and fancy cancels (and possibilities). Things I no longer look for are Scott #10's and pink Scott $65's (those yellow envelopes used to get me all the time).
You lose a lot when you quit dreaming.
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"You lose a lot when you quit dreaming."
That's true, but too many people have no knowledge of what they're doing (not just stamps), and won't take the time to learn at least the basics. They believe they're on a super interstate highway, when all they are on is a broken down dirt road.
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Over on the SCF forum we have over 70 threads started concerning finding a 594 (none were). This is one of the reasons I am often ambivalent about threads which truly describe real rare finds; they can influence opinions on the odds of actually making a rare find.
That said, I view each of these inquiry threads as an opportunity to not simply help someone but to also to occasionally turn a non-hobbyist into a hobbyist. Frankly, I dislike a strictly ‘treasure hunting’ persepctive of our hobby; this hobby has many other great attributes beyond simply ‘getting rich quick’. And while I strive to avoid making assumptions about a poster’s motives (I think that assumptions about people’s motive are a HUGE problem in our world right now) I admit I do sometimes get frustrated in other situations where a poster will argue with the good input and help they are receiving. Thankfully this poster was not pushing back in this way.
I hope this community does not jump to conclusions and gives the less experienced folks the benefit of the doubt.
Don
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Maybe it would be better to not respond to such posts until the person making such claims provides their rationale for why they think they have the "great find". Then a response can be made showing how they were right or wrong and why.
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On another forum I belong to (non-philatelic) poorly put claims about an item are simply ignored.
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i think that this is just two different angles of fool's gold: him thinking he had a rare stamp and we hoping we might have a collector. Neither is probable, although possible.
A simple "no" works; but if there's the slightest sparkle, then an enticement to learn more is always worth the gamble, IF the "come hither" is expressed correctly and warmly
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Don't you think you are being rather harsh about the OP's question? He was polite and didn't make any "claim" as implied by some of the harsher responses. Why not wait for an argument from the OP or a "claim" before going to town on him? I understand these questions are all too common.
Here's what he said. Sounds pretty tame to me:
"I know nothing of stamps..however, i may have an off-set waste rotary 954... can someone give me some idea, advice, any help at all as to what it may be? Thank you so very very kindly. (:"
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I think everyone is being a little harsh on him also. After all, no one says anything about the guy who is constantly asking for catalog information about stamps that he posts in this topic.
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Chris,
While this is indeed a new user to this forum, they used their real name for their user name and have joined using a legitimate email address (which also has their real name). A troll would never do that. I think the only ‘sin’ here is an inexperienced person asking an innocent question with the incorrect assumption that they might have a rare stamp.
Don
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I’m with Don here. Let’s be kind and give folks the benefit of the doubt. Otherwise we will scare off potential members and posters. We don’t want to get the reputation of the udder board! ????
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Exactly. . . Why not view it for what it is, amusing. Kind of sad reading posts suggesting that the person be ignored etc. No one loses anything because the gal is dreaming about having a big money stamp.
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Welcome to STAMPBOARDS.com
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""If you hear the sound of hoof steps behind you, don't turn around expecting to see a zebra.""
Mind you, if you lived in the Serengeti you may be more surprised by a horse.
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So I'm guessing that little collection of 594's I built ---- isn't?
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03:21:15pm
I was really excited for a while - I looked at my US want list and realized that 594 wasn't there. I MUST HAVE IT! Then I looked in my Liberty album where my want list originates - they don't have a place for 594 - WHAT A LET DOWN. It's really weird the way albums work. My Canadian album has a spot for #32 ( only 3 known ) but my US album is missing a stamp worth a mere $11 000 used. I must pop this stamp on my want list - I wonder what else is missing. I guess albums are not made for the Rockefeller's of the world only poor people like us. If anyone out there has a spare 594 give me a shout - MAYBE WE CAN DO A TRADE!!!
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Since this thread was started, Anglophile (Chris) was kind enough to author a great article on identifying W/F stamps of this era. It should be required reading for all US collectors.
http://stampsmarter.com/learning/ID_WF%20Rotary%20Press%20Rarities.html
Don
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03:23:09am
I know nothing of stamps..however, i may have an off-set waste rotary 954... can someone give me some idea, advice, any help at all as to what it may be? Thank you so very very kindly. (:
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03:34:45am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
You said you know nothing about stamps, but yet you believe you can make such a claim.
Typical. So typical to gravitate to the most expensive rather than to presume that one has the least expensive variety, and one that is damaged so severely that it is worth absolutely nothing. Extraordinary claims must have extraordinary evidence to support it. There is nothing here to support your claim.
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Have you checked the perforations? A 594 is perforated 11 x 11. Your stamp is perforated 11 x 10.5 so it is not a 594. The color is also not correct for a 594 (which is only found in a dark green), and stamps with this Franklin design that are this yellow/green are always a later (1927) printing. Your stamp is a #632.
http://www.stampsmarter.com/1847usa/1922identifier.html
Hunting for the rare stamps can be fun but we have to guard against conformation bias. It is best to always start with the assumption that you have the most common, inexpensive stamp.
Don
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03:42:16am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
With all the people who pop in here claiming that they have a #594, one would think that the #594 is more common than the #632.
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03:52:00am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Other 594s "discovered" on Stamporama:
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=7763#55964
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=9891#68508
https://stamporama.com/discboard/disc_main.php?action=20&id=11959#102088
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I always liked the saying.
"If you hear the sound of hoof steps behind you, dont turn around expecting to see a zebra."
Dave
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08:50:34am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
One of my favorite quotes, from Bill Mauldin, the WWII cartoonist:
(Willy says to Joe, as they squat in a trench): "Why couldn't you have been born a beautiful woman?"
-Paul
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this post
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I find it amazing. All the veteran stamp collectors, who have searched for a 594 for years, even decades, and found none, but every non-collector seems to find them with no effort. They are RARE for a reason. I myself bought a hoard of about 3000 1c greens, hoping to get lucky. All I found was the Visine and Advil from the medicine cabinet.
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I participate in a half dozen other stamp forums. Threads like this are becoming commonplace lately. Someone finds an old stamp, usually a ratty one then just assumes it is the most valuable variant. In nearly all cases it is apparent the poster is not interested in becoming a collector. They just want to see if someone can confirm they have a treasure so they can make a killing on it then go on and forget about stamps.
I hope the OP doesn't feel we've been too hard on them. It's just that after awhile it gets old.
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10:01:02am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
In fairness I don't know many collectors (or dealers for that matter) who don't spend time poking through dollar boxes and old collections looking for hard to find items.
Among the "not too hard to find items" I look for at shows are grilled 3 cent banknotes on cover, Scott #25's priced as Scott #26, dpo's, manuscript cancels, and fancy cancels (and possibilities). Things I no longer look for are Scott #10's and pink Scott $65's (those yellow envelopes used to get me all the time).
You lose a lot when you quit dreaming.
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10:25:12am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
"You lose a lot when you quit dreaming."
That's true, but too many people have no knowledge of what they're doing (not just stamps), and won't take the time to learn at least the basics. They believe they're on a super interstate highway, when all they are on is a broken down dirt road.
Login to Like
this post
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Over on the SCF forum we have over 70 threads started concerning finding a 594 (none were). This is one of the reasons I am often ambivalent about threads which truly describe real rare finds; they can influence opinions on the odds of actually making a rare find.
That said, I view each of these inquiry threads as an opportunity to not simply help someone but to also to occasionally turn a non-hobbyist into a hobbyist. Frankly, I dislike a strictly ‘treasure hunting’ persepctive of our hobby; this hobby has many other great attributes beyond simply ‘getting rich quick’. And while I strive to avoid making assumptions about a poster’s motives (I think that assumptions about people’s motive are a HUGE problem in our world right now) I admit I do sometimes get frustrated in other situations where a poster will argue with the good input and help they are receiving. Thankfully this poster was not pushing back in this way.
I hope this community does not jump to conclusions and gives the less experienced folks the benefit of the doubt.
Don
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11:52:07am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Maybe it would be better to not respond to such posts until the person making such claims provides their rationale for why they think they have the "great find". Then a response can be made showing how they were right or wrong and why.
1 Member
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
On another forum I belong to (non-philatelic) poorly put claims about an item are simply ignored.
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this post
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
i think that this is just two different angles of fool's gold: him thinking he had a rare stamp and we hoping we might have a collector. Neither is probable, although possible.
A simple "no" works; but if there's the slightest sparkle, then an enticement to learn more is always worth the gamble, IF the "come hither" is expressed correctly and warmly
Login to Like
this post
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Don't you think you are being rather harsh about the OP's question? He was polite and didn't make any "claim" as implied by some of the harsher responses. Why not wait for an argument from the OP or a "claim" before going to town on him? I understand these questions are all too common.
Here's what he said. Sounds pretty tame to me:
"I know nothing of stamps..however, i may have an off-set waste rotary 954... can someone give me some idea, advice, any help at all as to what it may be? Thank you so very very kindly. (:"
5 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I think everyone is being a little harsh on him also. After all, no one says anything about the guy who is constantly asking for catalog information about stamps that he posts in this topic.
5 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Chris,
While this is indeed a new user to this forum, they used their real name for their user name and have joined using a legitimate email address (which also has their real name). A troll would never do that. I think the only ‘sin’ here is an inexperienced person asking an innocent question with the incorrect assumption that they might have a rare stamp.
Don
3 Members
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I’m with Don here. Let’s be kind and give folks the benefit of the doubt. Otherwise we will scare off potential members and posters. We don’t want to get the reputation of the udder board! ????
4 Members
like this post.
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09:20:19am
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Exactly. . . Why not view it for what it is, amusing. Kind of sad reading posts suggesting that the person be ignored etc. No one loses anything because the gal is dreaming about having a big money stamp.
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Welcome to STAMPBOARDS.com
5 Members
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
""If you hear the sound of hoof steps behind you, don't turn around expecting to see a zebra.""
Mind you, if you lived in the Serengeti you may be more surprised by a horse.
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re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
So I'm guessing that little collection of 594's I built ---- isn't?
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This is my diabetic cat OBI! I think, therefore I am - I think! Descartes, sort of!
27 Apr 2019
03:21:15pm
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
I was really excited for a while - I looked at my US want list and realized that 594 wasn't there. I MUST HAVE IT! Then I looked in my Liberty album where my want list originates - they don't have a place for 594 - WHAT A LET DOWN. It's really weird the way albums work. My Canadian album has a spot for #32 ( only 3 known ) but my US album is missing a stamp worth a mere $11 000 used. I must pop this stamp on my want list - I wonder what else is missing. I guess albums are not made for the Rockefeller's of the world only poor people like us. If anyone out there has a spare 594 give me a shout - MAYBE WE CAN DO A TRADE!!!
Login to Like
this post
re: Possible Ben Franklin 594? Please help.
Since this thread was started, Anglophile (Chris) was kind enough to author a great article on identifying W/F stamps of this era. It should be required reading for all US collectors.
http://stampsmarter.com/learning/ID_WF%20Rotary%20Press%20Rarities.html
Don
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