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United States/Stamps : C13-C15 Zeppelins

 

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DavidG
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APS member since 2004

29 May 2017
08:04:18am
I am looking for the Scott Values of these stamps, mint and used, from 1972 to the present. Does anyone know where I could find such information?

David in Ottawa, Canada
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pedroguy
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29 May 2017
08:30:49am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

2017 Scott Catalog values as follows

C13........Mint $190.00 Hinged $275.00 NH... USED $165.00

C14........Mint $375.00 Hinged $400.00 NH... USED $375.00

C15........Mint $575.00 Hinged $975.00 NH... USED $600.00


Hope this helps......Bill

I do have a 1974 Scott Specialized Catalog. Let me know if you want values for that year

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dani20
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29 May 2017
09:01:02am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Pedroguy, are the posted values in the right category?
C15........Mint $575.00 Hinged $975.00 NH... USED $600.00

Used is worth more than mint hinged?

Dan C.

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pedroguy
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29 May 2017
09:23:35am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes Dan the C15 is $600.00 Used $575.00 Mint Hinged and $975.00 Mint Never Hinged

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dollhaus

29 May 2017
12:27:11pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Members might have enough old catalogs around to give you enough data points.

Here's a set - Scott 1977:

C13 - $225/125 M/U
C14 - $425/200 M/U
C15 - $650/325 M/U

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larsdog
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APS #220693 ATA#57179

29 May 2017
01:04:16pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1972 Scott Specialized (MNH not listed in this catalog):
C13 $125.00 mint / $87.50 used
C14 $200.00 mint / $125.00 used
C15 $325.00 mint / $220.00 used

1990 Scott Specialized (MNH not listed in this catalog):
C13 $250.00 mint / $200.00 used
C14 $700.00 mint / $450.00 used
C15 $1050.00 mint / $600.00 used

2008 Scott Specialized
C13 $250.00 mint / $160.00 used ... MNH $425
C14 $525.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $900
C15 $750.00 mint / $575.00 used ... MNH $1275

2011 Scott Specialized
C13 $210.00 mint / $165.00 used ... MNH $375
C14 $460.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $800
C15 $600.00 mint / $600.00 used ... MNH $1150

2016 Scott Specialized
C13 $180.00 mint / $165.00 used ... MNH $275
C14 $400.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $650
C15 $575.00 mint / $600.00 used ... MNH $975

Lars


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Bailey

29 May 2017
01:40:56pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here is info from Scott,s 2004;
C13-$240 mint $160 used
C14--$450 Mint $375 used
C15--$700 mint $575 used
Harold

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cathotel

29 May 2017
01:52:35pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

2002 Scott valuations:

C13 $360/250 MNH/MH, $160 used
C14 $725/500 MNH/MH, $375 used
C15 $1,150/800 MNH/MH, $575 used

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keesindy
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29 May 2017
04:38:47pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1991 Scott Volume 1 valuations

C13 $250 mint / $200 used
C14 $700 mint / $450 used
C15 1050 mint / $600 used

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

29 May 2017
04:46:29pm

Approvals
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here are the valuations from the 2009 edition:

C13: mint 250.00 / used 160.00 / MNH 425.00
C14: mint 525.00 / used 375.00 / MNH 900.00
C15: mint 750.00 / used 575.00 / MNH 1,275.00

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larsdog
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APS #220693 ATA#57179

29 May 2017
05:33:12pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

In case you are curious:

1945 Specialized:
C13 $12.50 mint / $10.00 used
C14 $27.50 mint / $22.50 used
C15 $35.00 mint / $32.50 used

1959 Specialized:
C13 $37.50 mint / $25.00 used
C14 $62.50 mint / $40.00 used
C15 $90.00 mint / $75.00 used

Lars

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dollhaus

29 May 2017
05:36:17pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here's a table of the data so far. Allowing for the value of the dollar, looks like anyone who picked up the set in the mid-1970s or later has had zero or negative appreciation. MNH C15 might be a little bit ahead.



C13 M C13 U C13 MNH C14 M C14 U C14 MNH C15 M C15 U C15 MNH
1972 125 87.5 200 125 325 220
1977 225 175 425 200 650 325
1990 250 200 700 450 1050 600
1991 250 200 700 450 1050 600
2002 250 160 500 375 800 575
2004 240 160 450 375 700 575
2008 250 160 425 525 375 900 750 575 1275
2009 250 160 425 525 375 900 750 575 1275
2011 210 165 375 460 375 800 600 600 1150
2016 180 165 275 400 375 650 575 600 975
2017 190 165 275 375 400 400 575 600 975

Rats! Messed up the formatting.

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larsdog
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APS #220693 ATA#57179

29 May 2017
05:56:38pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Interestingly, from 2008 to 2017, a used set has gone UP in price by $30 (a 2.7% increase), while MH has gone DOWN $385 (a 25% decrease) and MNH has dropped $950 (a whopping 37% decrease)!

By contrast C3 from 2008 to 2016 has held steady at $70 MH and $35 used, although MNH has dropped from $150 to $140.

Lars

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Webpaper

In loving memory of Carol, my wife for 52 years.

29 May 2017
06:16:35pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

If memory serves 1988 would be the peak year for these, as well as most stamps. We used the 1988 catalog for quite some time because of what we thought were drastic reductions in the catalog value being out of touch with reality (wishful thinking).

Perhaps someone else can verify that during that brief time period in the mid 80's VFNH Zepps fetched in the $8000 to $10000 range. Didn't last long and quick turnaround was the key to making money on both the up and down sides of that lofty figure.

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angore
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Collector, Moderator

29 May 2017
08:16:31pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I find that some stamps (like C13-C15, 630 is similar) that seem to be very prevalent (available from many sellers) but command a premium. You cannot easily find some more less expensive stamps.

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AntoniusRa
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The truth is within and only you can reveal it

29 May 2017
08:33:15pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Webpaper, Right you are. It would be nice to see the values from a 1987 or 1988 catalog as those should show the highest relevant values. Hopefully someone has one of those cats and will share those values with us.

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DavidG
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APS member since 2004

29 May 2017
09:50:18pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Thank-you, all for such wonderful information.

The value of being a member of SOR.

David in Ottawa, Canada

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copy55555
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29 May 2017
10:55:48pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I thought I'd throw my two cents worth in. Looking at values in older Scotts require that the inflation factor be considered. I used the inflation calculator to adjust all of the values that were mentioned so far and I think that this may bring everything into perspective. Values from the 80's may really be shocking, By the way, C3 did decrease in value as did any stamps that showed steady prices over the years. Values are in 2017 US dollars.


YEAR C13M C13U 14M C14U C15M C15U

1945 $169.71 $135.85 $373.58 $305.66 $475.46 $441.50
1959 $315.11 $210.07 $525.18 $336.12 $756.26 $630.22
1972 $731.23 $511.86 $1,169.97 $731.23 $1,901.20 $1,286.97
1977 $907.89 $504.38 $1,714.90 $807.01 $2,622.78 $1,311.39
1990 $467.72 $374.18 $1,309.62 $841.90 $1,964.42 $1,122.53
1991 $448.83 $359.07 $1,256.73 $807.90 $1,885.10 $1,077.20
2002 $339.81 $217.48 $679.61 $509.71 $1,087.38 $781.55
2004 $310.67 $207.11 $582.51 $485.42 $906.12 $744.32
2008 $283.93 $181.72 $596.25 $425.90 $851.79 $653.04
2009 $284.94 $182.36 $598.38 $427.42 $854.83 $655.37
2011 $228.28 $179.37 $500.05 $407.65 $652.24 $652.24
2016 $183.39 $168.11 $407.53 $382.06 $611.29 $611.29
2017 $190.00 $165.00 $375.00 $375.00 $575.00 $600.00



C13MNH C14MNH C15MNH

2002 $489.32 $985.44 $1,563.11
2008 $482.68 $1,022.15 $1,448.04
2009 $484.40 $1,025.80 $1,453.21
2011 $407.65 $869.65 $1,250.13
2017 $275.00 $400.00 $975.00


That was fun,

Tad

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angore
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Collector, Moderator

30 May 2017
07:31:52am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I am sure the C13-C15 was a speculator buy meaning it was bought by non-collectors and now the market is correcting itself for this.

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51Studebaker
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30 May 2017
08:59:21am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I was surprised with the relative lack of movement for the ‘internet years’. Most collectibles saw significant value movement when the internet allowed collectors to easily connect with each other; I would have expected a large drop in catalog values for the period of 2000 to present.
Don

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(based upon copy5555 inflation adjusted values)


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In loving memory of Carol, my wife for 52 years.

30 May 2017
09:58:32am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

"I am sure the C13-C15 was a speculator buy meaning it was bought by non-collectors and now the market is correcting itself for this."

During that brief period when Zepps were in the $8-10K range for the most part the only people buying them were the speculators. They wandered from one table to the next asking only if you had a set of Zeppelins .... the regular customers for the most part stayed the course purchasing material that was familiar to them. A lot of new collectors entered the hobby during the mid 80's and floor traffic was always brisk...

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

30 May 2017
10:34:34am

Approvals
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

One additional Scott valuation:

Scott Specialized 2005
(MH / U / MNH)
C13: 240 / 160 / 350
C14: 450 / 375 / 700
C15: 700 / 575 / 1050

Also Yvert & Tellier 2005:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
13: 300 / 300
14: 750 / 500
15: 1000 / 900

and Michel 2007:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
(C13): 250 / 180
(C14): 500 / 380
(C15): 850 / 650

and Michel 2015:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
(C13): 300 / 200
(C14): 550 / 400
(C15): 950 / 700

Surprising conclusion: contrary to what is usually thought, the valuation in the "domestic" specialized catalogue is lower than in foreign ones. Most of the time this is the other way around because of the higher demand.
A possible explanation is that a. Zeppelin stamps are popular worldwide and b. the USA Zeppelin stamps are especially iconic and a "must have" for every serious collector, just like for instance the Penny Black.

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51Studebaker
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30 May 2017
12:14:06pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Updated with additional years, all values adjusted for inflation to 2016 dollars. The 1979 values are spiking due to inflation, would love to see some 1980s catalog values if anyone has them.
Don

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michael78651
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Moderator, MT Member

30 May 2017
12:58:22pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

All in all this shows that these stamps are not a good investment. Might as well use them for postage. Surprise

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roy
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30 May 2017
06:30:33pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I can add 1967 Scott values

C13 110.00 75.00
C14 180.00 110.00
C15 285.00 185.00

Roy

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51Studebaker
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30 May 2017
06:48:26pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Thanks Roy. Here is updated data now including chart with catalog values not adjusted for inflation for same time period
Don

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jthurd
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30 May 2017
11:15:26pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Scott 1985 Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $450. Used $350.
C14 Mint $1,000. Used $650.
C15 Mint $1,650. Used 1,000.

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jthurd
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30 May 2017
11:19:56pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1955 Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
C13 Mint $23.50 Used $20.
C14 Mint $45. Used $35.
C15 Mint $70. Used $60.

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jthurd
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30 May 2017
11:21:51pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1966 Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $90. Used $60.
C14 Mint $150. Used $90.
C15 Mint $235. Used $150.

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jthurd
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30 May 2017
11:27:45pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Correction perhaps needed for 1987 in values in graph above:
1987
Scott Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $350. Used $250. -- which are different from values in table above
C14 Mint $800. Used $550.
C15 Mint $1,300. Used $800.

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jthurd
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30 May 2017
11:32:47pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1948
Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $18.50 Used $16.
C14 Mint $47.50 Used $35.
C15 Mint $70. Used $55.

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angore
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Collector, Moderator

31 May 2017
07:54:52am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I can see the infomercial now....Zepplins are at record lows! It is time to acquire these before the price goes up!

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amsd
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31 May 2017
08:12:01am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

".Zepplins are at record lows! It is time to acquire these before the price goes up!"



lighter than air dropping like Led
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Tom in Exton, PA

31 May 2017
09:42:38am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

"Might as well use them for postage. Surprise "



With the used values, it makes me wonder who actually did soak those off covers. I've seen ones for sale with corners of the stamped cachets on them. Can you imagine the person who ripped up flown covers... I don't collect covers but I need used ones to fill the spots in my album...

I bought mine on flown cover. Cheaper than mint and much more historic and interesting!

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31 May 2017
05:23:35pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

They may be at record lows, however accounting for the 50% haircut that Scott catalog values took in the 80's to adjust to actual retail values rather than the fantasy values they had before, that may not be the real record. Note, some catalogs still carry that 100% markup - Michel for example. Thankfully Scott cut it despite complaints from the dealers.

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Jansimon
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collector, seller, MT member

01 Jun 2017
08:32:04am

Approvals
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes, but you should note that Michel catalogue prices are not the same as actual selling prices. Most dealers who use Michel sell at a discount of 50% or more. Perhaps not that often for this type of stamps, but nevertheless.

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HungaryForStamps
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01 Jun 2017
12:30:30pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

That is exactly my point. Scott at some point had the same methodology, not using selling prices. At some point, the CVs were revised to reflect actual retail value, so the 50% calculation was not required.

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philb
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01 Jun 2017
05:18:30pm

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re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

And yet some were paying in the $8 thousand range in the 80's..i hope they could afford it !David i have prices for chuck steak and gasoline from 1972 when my kids were small !

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amsd
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02 Jun 2017
08:39:48am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Phil, even carefully refrigerated, your 1972 chuck steak is not likely to be edible, much less appetizing, no matter the price. I'll pass.

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51Studebaker
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02 Jun 2017
09:09:25am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here is the 'set' trends
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I put all the info in a webpage here
http://www.stampsmarter.com/Learning/ZeppelinsCatalogTrends.html

Don

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philb
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02 Jun 2017
02:45:30pm

Auctions
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Amsd i did not say i liked it..chuck steak was affordable...we were not up to London Broil yet !

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tooler
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03 Mar 2018
06:15:15pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

No one has put a photo of these stamps we are talking about. These are mine.

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dani20
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03 Mar 2018
07:12:26pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

If anyone has a set or singles available for trade (cat.val. for cat.val.) give me a shout. My area is generally the U.S.Classics period, but I would be interested in adding the Zeps if available.
Dan C.

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BenFranklin1902
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Tom in Exton, PA

04 Mar 2018
12:19:27am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

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Since we're doing show and tell...
Here's mine! I said earlier in the thread that actual flown covers were cheaper than mint stamps and much more interesting. So these covers represent the series in my collection. I bought each of them separate, and waited until the right cover came along at the right price. There were many I lost to higher bidders too!



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dani20
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04 Mar 2018
08:45:51am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Beautiful BenFranklin!
Dan C.

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pigdoc

04 Mar 2018
10:27:49am
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes, Tom, very nice!

I also have a zepp cover collection that fills a 1-inch 3-ring binder, but none franked with C13-C15. I do have C13 and C14 on piece, however.

I'm curious about the postal history of your 3 covers.

From Wikipedia:
"The 1930 Pan-American Flight...originated in Friedrichshafen on 18 May and stopped first in Seville before leaving Europe. The Graf Zeppelin arrived in Brazil first at Recife (Pernambuco) docking at Campo do Jiquiá on 22 May where it was greeted by a crowd of more than 15,000 before preceding on to Rio de Janeiro. The airship then flew back north to Lakehurst, NJ, before heading east over the Atlantic on 2 June to return to Germany with another stop in Seville."

Your 65c cover shows a Freidrichshafen receiver cancel of June 6, seeming to document a transit time in the range of 4 days, including the stop in Seville. Can you make out the date of the Brooklyn cancellation?

Your $1.30 cover is cancelled at Varick Station on the date of departure, June 2 (12 noon?) Cool!

However, your $2.60 cover is cancelled way back in April, suggesting that the sender was anticipating the flight, perhaps based on some announcement of the planning for it.

By the way, there is a marvelous video on YouTube documenting this (or a similar flight) of the Graf Zeppelin to South America. It's called "Flying Down to Rio" (1932) by Pathe News. It's a little hokey for its newsreel genre, but consists of remarkable, clear footage, nonetheless...

-Paul

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sleepy

04 Mar 2018
02:28:37pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I just checked EBay for them. Fantastic variation in price....some very cheap and others over-priced.Applause

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uboatnut

07 Apr 2018
09:48:41pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here are the values (Scott default is for VF 80) from the 2014 and 2018 Scott US Specialized catalogues. Note how the GRADING changes the catalogue values (only 2014 included)Thinking.

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phos45
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09 Apr 2018
09:02:00pm
re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

the zeppelin bladder was made from 10000 cow intestines

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DavidG

APS member since 2004
29 May 2017
08:04:18am

I am looking for the Scott Values of these stamps, mint and used, from 1972 to the present. Does anyone know where I could find such information?

David in Ottawa, Canada

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pedroguy

29 May 2017
08:30:49am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

2017 Scott Catalog values as follows

C13........Mint $190.00 Hinged $275.00 NH... USED $165.00

C14........Mint $375.00 Hinged $400.00 NH... USED $375.00

C15........Mint $575.00 Hinged $975.00 NH... USED $600.00


Hope this helps......Bill

I do have a 1974 Scott Specialized Catalog. Let me know if you want values for that year

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dani20

29 May 2017
09:01:02am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Pedroguy, are the posted values in the right category?
C15........Mint $575.00 Hinged $975.00 NH... USED $600.00

Used is worth more than mint hinged?

Dan C.

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pedroguy

29 May 2017
09:23:35am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes Dan the C15 is $600.00 Used $575.00 Mint Hinged and $975.00 Mint Never Hinged

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dollhaus

29 May 2017
12:27:11pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Members might have enough old catalogs around to give you enough data points.

Here's a set - Scott 1977:

C13 - $225/125 M/U
C14 - $425/200 M/U
C15 - $650/325 M/U

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larsdog

APS #220693 ATA#57179
29 May 2017
01:04:16pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1972 Scott Specialized (MNH not listed in this catalog):
C13 $125.00 mint / $87.50 used
C14 $200.00 mint / $125.00 used
C15 $325.00 mint / $220.00 used

1990 Scott Specialized (MNH not listed in this catalog):
C13 $250.00 mint / $200.00 used
C14 $700.00 mint / $450.00 used
C15 $1050.00 mint / $600.00 used

2008 Scott Specialized
C13 $250.00 mint / $160.00 used ... MNH $425
C14 $525.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $900
C15 $750.00 mint / $575.00 used ... MNH $1275

2011 Scott Specialized
C13 $210.00 mint / $165.00 used ... MNH $375
C14 $460.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $800
C15 $600.00 mint / $600.00 used ... MNH $1150

2016 Scott Specialized
C13 $180.00 mint / $165.00 used ... MNH $275
C14 $400.00 mint / $375.00 used ... MNH $650
C15 $575.00 mint / $600.00 used ... MNH $975

Lars


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Bailey

29 May 2017
01:40:56pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here is info from Scott,s 2004;
C13-$240 mint $160 used
C14--$450 Mint $375 used
C15--$700 mint $575 used
Harold

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cathotel

29 May 2017
01:52:35pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

2002 Scott valuations:

C13 $360/250 MNH/MH, $160 used
C14 $725/500 MNH/MH, $375 used
C15 $1,150/800 MNH/MH, $575 used

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keesindy

29 May 2017
04:38:47pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1991 Scott Volume 1 valuations

C13 $250 mint / $200 used
C14 $700 mint / $450 used
C15 1050 mint / $600 used

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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
29 May 2017
04:46:29pm

Approvals

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here are the valuations from the 2009 edition:

C13: mint 250.00 / used 160.00 / MNH 425.00
C14: mint 525.00 / used 375.00 / MNH 900.00
C15: mint 750.00 / used 575.00 / MNH 1,275.00

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larsdog

APS #220693 ATA#57179
29 May 2017
05:33:12pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

In case you are curious:

1945 Specialized:
C13 $12.50 mint / $10.00 used
C14 $27.50 mint / $22.50 used
C15 $35.00 mint / $32.50 used

1959 Specialized:
C13 $37.50 mint / $25.00 used
C14 $62.50 mint / $40.00 used
C15 $90.00 mint / $75.00 used

Lars

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dollhaus

29 May 2017
05:36:17pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here's a table of the data so far. Allowing for the value of the dollar, looks like anyone who picked up the set in the mid-1970s or later has had zero or negative appreciation. MNH C15 might be a little bit ahead.



C13 M C13 U C13 MNH C14 M C14 U C14 MNH C15 M C15 U C15 MNH
1972 125 87.5 200 125 325 220
1977 225 175 425 200 650 325
1990 250 200 700 450 1050 600
1991 250 200 700 450 1050 600
2002 250 160 500 375 800 575
2004 240 160 450 375 700 575
2008 250 160 425 525 375 900 750 575 1275
2009 250 160 425 525 375 900 750 575 1275
2011 210 165 375 460 375 800 600 600 1150
2016 180 165 275 400 375 650 575 600 975
2017 190 165 275 375 400 400 575 600 975

Rats! Messed up the formatting.

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larsdog

APS #220693 ATA#57179
29 May 2017
05:56:38pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Interestingly, from 2008 to 2017, a used set has gone UP in price by $30 (a 2.7% increase), while MH has gone DOWN $385 (a 25% decrease) and MNH has dropped $950 (a whopping 37% decrease)!

By contrast C3 from 2008 to 2016 has held steady at $70 MH and $35 used, although MNH has dropped from $150 to $140.

Lars

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In loving memory of Carol, my wife for 52 years.

29 May 2017
06:16:35pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

If memory serves 1988 would be the peak year for these, as well as most stamps. We used the 1988 catalog for quite some time because of what we thought were drastic reductions in the catalog value being out of touch with reality (wishful thinking).

Perhaps someone else can verify that during that brief time period in the mid 80's VFNH Zepps fetched in the $8000 to $10000 range. Didn't last long and quick turnaround was the key to making money on both the up and down sides of that lofty figure.

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angore

Collector, Moderator
29 May 2017
08:16:31pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I find that some stamps (like C13-C15, 630 is similar) that seem to be very prevalent (available from many sellers) but command a premium. You cannot easily find some more less expensive stamps.

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AntoniusRa

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29 May 2017
08:33:15pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Webpaper, Right you are. It would be nice to see the values from a 1987 or 1988 catalog as those should show the highest relevant values. Hopefully someone has one of those cats and will share those values with us.

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DavidG

APS member since 2004
29 May 2017
09:50:18pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Thank-you, all for such wonderful information.

The value of being a member of SOR.

David in Ottawa, Canada

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copy55555

29 May 2017
10:55:48pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I thought I'd throw my two cents worth in. Looking at values in older Scotts require that the inflation factor be considered. I used the inflation calculator to adjust all of the values that were mentioned so far and I think that this may bring everything into perspective. Values from the 80's may really be shocking, By the way, C3 did decrease in value as did any stamps that showed steady prices over the years. Values are in 2017 US dollars.


YEAR C13M C13U 14M C14U C15M C15U

1945 $169.71 $135.85 $373.58 $305.66 $475.46 $441.50
1959 $315.11 $210.07 $525.18 $336.12 $756.26 $630.22
1972 $731.23 $511.86 $1,169.97 $731.23 $1,901.20 $1,286.97
1977 $907.89 $504.38 $1,714.90 $807.01 $2,622.78 $1,311.39
1990 $467.72 $374.18 $1,309.62 $841.90 $1,964.42 $1,122.53
1991 $448.83 $359.07 $1,256.73 $807.90 $1,885.10 $1,077.20
2002 $339.81 $217.48 $679.61 $509.71 $1,087.38 $781.55
2004 $310.67 $207.11 $582.51 $485.42 $906.12 $744.32
2008 $283.93 $181.72 $596.25 $425.90 $851.79 $653.04
2009 $284.94 $182.36 $598.38 $427.42 $854.83 $655.37
2011 $228.28 $179.37 $500.05 $407.65 $652.24 $652.24
2016 $183.39 $168.11 $407.53 $382.06 $611.29 $611.29
2017 $190.00 $165.00 $375.00 $375.00 $575.00 $600.00



C13MNH C14MNH C15MNH

2002 $489.32 $985.44 $1,563.11
2008 $482.68 $1,022.15 $1,448.04
2009 $484.40 $1,025.80 $1,453.21
2011 $407.65 $869.65 $1,250.13
2017 $275.00 $400.00 $975.00


That was fun,

Tad

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angore

Collector, Moderator
30 May 2017
07:31:52am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I am sure the C13-C15 was a speculator buy meaning it was bought by non-collectors and now the market is correcting itself for this.

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51Studebaker

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30 May 2017
08:59:21am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I was surprised with the relative lack of movement for the ‘internet years’. Most collectibles saw significant value movement when the internet allowed collectors to easily connect with each other; I would have expected a large drop in catalog values for the period of 2000 to present.
Don

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(based upon copy5555 inflation adjusted values)


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In loving memory of Carol, my wife for 52 years.

30 May 2017
09:58:32am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

"I am sure the C13-C15 was a speculator buy meaning it was bought by non-collectors and now the market is correcting itself for this."

During that brief period when Zepps were in the $8-10K range for the most part the only people buying them were the speculators. They wandered from one table to the next asking only if you had a set of Zeppelins .... the regular customers for the most part stayed the course purchasing material that was familiar to them. A lot of new collectors entered the hobby during the mid 80's and floor traffic was always brisk...

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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
30 May 2017
10:34:34am

Approvals

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

One additional Scott valuation:

Scott Specialized 2005
(MH / U / MNH)
C13: 240 / 160 / 350
C14: 450 / 375 / 700
C15: 700 / 575 / 1050

Also Yvert & Tellier 2005:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
13: 300 / 300
14: 750 / 500
15: 1000 / 900

and Michel 2007:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
(C13): 250 / 180
(C14): 500 / 380
(C15): 850 / 650

and Michel 2015:
(Mint / Used, in euros)
(C13): 300 / 200
(C14): 550 / 400
(C15): 950 / 700

Surprising conclusion: contrary to what is usually thought, the valuation in the "domestic" specialized catalogue is lower than in foreign ones. Most of the time this is the other way around because of the higher demand.
A possible explanation is that a. Zeppelin stamps are popular worldwide and b. the USA Zeppelin stamps are especially iconic and a "must have" for every serious collector, just like for instance the Penny Black.

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51Studebaker

Dialysis, damned if you do...dead if you don't
30 May 2017
12:14:06pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Updated with additional years, all values adjusted for inflation to 2016 dollars. The 1979 values are spiking due to inflation, would love to see some 1980s catalog values if anyone has them.
Don

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michael78651

Moderator, MT Member
30 May 2017
12:58:22pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

All in all this shows that these stamps are not a good investment. Might as well use them for postage. Surprise

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30 May 2017
06:30:33pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I can add 1967 Scott values

C13 110.00 75.00
C14 180.00 110.00
C15 285.00 185.00

Roy

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51Studebaker

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30 May 2017
06:48:26pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Thanks Roy. Here is updated data now including chart with catalog values not adjusted for inflation for same time period
Don

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jthurd

30 May 2017
11:15:26pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Scott 1985 Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $450. Used $350.
C14 Mint $1,000. Used $650.
C15 Mint $1,650. Used 1,000.

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jthurd

30 May 2017
11:19:56pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1955 Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
C13 Mint $23.50 Used $20.
C14 Mint $45. Used $35.
C15 Mint $70. Used $60.

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jthurd

30 May 2017
11:21:51pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1966 Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $90. Used $60.
C14 Mint $150. Used $90.
C15 Mint $235. Used $150.

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jthurd

30 May 2017
11:27:45pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Correction perhaps needed for 1987 in values in graph above:
1987
Scott Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $350. Used $250. -- which are different from values in table above
C14 Mint $800. Used $550.
C15 Mint $1,300. Used $800.

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jthurd

30 May 2017
11:32:47pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

1948
Scott's Standard Postage Stamp Catalogue
USA
C13 Mint $18.50 Used $16.
C14 Mint $47.50 Used $35.
C15 Mint $70. Used $55.

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angore

Collector, Moderator
31 May 2017
07:54:52am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I can see the infomercial now....Zepplins are at record lows! It is time to acquire these before the price goes up!

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amsd

Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
31 May 2017
08:12:01am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

".Zepplins are at record lows! It is time to acquire these before the price goes up!"



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BenFranklin1902

Tom in Exton, PA
31 May 2017
09:42:38am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

"Might as well use them for postage. Surprise "



With the used values, it makes me wonder who actually did soak those off covers. I've seen ones for sale with corners of the stamped cachets on them. Can you imagine the person who ripped up flown covers... I don't collect covers but I need used ones to fill the spots in my album...

I bought mine on flown cover. Cheaper than mint and much more historic and interesting!

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HungaryForStamps

31 May 2017
05:23:35pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

They may be at record lows, however accounting for the 50% haircut that Scott catalog values took in the 80's to adjust to actual retail values rather than the fantasy values they had before, that may not be the real record. Note, some catalogs still carry that 100% markup - Michel for example. Thankfully Scott cut it despite complaints from the dealers.

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Jansimon

collector, seller, MT member
01 Jun 2017
08:32:04am

Approvals

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes, but you should note that Michel catalogue prices are not the same as actual selling prices. Most dealers who use Michel sell at a discount of 50% or more. Perhaps not that often for this type of stamps, but nevertheless.

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HungaryForStamps

01 Jun 2017
12:30:30pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

That is exactly my point. Scott at some point had the same methodology, not using selling prices. At some point, the CVs were revised to reflect actual retail value, so the 50% calculation was not required.

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philb

01 Jun 2017
05:18:30pm

Auctions

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

And yet some were paying in the $8 thousand range in the 80's..i hope they could afford it !David i have prices for chuck steak and gasoline from 1972 when my kids were small !

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amsd

Editor, Seal News; contributor, JuicyHeads
02 Jun 2017
08:39:48am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Phil, even carefully refrigerated, your 1972 chuck steak is not likely to be edible, much less appetizing, no matter the price. I'll pass.

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51Studebaker

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02 Jun 2017
09:09:25am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here is the 'set' trends
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I put all the info in a webpage here
http://www.stampsmarter.com/Learning/ZeppelinsCatalogTrends.html

Don

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philb

02 Jun 2017
02:45:30pm

Auctions

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Amsd i did not say i liked it..chuck steak was affordable...we were not up to London Broil yet !

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tooler

03 Mar 2018
06:15:15pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

No one has put a photo of these stamps we are talking about. These are mine.

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dani20

03 Mar 2018
07:12:26pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

If anyone has a set or singles available for trade (cat.val. for cat.val.) give me a shout. My area is generally the U.S.Classics period, but I would be interested in adding the Zeps if available.
Dan C.

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BenFranklin1902

Tom in Exton, PA
04 Mar 2018
12:19:27am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

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Since we're doing show and tell...
Here's mine! I said earlier in the thread that actual flown covers were cheaper than mint stamps and much more interesting. So these covers represent the series in my collection. I bought each of them separate, and waited until the right cover came along at the right price. There were many I lost to higher bidders too!



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dani20

04 Mar 2018
08:45:51am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Beautiful BenFranklin!
Dan C.

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pigdoc

04 Mar 2018
10:27:49am

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Yes, Tom, very nice!

I also have a zepp cover collection that fills a 1-inch 3-ring binder, but none franked with C13-C15. I do have C13 and C14 on piece, however.

I'm curious about the postal history of your 3 covers.

From Wikipedia:
"The 1930 Pan-American Flight...originated in Friedrichshafen on 18 May and stopped first in Seville before leaving Europe. The Graf Zeppelin arrived in Brazil first at Recife (Pernambuco) docking at Campo do Jiquiá on 22 May where it was greeted by a crowd of more than 15,000 before preceding on to Rio de Janeiro. The airship then flew back north to Lakehurst, NJ, before heading east over the Atlantic on 2 June to return to Germany with another stop in Seville."

Your 65c cover shows a Freidrichshafen receiver cancel of June 6, seeming to document a transit time in the range of 4 days, including the stop in Seville. Can you make out the date of the Brooklyn cancellation?

Your $1.30 cover is cancelled at Varick Station on the date of departure, June 2 (12 noon?) Cool!

However, your $2.60 cover is cancelled way back in April, suggesting that the sender was anticipating the flight, perhaps based on some announcement of the planning for it.

By the way, there is a marvelous video on YouTube documenting this (or a similar flight) of the Graf Zeppelin to South America. It's called "Flying Down to Rio" (1932) by Pathe News. It's a little hokey for its newsreel genre, but consists of remarkable, clear footage, nonetheless...

-Paul

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sleepy

04 Mar 2018
02:28:37pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

I just checked EBay for them. Fantastic variation in price....some very cheap and others over-priced.Applause

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uboatnut

07 Apr 2018
09:48:41pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

Here are the values (Scott default is for VF 80) from the 2014 and 2018 Scott US Specialized catalogues. Note how the GRADING changes the catalogue values (only 2014 included)Thinking.

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phos45

09 Apr 2018
09:02:00pm

re: C13-C15 Zeppelins

the zeppelin bladder was made from 10000 cow intestines

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