Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Please help me ID this revenue stamp. Any ideal would be very appreciated. Peter
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United States revenue Scott #R185.
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I have never seen the cutout of E & M pasted on the front of the stamp. Maybe a "reverse perfin"?
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...interesting...
...the E&M Sean pointed out.
Also, an interesting cancel;
Francis Eames was a broker at the New York Stock Exchange.
He formed the brokerage firm of Eames & Moore in 1869.
He retired in 1903.
Interesting stamp!
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Removed by OP as I believe my comment was in error.
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That cancel sure looks like it is printed on a raised area. My eyes must be going.
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Question: The denomination and surcharge of my stamp are different to Scott Cat R185. How to
understand they are same?
Peter
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The surcharge is a number "2" on a $2.00 stamp just like it is supposed to be as stated in Scott.
Sean, you just may be right. If so, someone took big trouble to do that.
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Peter,
The "E & M" on your stamp. Is it cut out of the stamp, or glued to the face of the stamp?
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I believe the E&M is punched out of the stamp, not glued on. That's probably a trick of the light. Otherwise, the cancel would look stronger there.
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Punch cancels are relatively common for this series, bearing the firms name or initials. What puzzles me is the hand stamp cancel appearing to be continuous for the top of E & M
but not showing on the lower half of the E & M. It's as if there is a backing on the stamps gum side on the top half taking the cancel through the punched out area there.
Dan C.
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Punch cancels were often applied shortly after the time of purchase but before being applied to the document, this prevented theft.
Don
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The E & M was punched out then the stamp was applied to a document then cancelled. It appears that the picture of this stamp shows it still attached to the document it was cancelled on.
Vince
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Thank you Don & Vince-that makes sense.
Dan C.
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Dan,
Yes, as mentioned -
the "2" overprint was in place BEFORE the "E&M" was punched out.
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Hi everyone,
Thanks a lot for your comments.I have checked it carefully. I am sure that E&M was punch out of the stamp. I am not convinced that stamp is Scott Cat R185. Please somebody could guide me more sources to dig up the history and events during the period of Scott Cat R184 to R194? I have a bunch of similar revenue stamps with same denomination and surcharge but different cancellations.This is only first one of them. Please let me know if anybody have or see the identical denomination and surcharge on this kind of US Revenue Stamps?
Peter
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Could anyone please show me an image that has surcharge "2" on a $2.00 revenue stamp with
allegorical figure of commerce?
Another question: Why the stamp need double cancels one cut cancel, punch of E&M, and hand
stamp cancel?
Thanks,
Peter
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Peter,
I believe that part of your second question was already answered by Don & Vince above.
Best,
Dan
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Dan,
You are right, the comments of Don & Vince support the stamp is double cancelled. I am
wondering why? As I know majority postage stamps only cancel once. Please correct me if I am
wrong.
Thanks,
Peter
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Agreed, but again I think that Don's response answers the question, no?
Dan C.
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In 1901 $2 is equivalent to $58.49 in today's money, a significant amount of value.
So when company first received these valuable stamps, they immediately punched them to prevent theft. These unused punched stamps would then sit stored in the drawer or cabinet. When a document was recorded and a stamp needed, a pre-punched stamp was taken out, applied to document, and then the stamp and document would be cancelled together.
In 1892 Francis Eames (owner of the company) developed a new system for the NYSE which modernized the way they dealt with larger volumes of stock trades. This advancement catapulted him to President of the NYSE in 1894. He remained President of NYSE until 1898. He was a part of the Eames and Moore firm from 1869 through 1902. On Jan 1, 1903, the company announced its dissolution (see clipping from New York Tribune).
Don
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Thank you all for helping me to ID my revenue stamp. It is time to remove "not in Scott Cat"
from the discussion subject. I'll upload more similar US revenue stamps with different
cancels latter on.
Best,
Peter
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Are there triple cancels on this revenue stamp?
Best
Peter
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There are two cancels on that stamp. The "H&B New York with date" and the the three horizontal slits. The Large numeral "2" is not a cancel.
Vince
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Thank you Vince. I'll upload more revenue stamps with fancy cancels. Would you please
indicate more details about them? Peter
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Thank you Vince. I upload more revenue stamps with fancy cancels. Would you please
indicate more details about them? Peter
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These aren't considered 'fancy cancels', but rather - companies that used these revenues for their businesses and thus cancelled them with a cancelling device made with their business name.
Interesting cancels though and very collectible!
You should research each one's business name for further info.
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Uploaded please find more interesting cancels on US revenue stamps! I was shocked to see
so many different cancels just for New York area in 1901. Those interesting cancels plied
multiple roles, prevent theft, distinguishing companies, no more re-use, and some kind of
art. They are small but real records of history. 
The last but not least, two stamps with up side down each other of "2" (18574) may be a
pair! I am wondering how come it happens like that if my observation are truly.
Your comments would be greatly appreciated.
Best
Peter
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The 3 cuts are IAW Treasury Dept. 1 Dec 1899 decision.
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09:41:22pm
Please help me ID this revenue stamp. Any ideal would be very appreciated. Peter
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10:06:55pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
United States revenue Scott #R185.
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
I have never seen the cutout of E & M pasted on the front of the stamp. Maybe a "reverse perfin"?
2 Members
like this post.
Login to Like.
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
...interesting...
...the E&M Sean pointed out.
Also, an interesting cancel;
Francis Eames was a broker at the New York Stock Exchange.
He formed the brokerage firm of Eames & Moore in 1869.
He retired in 1903.
Interesting stamp!
1 Member
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01:13:24am
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Removed by OP as I believe my comment was in error.
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
That cancel sure looks like it is printed on a raised area. My eyes must be going.
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10:06:21pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Question: The denomination and surcharge of my stamp are different to Scott Cat R185. How to
understand they are same?
Peter
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this post
10:26:33pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
The surcharge is a number "2" on a $2.00 stamp just like it is supposed to be as stated in Scott.
Sean, you just may be right. If so, someone took big trouble to do that.
Login to Like
this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Peter,
The "E & M" on your stamp. Is it cut out of the stamp, or glued to the face of the stamp?
Login to Like
this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
I believe the E&M is punched out of the stamp, not glued on. That's probably a trick of the light. Otherwise, the cancel would look stronger there.
Login to Like
this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Punch cancels are relatively common for this series, bearing the firms name or initials. What puzzles me is the hand stamp cancel appearing to be continuous for the top of E & M
but not showing on the lower half of the E & M. It's as if there is a backing on the stamps gum side on the top half taking the cancel through the punched out area there.
Dan C.
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this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Punch cancels were often applied shortly after the time of purchase but before being applied to the document, this prevented theft.
Don
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
The E & M was punched out then the stamp was applied to a document then cancelled. It appears that the picture of this stamp shows it still attached to the document it was cancelled on.
Vince
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Thank you Don & Vince-that makes sense.
Dan C.
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Dan,
Yes, as mentioned -
the "2" overprint was in place BEFORE the "E&M" was punched out.
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08:05:46pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Hi everyone,
Thanks a lot for your comments.I have checked it carefully. I am sure that E&M was punch out of the stamp. I am not convinced that stamp is Scott Cat R185. Please somebody could guide me more sources to dig up the history and events during the period of Scott Cat R184 to R194? I have a bunch of similar revenue stamps with same denomination and surcharge but different cancellations.This is only first one of them. Please let me know if anybody have or see the identical denomination and surcharge on this kind of US Revenue Stamps?
Peter
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10:29:47pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Could anyone please show me an image that has surcharge "2" on a $2.00 revenue stamp with
allegorical figure of commerce?
Another question: Why the stamp need double cancels one cut cancel, punch of E&M, and hand
stamp cancel?
Thanks,
Peter
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this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Peter,
I believe that part of your second question was already answered by Don & Vince above.
Best,
Dan
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10:22:49pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Dan,
You are right, the comments of Don & Vince support the stamp is double cancelled. I am
wondering why? As I know majority postage stamps only cancel once. Please correct me if I am
wrong.
Thanks,
Peter
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this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Agreed, but again I think that Don's response answers the question, no?
Dan C.
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this post
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
In 1901 $2 is equivalent to $58.49 in today's money, a significant amount of value.
So when company first received these valuable stamps, they immediately punched them to prevent theft. These unused punched stamps would then sit stored in the drawer or cabinet. When a document was recorded and a stamp needed, a pre-punched stamp was taken out, applied to document, and then the stamp and document would be cancelled together.
In 1892 Francis Eames (owner of the company) developed a new system for the NYSE which modernized the way they dealt with larger volumes of stock trades. This advancement catapulted him to President of the NYSE in 1894. He remained President of NYSE until 1898. He was a part of the Eames and Moore firm from 1869 through 1902. On Jan 1, 1903, the company announced its dissolution (see clipping from New York Tribune).
Don
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
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10:45:55pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Thank you all for helping me to ID my revenue stamp. It is time to remove "not in Scott Cat"
from the discussion subject. I'll upload more similar US revenue stamps with different
cancels latter on.
Best,
Peter
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09:44:36pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Are there triple cancels on this revenue stamp?
Best
Peter
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
There are two cancels on that stamp. The "H&B New York with date" and the the three horizontal slits. The Large numeral "2" is not a cancel.
Vince
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05:35:51pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Thank you Vince. I'll upload more revenue stamps with fancy cancels. Would you please
indicate more details about them? Peter
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05:43:43pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Thank you Vince. I upload more revenue stamps with fancy cancels. Would you please
indicate more details about them? Peter
1 Member
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re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
These aren't considered 'fancy cancels', but rather - companies that used these revenues for their businesses and thus cancelled them with a cancelling device made with their business name.
Interesting cancels though and very collectible!
You should research each one's business name for further info.
1 Member
likes this post.
Login to Like.
09:50:15pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
Uploaded please find more interesting cancels on US revenue stamps! I was shocked to see
so many different cancels just for New York area in 1901. Those interesting cancels plied
multiple roles, prevent theft, distinguishing companies, no more re-use, and some kind of
art. They are small but real records of history.
The last but not least, two stamps with up side down each other of "2" (18574) may be a
pair! I am wondering how come it happens like that if my observation are truly.
Your comments would be greatly appreciated.
Best
Peter
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this post
11:23:27pm
re: ID Help for US Revenue stamps with interesting cancels
The 3 cuts are IAW Treasury Dept. 1 Dec 1899 decision.
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