What we collect!

 

Stamporama Discussion Board Logo
For People Who Love To Talk About Stamps
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Stamporama Discussion Board Logo
For People Who Love To Talk About Stamps
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Stamporama Discussion Board Logo
For People Who Love To Talk About Stamps



What we collect!
What we collect!


United States/Stamps : 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

 

Author
Postings
oldtriguy1960
Members Picture


30 Aug 2018
09:39:15pm
Basically - Are there?

Was just sorting some 2017 Flag stamps and then got out the UV light.
I saw a difference in the 3 AP (Scott # 5159) coils (die cut 9 1/2). 2 of the 3 looked like solid tagging, but 1 looked like overall tagging with a checkerboard pattern to the tagging (when looked at under magnification).

Are there known varieties to the tagging on these stamps?

I can make and post pics if needed.

Thanks,

Dave N.


Like
Login to Like
this post
51Studebaker
Members Picture


Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't

31 Aug 2018
03:52:20am
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Hi Dave,
We are in-process with implementing a new US tagging community database project on Stamp Smarter. The database has over 8000 tagged stamps identified including #5159 but we do not have any varieties for this coil.

Although it is not yet released, Stamporama folks can get a 'sneak peek' at the database here http://www.stampsmarter.com/features/Tagging_Home.html
The database is fully implemented but we are still adding UV images for the stamps.

If you can add some images we would love to better understand your stamp for possible inclusion in the database.
Thanks
Don

Like 
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
angore
Members Picture


Al
Collector, Moderator

31 Aug 2018
12:51:48pm
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Don,

I too would consult Mark's spreadsheet. I did not see anything noted.

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Stamp Collecting is a many splendored thing"
oldtriguy1960
Members Picture


31 Aug 2018
02:28:05pm
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Hi All,

I had 3 more of these 5195 stamps for a total of 6. Of the 6, 3 were what I'll call overall tagged with a checkerboard/grid pattern to the tagging, and 3 were what I'll call solid tagged. So it was an even distribution. The 6 were easily divided into the two groups - there didnt seem to be a gradual difference between the tagging.

Here's a pic of the two types side by side.
Granted this is a very small sampling (6 total). Does anyone else have a group of these they'd care to check and report back their findings?

Maybe I'm just seeing a case where the tagging is very light on some stampps so the grid pattern doesnt show up. Or maybe worn tagging mats so the grid pattern doesnt show up.

Image Not Found

Like
Login to Like
this post
51Studebaker
Members Picture


Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't

01 Sep 2018
06:43:17am
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Dave,
I asked Mark and this was his reply...

"I will check what I have to see if any varieties. Don’t have many to check though. Looking at the pictures neither appears solid but I will have to confirm. They look overall. I have seen similar examples of the grid pattern on one stamp and more of a smooth texture on another"




Don

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
StampWrangler
Members Picture


01 Sep 2018
10:35:56pm
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Just had a sneak peak at the tagging database - wow - this is awesome! Thank you for you work on this!

Like
Login to Like
this post
malcolm197

21 Sep 2018
06:46:58pm
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

I wonder if this is due to the density of the tagging "ink". I assume that the active phosphor is suspended in solution prior to application, and is applied in the same way as printing ink?

Perhaps the taggant is applied in the chequerboard pattern, but if the solution in which the active ingredient is suspended is thinner this "bleeds" across the whole area, or maybe temperature or drying rate or pressure could be a factor.

I wouldn't have thought that the process of applying the taggant varies during application,but some other factor causes a change during or after the process.

I know that on some GB Machin stamps, the physical appearance of the phosphor bands is not consistant, whereas the technical characteristics are,

Malcolm

Like
Login to Like
this post
51Studebaker
Members Picture


Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't

22 Sep 2018
01:06:51am
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Further input from Mark

"I am no printing expert but I found a great pdf on Flexography and Rotogravure (Gravure) printing. Below are slides that show how the ink is picked up in the two processes. I don’t know which specific process was used for these stamps, but you can see with either approach can have a diamond shaped pattern. I would guess that the process used to apply the tagging was flexography as suggested in the stamp forum post below. The reason being an Anilox roll could be purchased with the diamond pattern over the entire surface. The reason for the two variations could then be attributed to wear. Since the tagging material is abrasive the right most image could be due to wear, over inking or varying consistency of the taggant.
Stamp community forum where a similar discussion took place only with block tagging. "


https://www.stampcommunity.org/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=56496

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

Work on the tagging database is moving forward; 1500 images and more being added daily. We are tackling the major catalog numbers first, and then will be adding the tagging varieties
http://stampsmarter.com/features/TaggingView.html
Don

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
malcolm197

24 Sep 2018
05:44:33am
re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

I get that.

… but it could also mean that if a large quantity of stamps were required at the same ( like at the start of a rate change ), more than one press might be used, with different process of tagging used ( how many spare phosphor cylinders are there ?).

Bearing in mind that the tagging is used for operational purposes only, there may not be the same necessity for uniform application, as with ink shades etc. There is I guess no difference to the naked eye, but the operational process is identical.


Malcolm

Like
Login to Like
this post
        

 

Author/Postings
Members Picture
oldtriguy1960

30 Aug 2018
09:39:15pm

Basically - Are there?

Was just sorting some 2017 Flag stamps and then got out the UV light.
I saw a difference in the 3 AP (Scott # 5159) coils (die cut 9 1/2). 2 of the 3 looked like solid tagging, but 1 looked like overall tagging with a checkerboard pattern to the tagging (when looked at under magnification).

Are there known varieties to the tagging on these stamps?

I can make and post pics if needed.

Thanks,

Dave N.


Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
51Studebaker

Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't
31 Aug 2018
03:52:20am

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Hi Dave,
We are in-process with implementing a new US tagging community database project on Stamp Smarter. The database has over 8000 tagged stamps identified including #5159 but we do not have any varieties for this coil.

Although it is not yet released, Stamporama folks can get a 'sneak peek' at the database here http://www.stampsmarter.com/features/Tagging_Home.html
The database is fully implemented but we are still adding UV images for the stamps.

If you can add some images we would love to better understand your stamp for possible inclusion in the database.
Thanks
Don

Like 
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
Members Picture
angore

Al
Collector, Moderator
31 Aug 2018
12:51:48pm

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Don,

I too would consult Mark's spreadsheet. I did not see anything noted.

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Stamp Collecting is a many splendored thing"
Members Picture
oldtriguy1960

31 Aug 2018
02:28:05pm

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Hi All,

I had 3 more of these 5195 stamps for a total of 6. Of the 6, 3 were what I'll call overall tagged with a checkerboard/grid pattern to the tagging, and 3 were what I'll call solid tagged. So it was an even distribution. The 6 were easily divided into the two groups - there didnt seem to be a gradual difference between the tagging.

Here's a pic of the two types side by side.
Granted this is a very small sampling (6 total). Does anyone else have a group of these they'd care to check and report back their findings?

Maybe I'm just seeing a case where the tagging is very light on some stampps so the grid pattern doesnt show up. Or maybe worn tagging mats so the grid pattern doesnt show up.

Image Not Found

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
51Studebaker

Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't
01 Sep 2018
06:43:17am

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Dave,
I asked Mark and this was his reply...

"I will check what I have to see if any varieties. Don’t have many to check though. Looking at the pictures neither appears solid but I will have to confirm. They look overall. I have seen similar examples of the grid pattern on one stamp and more of a smooth texture on another"




Don

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
Members Picture
StampWrangler

01 Sep 2018
10:35:56pm

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Just had a sneak peak at the tagging database - wow - this is awesome! Thank you for you work on this!

Like
Login to Like
this post
malcolm197

21 Sep 2018
06:46:58pm

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

I wonder if this is due to the density of the tagging "ink". I assume that the active phosphor is suspended in solution prior to application, and is applied in the same way as printing ink?

Perhaps the taggant is applied in the chequerboard pattern, but if the solution in which the active ingredient is suspended is thinner this "bleeds" across the whole area, or maybe temperature or drying rate or pressure could be a factor.

I wouldn't have thought that the process of applying the taggant varies during application,but some other factor causes a change during or after the process.

I know that on some GB Machin stamps, the physical appearance of the phosphor bands is not consistant, whereas the technical characteristics are,

Malcolm

Like
Login to Like
this post
Members Picture
51Studebaker

Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't
22 Sep 2018
01:06:51am

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

Further input from Mark

"I am no printing expert but I found a great pdf on Flexography and Rotogravure (Gravure) printing. Below are slides that show how the ink is picked up in the two processes. I don’t know which specific process was used for these stamps, but you can see with either approach can have a diamond shaped pattern. I would guess that the process used to apply the tagging was flexography as suggested in the stamp forum post below. The reason being an Anilox roll could be purchased with the diamond pattern over the entire surface. The reason for the two variations could then be attributed to wear. Since the tagging material is abrasive the right most image could be due to wear, over inking or varying consistency of the taggant.
Stamp community forum where a similar discussion took place only with block tagging. "


https://www.stampcommunity.org/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=56496

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

Image Not Found

Work on the tagging database is moving forward; 1500 images and more being added daily. We are tackling the major catalog numbers first, and then will be adding the tagging varieties
http://stampsmarter.com/features/TaggingView.html
Don

Like
Login to Like
this post

"Current Score... Don 1 - Cancer 0"

stampsmarter.org
malcolm197

24 Sep 2018
05:44:33am

re: 2017 Ashton Potter flag coil 5159 tagging varieties

I get that.

… but it could also mean that if a large quantity of stamps were required at the same ( like at the start of a rate change ), more than one press might be used, with different process of tagging used ( how many spare phosphor cylinders are there ?).

Bearing in mind that the tagging is used for operational purposes only, there may not be the same necessity for uniform application, as with ink shades etc. There is I guess no difference to the naked eye, but the operational process is identical.


Malcolm

Like
Login to Like
this post
        

Contact Webmaster | Visitors Online | Unsubscribe Emails | Facebook


User Agreement

Copyright © 2024 Stamporama.com