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Sales, Swaps, Auction & Approvals/Auction Disc. : Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

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d1stamper
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19 Jun 2018
07:23:15pm
I have gotten to the point that I am really reluctant to buy from auctions. I have started asking if there are any extra charges not showing in the listing.

Why show a potential buyer have to ask if there are hidden charges?

Just today I asked one person listing in auctions "Do you charge anything extra than the postage if using Paypal?". I receive this answer "If only a small purchase I ask for a small-$.30 charge to help with Paypal fees.It is not mandatory".

Now I have to ask what is a small purchase.

Why are sellers not revealing the cost?

Doug
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smauggie
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19 Jun 2018
08:58:38pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

If sellers tack on postage and fees not disclosed in their terms and conditions you do not have to pay those tacked-on amounts.

Selling Rules:

D. Shipping Terms:

D1. Sellers must create their payment and shipping terms. Unless listed as optional, the terms must include, at a minimum, the following information:

Payment methods accepted or excluded
Shipping methods (optional)
Shipping costs, including any ancillary shipping services offered
Countries/areas excluded from sales (optional)
Refund policy (optional)
Any terms and conditions of sale that are different from those in the rules and procedures

D2. If a lot description does not include shipping terms, the seller must abide by the default terms stated below:

Postage charged to the buyer must be the exact cost of shipping the purchase from the seller to the buyer
No other fees may be charged to the buyer

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d1stamper
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19 Jun 2018
09:28:21pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

smauggie

I agree and know that you do not have to pay the extra, but why go through the hassle.



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smauggie
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19 Jun 2018
09:33:18pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

I agree it is a bother. Do you have a solution in mind?

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Soundcrest
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20 Jun 2018
06:16:06am

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

This is an interesting topic and one I should steer clear of but.... The solution (which creates a problem) is to up the postage costs and give a discount for using a check. Plain and simple. The problem comes into play when you have uninvoiced items and you change your terms. When you try to created an invoice, it does not give you every lot, at least that was my experience when I first joined and created a paypal account specific to this site. When I changed the address in my terms I ran into problems. The other problem is that I surely do not want to increase the postage on everyone, just those that elect to use PAYPAL when the paypal option does NOT appear on their invoice - for good reason. The only solution is to create all outstanding invoices, read the emails asking to combine the items, and then dealing with it, along with subtracting from the postage costs when the buyer has spent a certain amount. I believe I will clear up all my outstanding invoices before doing my afternoon auctions

Yes I know those who reside outside the US have no choice but to use PAYPAL

Greg

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hfbaker
20 Jun 2018
03:15:30pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

PayPal policy states: "4.6 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions". n.b., ... not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal.

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Anglophile
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RPSL, APS, EPA; US, GB, Ireland, British Europe, Italy, Mauritius Classics
20 Jun 2018
07:53:58pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

The answer to the original question is laziness. You have to write and post your special terms and some won't take the time to do it. Greg's proposal is against the rules, but another substantive solution is simple: write terms of sale that provide for a handling fee for all orders less than a specified amount, such as $1 on all invoice totals that are less than $5. If it's phrased as a handling fee for small orders, it doesn't violate PayPal's terms because it's not tied to the use of PayPal, yet it increases the seller's margin enough to cover PayPal's fee.

The numbers above are hypothetical and each seller would have to determine what is best for them and their costs.

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d1stamper
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20 Jun 2018
08:30:59pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

It may be laziness, but I think it is away to deceive. You may fool me once but not again.

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amsd
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Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
21 Jun 2018
08:01:00am
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

a reminder from one of the guys who wrote the auction rules

if it's not stated in your terms, you can't charge it. if nothing is stated in your terms, you may charge exact postage and no more.

don't know how to be any clearer


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snowy12
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21 Jun 2018
08:46:00am

Auctions
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

I don't think any sellers I have dealt with on SOR do this,but you find a lot of sellers especially on eBay and some other auction sites add extra charges if more than one item is purchased.

I try and avoid these sellers ,I don't mind paying extra if I go over weight as that is a genuine cost ,but charging more for buying more than one item is a ripoff.
If I want to purchase more than one item and I can't see any reference to combined postage I will email the seller and ask.
Brian

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Soundcrest
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21 Jun 2018
09:06:55am

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

Interesting that sellers charge per item shipping wise on ebay as ebay for a number of years has taken part of the shipping costs and assumed it to be profit. It isn't if you are charging real shipping costs, but there were a lot of people back in the day selling items for a dollar and charging $100 shipping. You can charge a handling fee which I do for overseas orders that are books, Lp's etc mainly to discourage their purchase.
I do charge a per item amount on Hipstamp auctions as like here, many sell for only a penny and thats fine. Hip though charges 3 cents to list an auction item, so a penny sale is a 2 cent loss. I rarely charge for the extra oz here unless it is overseas, and I also don't charge extra when I mail a large order with tracking. I figure if you are going to spend at least $50 with me, I can eat the postage costs. I charge less for postage here than on any other site.

Greg

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Brechinite
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Neddie Seagoon from The Telegoons
21 Jun 2018
11:16:48am

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

One of the problems for sellers here is that you do not know what a buyer is going to buy. Is it:-

1 stamp,
10 stamps,
100 stamps,
1 stamp and one minisheet (what size is the minisheet? bigger minisheet means larger packaging therefore extra weight therefore extra cost)
10 stamps and 10 minisheets,
1 stamp and 2 First Day covers(what size/weight are the Covers)

This all determines what size, weight, or type of packaging is used by the seller and thus determines the packaging costs (small envelope or bubble lined envelope etc) postage costs, the amount paypal takes, and in my case what paypal charges for the conversion of dollars to pounds.

Life would be simple if Royal Mail had one price for shipping but the cornucopia of rules about size, weight etc make it near impossible to give prices that would satisfy ALL sellers and buyers.

As a seller the only clear and precise postage cost is up to 20 grammes is $2.63, after that it all depends on size weight etc etc etc.

One other problem sellers have in determining shipping costs is that a buyer may buy some items, the seller sends the invoice stating the shipping costs, the buyer then buys another item say a minisheet, the seller sends the invoice with increased shipping cost as the minisheet requires larger envelope therefore heavier. Buyer not happy because the shipping has increased.

Now I hope you are crying into your handkerchief because us poor sellers have just a hard a time of it as buyers do!!!....Rolling On The Floor LaughingRolling On The Floor LaughingRolling On The Floor Laughing

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Brechinite
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Neddie Seagoon from The Telegoons
21 Jun 2018
02:16:25pm

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

I can understand why some sellers on ebay charge extra for additional items.
Lets take an example:-
I sell an item for £1.00 and charge £1.00 for Shipping, Total Cost to buyer = £2.00

Total cost to seller is:-
Listing Fee.......£0.35
Final Value Fee...£0.20
Paypal Fee........£0.25 (Why Because they charge a Minimum)
Postage...........£0.67 (UK First Class Post)
Packing Materials.£0.07

TOTAL COST TO SELLER ........£1.54 Profit?....£0.46

HOLD ON What about the cost of the item? EXACTLY!!!!

NOW What happens if I sell more items to the same buyer at the same time?

2 items at £ 1.00 plus £1.00 Shipping..........Buyer Pays ....£3.00

Seller Costs are:-

Listing Fees.........£0.70
Final Value Fees.....£0.30
Paypal Fees..........£0.15
Postage..............£1.01 (The second item was a Cover)
Packing Materials....£0.35 (Bubble envelope required)

Total Cost To Seller.......£2.50............Profit.....£0.50

HOLD ON What about the cost of the items? EXACTLY!!!!

Would you begrudge the seller an extra 20-25 cents for each additional item??

If you do then they didn't need Bill Murray to play Scrooge.....................

It Should have been......YOU!!!!!!!!!




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smauggie
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21 Jun 2018
03:57:26pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

It is entirely reasonable to quote a basic first class rate for a normal envelope with 50-100 stamps, and that state that if a purchases involve a heavier weight or a larger envelope, then they would be charged the actual cost of postage.

In fact, one seller (me) has exactly that:

Quote:

"$1.00 First Class Postage in the USA for a 1-oz letter.
$2.00 First Class Postage to Canada, Australia, Europe, British Commonwealth for a one-ounce letter.
Actual cost postage to anywhere else.
Actual cost postage for larger/heavier shipments. "




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d1stamper
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21 Jun 2018
06:59:42pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

When I started this I was only talking about SOR. Ebay I do not buy from anymore, because the rip off the seller which is passed on to the buyer. So forget about ebay in this discussion.

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Brechinite
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Neddie Seagoon from The Telegoons
21 Jun 2018
07:17:52pm

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

Unfortunately ebay does have a bearing on this discussion as it appears that some of the misdeeds that have happened to individuals on ebay in the past have affected their perceptions and they think that all sellers are out to rip off buyers.

Yes you may come across the odd rip off merchant but that is the way of the internet because it involves the full range of humanity, from good to bad.

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smauggie
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21 Jun 2018
11:10:02pm
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

At least here the bad get weeded out.

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Brechinite
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Neddie Seagoon from The Telegoons
22 Jun 2018
04:56:46am

Auctions - Approvals
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

AH! But do they?

Do the ones with "hidden" charges get reported to the Auctioneer?

or Is it just left to the "market".


All hail to the market!!




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smauggie
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22 Jun 2018
05:58:19am
re: Auctions listed not showing all the cost to the buyer

Quote:

"Do the ones with "hidden" charges get reported to the Auctioneer?"



I am not the auctioneer, so I don't know, but I would encourage anyone to do so.
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