Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Avión escuela translates literally (according to Google Translate) as "airplane school" but I assume that, non-literally, it means trainer, because that's what the plane is. Or, it could refer to a school or schools that use the Beech T-34 trainer. In a Google search, I found that the names "villanueva" and "romo" are linked to Mexican aviation schools, but I came up empty with "vergara". And what's with the dates "2009" and "2010) and the Cross of Lorraine?
I think that the item in question must be a charity label, but otherwise I'm at a loss. I'd like to find out. I am aware of only one stamp, issued by the Dominican Republic that features the T-34, so I may already a "complete" collection. My interest is simple: in 1962, I survived a crash in a T-34 in the Black Range mountains of Southwestern New Mexico. That was exciting!
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
02:46:31pm
Did a Google image search and came up with this from an APS affiliate site:
https://www.seal-society.org/news?page=5
New Catalog/ Handbook of Mexican TB Seals
Memoria De Las Estampillas De Lucha Contra La Tuberculosis, 70 Anos 1940-2010, by Alejandro Grossmann Epper, 79 numbered pages with 36 posters illustrated on 4 unnumbered pages in the front and back of the book. 8 ½ x 11” full color, soft cover, illustrating full sheets, used seals, tied ons, and some related TB material such as an early tb bond and tb lottery tickets, loads of information, written in Spanish.
This handbook, as Grossmann calls it, is a must have for any serious collector of Mexican TB seals. It has the look and feel of a high priced auction catalog. The color printing is outstanding; so much so, if you were not a collector it would negate the need to collect the seals. Every page is professionally laid out; the work of a graphic artist. The official Christmas Seal website of Mexico is located at, http://www.tbsealsmexico.org/english.htm and may be adding this book in the near future. In the meantime, the book is available from the author, Alejandro Grossmann Epper, for 20 dollars + 4.95 by Priority Mail, pay by Pay Pal to alejandro_grossmann@yahoo.com
Roy
P.S. I'd bet a LOT that the pair, far right in the fourth row will be in your want list as soon as you see it !!!!!
4 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
Thank you, Roy! Obviously, I didn't google the right keywords. You're right, that Connie pair would be a nice addition to my collection. And the DC-3 in the row above, too. Let the search begin!
Bob
Login to Like
this post
And I just found the sheet of TB seals on eBay and bought it! There are several seals that I can use in my web pages.
Bob
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
"..Obviously, I didn't google the right keywords..."
Roy did a Google 'image search'. Every stamp collector should learn how to do this, it is a very valuable tool for identifying stamps. A image search (sometimes called a reverse image search) allows you to upload any image and the search engine then tries to find any images online that are the same. Here are instructions
http://stampsmarter.com/learning/HowToImageSearch.html
Don
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
I think that the technology needs a bit of refinement. I tried a search using this image:
These are the top hits that Google offered:
It looks like the stamp's perforations were the number one attribute involved in the search. Its is interesting that 16 of the first 24 images picture "flying things" but only two show aircraft in similar views.
Login to Like
this post
the Cross of Lorraine will generally be a good clue it belongs to some TB issue, most of which are Cinderellas.
Login to Like
this post
"I think that the technology needs a bit of refinement..."
The technology is truly extraordinary, there are billions of images indexed and searched. Using your example, it immediately found an exact match (your website) as shown here (bottom of image).
But it is true that the algorithm only knows enough to 'pattern match' the image. To further refine the search, users have to understand the technology and be willing to help a bit by inputting a bit more info. For example, note the image search understood it to a 'postage stamp' but is you add 'airplane postage stamp' it will further refine the image displayed images with nothing but similar looking airplane stamps as shown here
Clicking on the 'Visually Similar Images' link will offer you many pages of search results to browse through.
Don
4 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
Yep, its a trainer. In the AF all planes that start with T-xx is a trainer designation. I'm not a pilot but did get to fly a trainer for a bit once.
Login to Like
this post
That DC-10 halfway down the L side catches my eye.
UPS is still flying these regularly. I saw 3 or 4 in Ontario, California in July, flying every day.
First flight of the DC-10 was December something, 1971. I rode one to Honolulu in 1982, on my pre-honeymoon...
Nice to see an old clunker still shouldering a burden...
-Paul
Login to Like
this post
@Pigdoc,
I knew that the plane shown on the TB label was a trainer, a Beech T-34B Mentor to be precise, but I didn't know that the TB label was a TB label. Here's a photograph of another T-34B, in somewhat poorer condition:
I collect aircraft on stamps, particularly aircraft that I have had personal experience with. They include the T-34B, and that Dominican Republic stamp, so far as I know, is the only postage stamp ever issued to feature the T-34. That's why I was pleased to find the Mexico TB label. My interest in the T-34 is perhaps obsessive, but understandable, I think: In 1962, when I was 19, I was a passenger in the T-34B shown in the crash picture — and survived! I was knocked unconscious during the crash; when I awoke, I was in the seat shown in the yellow circle, with my face a few inches from the dirt, blood dripping from a laceration on the back of my head. I tell the story of that crash in a web page titled "Surviving a plane crash in the Black Range".
If you'd like a scanned image of the DC-10 labels, let me know. Same goes for anyone who's interested any of the labels. A number of them piqued my interest — the Comet, DC-2 and DC-3, Spirit of St. Louis, and, in the fourth row at the far right, the Lockheed Constellation or "Connie". When Roy alerted me to the existence of the sheet of TB labels, he said he knew I'd be interested in the Connie labels, which I was! In 1963, I flew in a Military Air Transport Service Connie from Travis Air Force Base near San Francisco to Tachikawa AFB outside Tokyo — 26 hours in the air, with stops for fuel and food at Hickam AFB in Hawaii and at Wake Island. I got to ride in the co-pilot's seat for the better part of an hour. I tell that story at "Low & Slow in a Connie — Flying to Japan in 1963". Here's a photograph that I took of the plane at Wake Island:
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
The DC-10 still is in lots of service, in addition to UPS, FedEx uses them, and they are used to drop retardant on the fires in California!
Geoff
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Thanks for that posting, Bob!
Ever been to Pima, in Tuscon? You gotta go... Heck, just the Google Satellite view will light you up...
And, I think Dayton has Ike's Air Force One - a Connie...you can walk through it!
I was thinking about WHY the DC-10 soldiers on in the express business. Then, I thought about revenues per pound of payload. I used to routinely send 3-lb boxes via Overnight Express halfway across the continent. Runs $75-$80 a box. You do the math!
I presume that fuel costs killed them as passenger carriers...
And, now, back to your regularly scheduled programming...
-Paul
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
The courier and air cargo companies like the big aircraft with quieter turbofan engines like the DC-10 as it allows them to use some of the cheaper night-time airport slots where there are noise restrictions. The DC-8 Super 70 series converted to turbofans found an extended life with the courier companies long after stopped being in regular passenger service. The DC-8 may never have been as popular as the Boeing 707, but it probably outlasted them in commercial service.
Login to Like
this post
OK, to bring this topic back to stamps/postal history, I want to highlight the pair on the left, second row from bottom of the sheet.
Alberto Braniff was the first to fly an airplane in Latin America, in Mexico, January 10, 1910.
As is apparent from the stamp design, he was on a Farman type - distinguished by the prominent vertical 'curtains' between the planes.
A little background. In 1910, if you wanted an airplane, you had only 4 or 5 choices...in the world:
- Bleriot monoplane, by far the most popular.
- Antoinette monoplane.
- Voisin/Farman biplane, also popular.
- Wright biplane.
- Curtiss biplane.
There were many, many personalized variations of these designs, although the Curtiss was not experimented with widely. First three are French, latter two are American, of course.
Here is a postcard showing the Farman No. I, a design that Henry Farman developed in partnership with the Voisin brothers, and then took with him when the partnership dissolved.
It's postmarked November 30, 1908, one of the earliest from my collection. At this point in history, Farman and Wilbur Wright were locked in battle to win the 50,000 franc Michelin Prize, for the flight of the longest duration in 1908. Wright won it, on December 31.
Enjoy!
-Paul
PS, any help on the cancellation? Pretty sure it's "GARE" (Station) something.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
The sheet of Mexico TB labels that Roy posted to this thread, and which sent to eBay to purchase, includes a pair of labels picturing Alberto Braniff and his airplane. I was aware of Braniff Airlines, but I knew nothing of its history. Now I know a little more! Here are those labels, graphically cropped from the sheet and big enough to see!
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
Thanks for that close-up, Bob! The image of the aircraft looks like an actual photograph, not a drawing.
Incidentally, I would love to see some of these postcard images printed from original negatives. I can only imagine the detail that would pop out.
-Paul
PS, I should have added in my original posting that the Wright flyer was being built under license by several individuals/firms in France in 1909-1910...
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
Clearly this is not a postage stamp, but what is it? A Red Cross charity label?
Avión escuela translates literally (according to Google Translate) as "airplane school" but I assume that, non-literally, it means trainer, because that's what the plane is. Or, it could refer to a school or schools that use the Beech T-34 trainer. In a Google search, I found that the names "villanueva" and "romo" are linked to Mexican aviation schools, but I came up empty with "vergara". And what's with the dates "2009" and "2010) and the Cross of Lorraine?
I think that the item in question must be a charity label, but otherwise I'm at a loss. I'd like to find out. I am aware of only one stamp, issued by the Dominican Republic that features the T-34, so I may already a "complete" collection. My interest is simple: in 1962, I survived a crash in a T-34 in the Black Range mountains of Southwestern New Mexico. That was exciting!
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
BuckaCover.com - 80,000 covers priced 60c to $1.50 - Easy browsing 500 categories
11 Jul 2018
02:46:31pm
re: Just what is this?
Did a Google image search and came up with this from an APS affiliate site:
https://www.seal-society.org/news?page=5
New Catalog/ Handbook of Mexican TB Seals
Memoria De Las Estampillas De Lucha Contra La Tuberculosis, 70 Anos 1940-2010, by Alejandro Grossmann Epper, 79 numbered pages with 36 posters illustrated on 4 unnumbered pages in the front and back of the book. 8 ½ x 11” full color, soft cover, illustrating full sheets, used seals, tied ons, and some related TB material such as an early tb bond and tb lottery tickets, loads of information, written in Spanish.
This handbook, as Grossmann calls it, is a must have for any serious collector of Mexican TB seals. It has the look and feel of a high priced auction catalog. The color printing is outstanding; so much so, if you were not a collector it would negate the need to collect the seals. Every page is professionally laid out; the work of a graphic artist. The official Christmas Seal website of Mexico is located at, http://www.tbsealsmexico.org/english.htm and may be adding this book in the near future. In the meantime, the book is available from the author, Alejandro Grossmann Epper, for 20 dollars + 4.95 by Priority Mail, pay by Pay Pal to alejandro_grossmann@yahoo.com
Roy
P.S. I'd bet a LOT that the pair, far right in the fourth row will be in your want list as soon as you see it !!!!!
4 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
Thank you, Roy! Obviously, I didn't google the right keywords. You're right, that Connie pair would be a nice addition to my collection. And the DC-3 in the row above, too. Let the search begin!
Bob
Login to Like
this post
re: Just what is this?
And I just found the sheet of TB seals on eBay and bought it! There are several seals that I can use in my web pages.
Bob
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
"..Obviously, I didn't google the right keywords..."
Roy did a Google 'image search'. Every stamp collector should learn how to do this, it is a very valuable tool for identifying stamps. A image search (sometimes called a reverse image search) allows you to upload any image and the search engine then tries to find any images online that are the same. Here are instructions
http://stampsmarter.com/learning/HowToImageSearch.html
Don
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
I think that the technology needs a bit of refinement. I tried a search using this image:
These are the top hits that Google offered:
It looks like the stamp's perforations were the number one attribute involved in the search. Its is interesting that 16 of the first 24 images picture "flying things" but only two show aircraft in similar views.
Login to Like
this post
re: Just what is this?
the Cross of Lorraine will generally be a good clue it belongs to some TB issue, most of which are Cinderellas.
Login to Like
this post
re: Just what is this?
"I think that the technology needs a bit of refinement..."
The technology is truly extraordinary, there are billions of images indexed and searched. Using your example, it immediately found an exact match (your website) as shown here (bottom of image).
But it is true that the algorithm only knows enough to 'pattern match' the image. To further refine the search, users have to understand the technology and be willing to help a bit by inputting a bit more info. For example, note the image search understood it to a 'postage stamp' but is you add 'airplane postage stamp' it will further refine the image displayed images with nothing but similar looking airplane stamps as shown here
Clicking on the 'Visually Similar Images' link will offer you many pages of search results to browse through.
Don
4 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
Yep, its a trainer. In the AF all planes that start with T-xx is a trainer designation. I'm not a pilot but did get to fly a trainer for a bit once.
Login to Like
this post
07:27:51pm
re: Just what is this?
That DC-10 halfway down the L side catches my eye.
UPS is still flying these regularly. I saw 3 or 4 in Ontario, California in July, flying every day.
First flight of the DC-10 was December something, 1971. I rode one to Honolulu in 1982, on my pre-honeymoon...
Nice to see an old clunker still shouldering a burden...
-Paul
Login to Like
this post
re: Just what is this?
@Pigdoc,
I knew that the plane shown on the TB label was a trainer, a Beech T-34B Mentor to be precise, but I didn't know that the TB label was a TB label. Here's a photograph of another T-34B, in somewhat poorer condition:
I collect aircraft on stamps, particularly aircraft that I have had personal experience with. They include the T-34B, and that Dominican Republic stamp, so far as I know, is the only postage stamp ever issued to feature the T-34. That's why I was pleased to find the Mexico TB label. My interest in the T-34 is perhaps obsessive, but understandable, I think: In 1962, when I was 19, I was a passenger in the T-34B shown in the crash picture — and survived! I was knocked unconscious during the crash; when I awoke, I was in the seat shown in the yellow circle, with my face a few inches from the dirt, blood dripping from a laceration on the back of my head. I tell the story of that crash in a web page titled "Surviving a plane crash in the Black Range".
If you'd like a scanned image of the DC-10 labels, let me know. Same goes for anyone who's interested any of the labels. A number of them piqued my interest — the Comet, DC-2 and DC-3, Spirit of St. Louis, and, in the fourth row at the far right, the Lockheed Constellation or "Connie". When Roy alerted me to the existence of the sheet of TB labels, he said he knew I'd be interested in the Connie labels, which I was! In 1963, I flew in a Military Air Transport Service Connie from Travis Air Force Base near San Francisco to Tachikawa AFB outside Tokyo — 26 hours in the air, with stops for fuel and food at Hickam AFB in Hawaii and at Wake Island. I got to ride in the co-pilot's seat for the better part of an hour. I tell that story at "Low & Slow in a Connie — Flying to Japan in 1963". Here's a photograph that I took of the plane at Wake Island:
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
11:20:05pm
re: Just what is this?
The DC-10 still is in lots of service, in addition to UPS, FedEx uses them, and they are used to drop retardant on the fires in California!
Geoff
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
06:20:41am
re: Just what is this?
Thanks for that posting, Bob!
Ever been to Pima, in Tuscon? You gotta go... Heck, just the Google Satellite view will light you up...
And, I think Dayton has Ike's Air Force One - a Connie...you can walk through it!
I was thinking about WHY the DC-10 soldiers on in the express business. Then, I thought about revenues per pound of payload. I used to routinely send 3-lb boxes via Overnight Express halfway across the continent. Runs $75-$80 a box. You do the math!
I presume that fuel costs killed them as passenger carriers...
And, now, back to your regularly scheduled programming...
-Paul
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
The courier and air cargo companies like the big aircraft with quieter turbofan engines like the DC-10 as it allows them to use some of the cheaper night-time airport slots where there are noise restrictions. The DC-8 Super 70 series converted to turbofans found an extended life with the courier companies long after stopped being in regular passenger service. The DC-8 may never have been as popular as the Boeing 707, but it probably outlasted them in commercial service.
Login to Like
this post
12:32:42pm
re: Just what is this?
OK, to bring this topic back to stamps/postal history, I want to highlight the pair on the left, second row from bottom of the sheet.
Alberto Braniff was the first to fly an airplane in Latin America, in Mexico, January 10, 1910.
As is apparent from the stamp design, he was on a Farman type - distinguished by the prominent vertical 'curtains' between the planes.
A little background. In 1910, if you wanted an airplane, you had only 4 or 5 choices...in the world:
- Bleriot monoplane, by far the most popular.
- Antoinette monoplane.
- Voisin/Farman biplane, also popular.
- Wright biplane.
- Curtiss biplane.
There were many, many personalized variations of these designs, although the Curtiss was not experimented with widely. First three are French, latter two are American, of course.
Here is a postcard showing the Farman No. I, a design that Henry Farman developed in partnership with the Voisin brothers, and then took with him when the partnership dissolved.
It's postmarked November 30, 1908, one of the earliest from my collection. At this point in history, Farman and Wilbur Wright were locked in battle to win the 50,000 franc Michelin Prize, for the flight of the longest duration in 1908. Wright won it, on December 31.
Enjoy!
-Paul
PS, any help on the cancellation? Pretty sure it's "GARE" (Station) something.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
re: Just what is this?
The sheet of Mexico TB labels that Roy posted to this thread, and which sent to eBay to purchase, includes a pair of labels picturing Alberto Braniff and his airplane. I was aware of Braniff Airlines, but I knew nothing of its history. Now I know a little more! Here are those labels, graphically cropped from the sheet and big enough to see!
Bob
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
04:04:01pm
re: Just what is this?
Thanks for that close-up, Bob! The image of the aircraft looks like an actual photograph, not a drawing.
Incidentally, I would love to see some of these postcard images printed from original negatives. I can only imagine the detail that would pop out.
-Paul
PS, I should have added in my original posting that the Wright flyer was being built under license by several individuals/firms in France in 1909-1910...
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.