Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Discussion - Member to Member Sales - Research Center
Looking forward to your comments
Cathy
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for me, i prefer a light SON cancel that dates and IDs the location from which the stamp originated, preferably in contemporary usage. Occcasionally this is important, as when the US issued the new F rate vending machine stamp in Washington State a month prior to nationwide availability.
I don't mind uncancelled stamps
I do object to pen cancels, and keep them only until a better copy is available
David
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I collect Queen Victoria issues, so for many of those I have no choice but to get heavy obliterator cancels on my used stamps. However, as with Dave, I too would prefer to find a light cancel or a well placed SON cancel on my used stamps. I do collect different postmarks on stamps (e.g., different towns, treaty ports, foreign cancels, ship cancels, etc.).
Of course, for some stamps, used stamps carry a higher catalogue value than their mint twin, so that's added incentive to collect them (as if one more reason is needed, eh?).
Cheers,
Peter
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A simple one-word answer from me.
Gluestick.
One of my long-time favourite topics/discussions/gripes and I can simply say that if certain postal services of this world, and they know who they are, cannot cancel stamps as they should then they have to suffer the consequences.
I won't name names of the offenders or those nations that cancel just about each and every stamp perfectly but you will find out on your Stamp Collecting journey.
Sorry stampnut, I forgot.
Gluestick = re-use.
Londonbus1
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I agree with londonbus1, gluestick = reuse, The only time I use a purchased stamp is if the package has to be weighed prior to posting and I don't have enough of my own other than that I don't know when I purchased either a 1st or 2nd class postage stamp not even when sending large quantities of Christmas cards.
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A couple slight variations to the question:
1. How do you handle the general issue precancels or presorteds? I try to find copies that are actually cancelled in addition to the precancels, but with some of the newer presorted, bulk rate, non-profit, etc. varieties, they just don't seem to be available with cancels.
2. When looking for se-tenant strips or blocks, do you look only for complete and joined used copies, or do you find the individual stamps and just carefully place them together?
3. When solving the problem posed in #2 above, is soaking a complete set off of a FDC considered cheating? 
-Steve
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" How do you handle the general issue precancels or presorteds? I try to find copies that are actually cancelled in addition to the precancels, but with some of the newer presorted, bulk rate, non-profit, etc. varieties, they just don't seem to be available with cancels."
With the newer stamps I simply save the entire envelope, often with the contents. These very seldom get cancelled, but the envelope will get an address bar code, or other evidence of postal usage along the way. The contents may just be junk mail to us, but may be interesting to future generations.
I am currently collecting precancels on cover in my Franklin collection. It's pretty much prehistoric junk mail, but pretty hard to find.
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elk117..... a post after my own heart ! 
Sadly, the 3 subsequent posts lost their way a bit ! 
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Londonbus1, that is the story of my life!
-Steve
-aka GeoStamper
-aka Lost
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12:14:20pm
I do not knowingly use "uncancelled used stamps," but if the USPS continues to deliver mail to me with uncanceled postage, I may start to get the idea they are encouraging me to re-use the stamps. I just received another "decorated" envelope with very attractive commemoratives, with nary a mark of any kind on the stamps or the envelope. It seems that the mail sent to me with commemoratives either arrives mutilated or untouched, unless the sender has it hand canceled.
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"I just received another "decorated" envelope with very attractive commemoratives, with nary a mark of any kind on the stamps or the envelope. It seems that the mail sent to me with commemoratives either arrives mutilated or untouched, unless the sender has it hand canceled."
I've noticed that I get a lot of mail from stamp dealers decorated with a big array of older stamps. I guess postal clerks see this and know it's going to a stamp collector and don't want to be criticized for destroying the stamps so they err on the side of caution and don't cancel them at all. I'd rather get that than stamps with the Sharpie cancel. My peeve is that the stamps get snagged by the automatic sorting equipment and the faces get ripped.
Cancelled or uncancelled, I open the envelope carefully (I usually cut the end open with a scissor) and tuck it away. I don't know who will be wanting these oversize covers with stamps cancelled way past their time. Even if you soak them off, you still have stamps from decades ago with modern spray cancels, and today's cancel dates.
Dealers have always done this. I have covers in my Franklin collection with Columbian usage along with a one cent 1903 series Ben, used in 1908, 1912 and some way into the 1930s, with dealer corner cards. I passed up the opportunity to buy a cover that a dealer did in the 1930s that had 3 different pairs of private perfs on Scott 314 (the same Franklin issue). I wasn't going to pay $250 for it since it really didn't represent actual usage, just a philatelic favor cover.
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and since we're talking about reusing stamps, here's a story.
Back when I was a kid in the early 1970s my great uncle worked for a public utility. He was also one of those depression era stingy, waste nothing kind of guys. My father used to curse electric work he had done because if there was an extra half inch of wire, he'd cut it off and put it in his copper bin. Never mind who was going to have to change the fixture later on!
Anyway, he would take huge boxes full of the used envelopes that people had sent in with their bill. He would find all the uncanceled stamps, and soak them off for reuse. He even formulated his own glue that he would brush onto the back (a fairly sloppy job). Then he packed them up in envelopes and gave them to all the relatives. My grandmother was uneasy about using these. She'd just accept them from him (otherwise he'd argue) and throw them out. And every holiday when you got a card from him, it always was a free card he got from some charity, and had an 8 cent purple Eisenhower stamp on it was a glue smear!
Once he found out I was a stamp collector, he'd bring me these huge boxes of used envelopes to sort for stamps. I sorted out tons of commemoratives and even interesting older stamps off people's utility bill envelope. The only issue was that they all went through an automated opener and if the stamp was too close to the top, it would take the top of the stamp off. So there was a lot of waste.
I also saved a lot of these covers intact if they had interesting cancels. Some of them are in my NJ cover collection today!
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I treat it as a stamp 'in limbo'. Its not used (to a point) and it certainly isn't mint.
My own terminology 
Chimo
Bujutsu
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I have a question for the members here. I have this Cook Island stamp, Scott #112. The problem here is that the stamp does not have any gum. Now, how would you classify this stamp? Would it be an unused N/G or used, w/o a cancel. The CV in my Scott's 2009 edition lists it as $7.50 in mint condition, but at $15.00 in used condition. So, to be honest with a person wanting this in a trade, how would you best describe it??
This is why I call these stamps 'in limbo' 
Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you.
Chimo
Bujutsu
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To me, such stamps literally have no value except as fillers. As for trading/selling, I would ask the person who is interested in it to name his/her price (after disclosing its lack of gum, of course).
Bob
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"I treat it as a stamp 'in limbo'. Its not used (to a point) and it certainly isn't mint."
I'd call it a "mut".
Regarding an uncanceled stamp without gum... If the catalog states a value for unused no gum, that's a simple answer. When the catalog doesn't, AND the used value is higher than the unused, then you have to treat it as unused without gum. However, as Bob stated, the value is severely discounted due to the lack of gum. If the used value is lower than the unused value, then you treat the stamp as used. Many will not want a used stamp without a cancel on it, so the value of such a stamp may also have to be discounted like a used stamp canceled outside of its normal usage period.
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I only collect France and they have quite a few early precancelled stamps. I count them as mint if they have full gum and used if the gum is missing, indicating they have been soaked off a letter. Enclosed image are all regarded as used.
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Actually a US postage stamp that has been used but is not cancelled is no longer valid for postage. Attaching such a stamp with a glue stick is illegal. I was amazed when told this and called the main Post Office in Kansas City and a lady there confirmed it. Since then I sell my uncancelled US stamps that have no gum to others who are willing to violate this law for 50 cents on the dollar. Somehow I suspect though that no one has ever been prosecuted for this "offence".
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06:27:43pm
I'll bet any residents (or former residents) of some of the more humid areas of the US will have experienced the envelopes of once mint stamps fused by heat and moisture into a mess only separable through soaking. And, of course, once soaked, the otherwise unused stamps are sans gum. I once had a mint sheet album in storage at my mother's house in Texas and unbeknownst to me she moved the box in which it was housed into the garage: voila, over $500 face value of stamps welded tight to glassine interleaves! After soaking, I used up quite a few glue sticks before exhausting the gumless postage.
So I guess that begs the question, how would a postal inspector prosecute anyone for gluing stamps to an envelope when there is no proof that such usage was illegal? Of course they couldn't. So it really boils down to the honesty of the user of such stamps.
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A friend of mine in his late 50s has spent his entire working life in the stamp trade here in Vancouver, starting in high school. He insists that there are no laws or regulations in Canada that prohibit the postal use of unused/gumless Canadian stamps. Local dealers often ofter large lots of uncancelled Canadian stamps on paper in their weekly auctions.
Bob
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please note that John indicated that the US forbids the use of previously used US stamps for franking purposes. It is NOT illegal to use gum sticks.
I also understand that Canada does not specifically forbid this.
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08:09:21pm
I joined Stamporama last November and have enjoyed reading through the various threads. I am very appreciative of the vast knowledge within this wonderful group. I have decided to collect strictly used stamps after reading your comments and coming to the agreement that an unused stamp is "just a sticker until its done what it was meant to do"....no offence to those who collect mint. I have also read about the issue of stamps not being cancelled by the post office...even though they have done their job and have several of those as well. Being new at this hobby I really didn't give this issue any thought. It just meant that I had a beautiful unmarked used stamp to put in my collection. I know that I should do whatever makes me happy as this is my collection but what would you do? Do you personally prefer even a heavily cancelled stamp to one that has missed being marked? What do you do with those unmarked stamps? What about those marked by pen? Would you put them in your collection until you can find a better copy?
Looking forward to your comments
Cathy
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
for me, i prefer a light SON cancel that dates and IDs the location from which the stamp originated, preferably in contemporary usage. Occcasionally this is important, as when the US issued the new F rate vending machine stamp in Washington State a month prior to nationwide availability.
I don't mind uncancelled stamps
I do object to pen cancels, and keep them only until a better copy is available
David
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09:29:11pm
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I collect Queen Victoria issues, so for many of those I have no choice but to get heavy obliterator cancels on my used stamps. However, as with Dave, I too would prefer to find a light cancel or a well placed SON cancel on my used stamps. I do collect different postmarks on stamps (e.g., different towns, treaty ports, foreign cancels, ship cancels, etc.).
Of course, for some stamps, used stamps carry a higher catalogue value than their mint twin, so that's added incentive to collect them (as if one more reason is needed, eh?).
Cheers,
Peter
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
A simple one-word answer from me.
Gluestick.
One of my long-time favourite topics/discussions/gripes and I can simply say that if certain postal services of this world, and they know who they are, cannot cancel stamps as they should then they have to suffer the consequences.
I won't name names of the offenders or those nations that cancel just about each and every stamp perfectly but you will find out on your Stamp Collecting journey.
Sorry stampnut, I forgot.
Gluestick = re-use.
Londonbus1
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04:59:58am
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I agree with londonbus1, gluestick = reuse, The only time I use a purchased stamp is if the package has to be weighed prior to posting and I don't have enough of my own other than that I don't know when I purchased either a 1st or 2nd class postage stamp not even when sending large quantities of Christmas cards.
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
A couple slight variations to the question:
1. How do you handle the general issue precancels or presorteds? I try to find copies that are actually cancelled in addition to the precancels, but with some of the newer presorted, bulk rate, non-profit, etc. varieties, they just don't seem to be available with cancels.
2. When looking for se-tenant strips or blocks, do you look only for complete and joined used copies, or do you find the individual stamps and just carefully place them together?
3. When solving the problem posed in #2 above, is soaking a complete set off of a FDC considered cheating?
-Steve
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
" How do you handle the general issue precancels or presorteds? I try to find copies that are actually cancelled in addition to the precancels, but with some of the newer presorted, bulk rate, non-profit, etc. varieties, they just don't seem to be available with cancels."
With the newer stamps I simply save the entire envelope, often with the contents. These very seldom get cancelled, but the envelope will get an address bar code, or other evidence of postal usage along the way. The contents may just be junk mail to us, but may be interesting to future generations.
I am currently collecting precancels on cover in my Franklin collection. It's pretty much prehistoric junk mail, but pretty hard to find.
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
elk117..... a post after my own heart !
Sadly, the 3 subsequent posts lost their way a bit !
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
Londonbus1, that is the story of my life!
-Steve
-aka GeoStamper
-aka Lost
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
20 Jun 2015
12:14:20pm
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I do not knowingly use "uncancelled used stamps," but if the USPS continues to deliver mail to me with uncanceled postage, I may start to get the idea they are encouraging me to re-use the stamps. I just received another "decorated" envelope with very attractive commemoratives, with nary a mark of any kind on the stamps or the envelope. It seems that the mail sent to me with commemoratives either arrives mutilated or untouched, unless the sender has it hand canceled.
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
"I just received another "decorated" envelope with very attractive commemoratives, with nary a mark of any kind on the stamps or the envelope. It seems that the mail sent to me with commemoratives either arrives mutilated or untouched, unless the sender has it hand canceled."
I've noticed that I get a lot of mail from stamp dealers decorated with a big array of older stamps. I guess postal clerks see this and know it's going to a stamp collector and don't want to be criticized for destroying the stamps so they err on the side of caution and don't cancel them at all. I'd rather get that than stamps with the Sharpie cancel. My peeve is that the stamps get snagged by the automatic sorting equipment and the faces get ripped.
Cancelled or uncancelled, I open the envelope carefully (I usually cut the end open with a scissor) and tuck it away. I don't know who will be wanting these oversize covers with stamps cancelled way past their time. Even if you soak them off, you still have stamps from decades ago with modern spray cancels, and today's cancel dates.
Dealers have always done this. I have covers in my Franklin collection with Columbian usage along with a one cent 1903 series Ben, used in 1908, 1912 and some way into the 1930s, with dealer corner cards. I passed up the opportunity to buy a cover that a dealer did in the 1930s that had 3 different pairs of private perfs on Scott 314 (the same Franklin issue). I wasn't going to pay $250 for it since it really didn't represent actual usage, just a philatelic favor cover.
Login to Like
this post
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
and since we're talking about reusing stamps, here's a story.
Back when I was a kid in the early 1970s my great uncle worked for a public utility. He was also one of those depression era stingy, waste nothing kind of guys. My father used to curse electric work he had done because if there was an extra half inch of wire, he'd cut it off and put it in his copper bin. Never mind who was going to have to change the fixture later on!
Anyway, he would take huge boxes full of the used envelopes that people had sent in with their bill. He would find all the uncanceled stamps, and soak them off for reuse. He even formulated his own glue that he would brush onto the back (a fairly sloppy job). Then he packed them up in envelopes and gave them to all the relatives. My grandmother was uneasy about using these. She'd just accept them from him (otherwise he'd argue) and throw them out. And every holiday when you got a card from him, it always was a free card he got from some charity, and had an 8 cent purple Eisenhower stamp on it was a glue smear!
Once he found out I was a stamp collector, he'd bring me these huge boxes of used envelopes to sort for stamps. I sorted out tons of commemoratives and even interesting older stamps off people's utility bill envelope. The only issue was that they all went through an automated opener and if the stamp was too close to the top, it would take the top of the stamp off. So there was a lot of waste.
I also saved a lot of these covers intact if they had interesting cancels. Some of them are in my NJ cover collection today!
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I treat it as a stamp 'in limbo'. Its not used (to a point) and it certainly isn't mint.
My own terminology
Chimo
Bujutsu
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I have a question for the members here. I have this Cook Island stamp, Scott #112. The problem here is that the stamp does not have any gum. Now, how would you classify this stamp? Would it be an unused N/G or used, w/o a cancel. The CV in my Scott's 2009 edition lists it as $7.50 in mint condition, but at $15.00 in used condition. So, to be honest with a person wanting this in a trade, how would you best describe it??
This is why I call these stamps 'in limbo'
Please let me know your thoughts. Thank you.
Chimo
Bujutsu
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
To me, such stamps literally have no value except as fillers. As for trading/selling, I would ask the person who is interested in it to name his/her price (after disclosing its lack of gum, of course).
Bob
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03:28:01pm
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
"I treat it as a stamp 'in limbo'. Its not used (to a point) and it certainly isn't mint."
I'd call it a "mut".
Regarding an uncanceled stamp without gum... If the catalog states a value for unused no gum, that's a simple answer. When the catalog doesn't, AND the used value is higher than the unused, then you have to treat it as unused without gum. However, as Bob stated, the value is severely discounted due to the lack of gum. If the used value is lower than the unused value, then you treat the stamp as used. Many will not want a used stamp without a cancel on it, so the value of such a stamp may also have to be discounted like a used stamp canceled outside of its normal usage period.
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11:19:43am
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I only collect France and they have quite a few early precancelled stamps. I count them as mint if they have full gum and used if the gum is missing, indicating they have been soaked off a letter. Enclosed image are all regarded as used.
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
Actually a US postage stamp that has been used but is not cancelled is no longer valid for postage. Attaching such a stamp with a glue stick is illegal. I was amazed when told this and called the main Post Office in Kansas City and a lady there confirmed it. Since then I sell my uncancelled US stamps that have no gum to others who are willing to violate this law for 50 cents on the dollar. Somehow I suspect though that no one has ever been prosecuted for this "offence".
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They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. -Benjamin Franklin
30 Jun 2015
06:27:43pm
re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
I'll bet any residents (or former residents) of some of the more humid areas of the US will have experienced the envelopes of once mint stamps fused by heat and moisture into a mess only separable through soaking. And, of course, once soaked, the otherwise unused stamps are sans gum. I once had a mint sheet album in storage at my mother's house in Texas and unbeknownst to me she moved the box in which it was housed into the garage: voila, over $500 face value of stamps welded tight to glassine interleaves! After soaking, I used up quite a few glue sticks before exhausting the gumless postage.
So I guess that begs the question, how would a postal inspector prosecute anyone for gluing stamps to an envelope when there is no proof that such usage was illegal? Of course they couldn't. So it really boils down to the honesty of the user of such stamps.
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
A friend of mine in his late 50s has spent his entire working life in the stamp trade here in Vancouver, starting in high school. He insists that there are no laws or regulations in Canada that prohibit the postal use of unused/gumless Canadian stamps. Local dealers often ofter large lots of uncancelled Canadian stamps on paper in their weekly auctions.
Bob
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re: How do you treat an uncancelled used stamp?
please note that John indicated that the US forbids the use of previously used US stamps for franking purposes. It is NOT illegal to use gum sticks.
I also understand that Canada does not specifically forbid this.
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